Epic AAA Run-time test (low level only!)

[Beacon of Light]

Voltages were 1.19 for the Eiger #Subzero, 1.10 for the iTP A3 and .97 for the Eiger #0

 

[Beacon of Light]

Well I was asked to compile results since this was 4 pages (I have mine to show maximum amount of threads per page so I only see this thread as 2 pages) so here it is.

Ray S20 - 1 hour - ??v
Maratac (al) - < 8 hours -1.12v
LF2XT - < 8 hours - .97v
Fenix E01 - < 11 hours - .89v
Preon - < 11 hours -.91v
IlluminaTi (strobing slow) - < 11 hours - .91v
Maratac (cu) 17-20 hours - .86v
Preon 2 - 17-20 hours - .86v & .60v
Zebralight H50 - 20.5 hours - 1.10v
Eiger #0 - 24+ hours (ended test prematurely) - .97v
Eiger #Subzero - 24+ hours (ended test prematurely) - 1.19v
iTP A3 - 24+ hours (ended test prematurely) - 1.10v

 

[Darvis]

Beacon, this is great! I'm really thinking I need an Eiger subzero now. I was on the cusp as the #1's have been doing me fine, but this has me convinced.

 

[scout24]

Beacon- :twothumbs I've always been curious about the performance of rechargables, much appreciated!!! :goodjob:

 

[mcnair55]

Thanks for your efforts from Bill in the UK,glad to see my every day EDC the A3 EOS doing so well.

 

[Darvis]

I was just looking through some of the runtimes on this test and then going back over my notes for when I was getting ready to order my set of #1 Eigers. I had used the data that Curt had posted on RMSK and calculated runtimes based on using a 1.2v Eneloop AAA.

My math showed the #1 running 13hrs to 50% @ an average of 5.25 lumens

Annnndddd: The #0 running 18hrs to 50% @ an average of 3 lumens: This appears to be pretty close to when the #0 in your test started to look much dimmer.

That said, I ran the numbers on the AA's (El Caps) and found that a #2 would run 23hrs to 50%, the #1 would do 38hrs and the #0 would do 53hrs @ 12, 8, and 3 lumens respectively.

I add that in as I think the VCE Arc AA adapter would yeild the longer runtimes with the Eiger heads...

Man, I love these low level runtime tests!

 

[Beacon of Light]

What I didn't mention is I redid the entire test and still saw some flakey results with the LF2XT dying quickly again but the voltage was higher this time, same with the Maratacs not reaching near their 50 hour runtime, and the odd thing is the iTP sort of kicked the Maratacs *** both times. I basically started the 2nd retest at Midnight Saturday evening/Sunday morning. The iTP was still on last night at 2AM before I went to bed. At 7am it was flashing, while the Maratacs were off completely by 7pm the night before.

The Preon was disappointing being off before reaching 12 hours, the Preon 2 lasted a bit longer, the Fenix E01 is either a dud or coincidently gets the funky cells both times as it was also off within 12 hours.

The H50 with AAA cell lasted about the same as the first time 20-21 hours before it shut off. It would power up though surprisingly enough and stay lit. I believe it had 1.19v but don't quote me.

After these frustrating results I decided to do a refresh cycle on the Duraloops with 2 of my Lacrosse chargers. I will do another test but won't spend the time posting here especially if I still get funky results. I may post the conclusion though like this time.

I may only test the lights that are not making sense, like the Preon (unless these really only get about 11 hours instead of the 22 hours they are supposed to get), the Maratac falling well short of half their advertised runtime on low, which is odd as the iTP is at least resembling it's advertised runtime on low, and it is odd that the iTP and Maratacs aren't performing similarly based on reports they are the same lights manufactured by iTP with just cosmetic differences in knurling etc, the LF2XT should be running near a week and I can't get it to get past 12 hours even, and the Fenix E01, where 11 hours is a stretch and scout24 got over 100 hours with the thing.

The Eigers were the longest running though even in this flakey test. They were both still running this morning but the #0 was pretty dim, while the #Subzero still looked brighter at 7am than the #0 looked at 7pm last evening.

I also ordered 2 Maha C9000 Wizard One chargers from Thomas Distributing, so I will see if using that charger may help cycling these batteries to obtain more consistent results. If after cycling with both Lacrosse and the Wizard One and if I STILL get flakey results, it would mean either the batteries are trash, or the manufacturers are making crap up with runtimes on low. If the latter I will go ballistic!!!

 

[Darvis]

Beacon, I have a few E01's, a preon and a a few #1 peaks. Just to corroborate what you're seeing, I'll run a refresh on some eneloops and run an unofficial runtime test on those units. I have quark, so I'll use the moonlight as a check. I can't upload pictures for some reason, but will keep track of what I see, etc. I'll get that rolling tomorrow after i charge up the eneloops.

 

[crizyal]

I wanted to express my gratitude for your efforts here. :thumbsup: Even with hiccups you have incountered, I find this very interesting. I have most of the lights you are testing in group A, and have always wondered if the low runtimes were accurate. I am also glad to see the Duraloops being used, as that is my primary power source for these lights with the exception of the LF2XT which I use Li-Ion. I wil continue to follow this thread with great interest.

 

[Beacon of Light]

I also took off 4 Duraloops that completed the refresh cycle. Since that involved it charging to full and then doing a slower discharge and charge and discharge repeatedly till it was optimized, that should have formed the batteries properly, effectively getting them broken in correct? They all read 800+ mAh so they should be good to go correct? I will test the problem lights and see if their results change. I'm most interested in the E01, Maratacs, Preons and the LF2XT since they seem so off from what they are "supposed" to be able to do on low mode. The other 4 Duraloops are still being refreshed and I am at work now but they should also be done when I return later tonight.

 

[Darvis]

Beacon,

At 4:30 pm ET, I had 4 refreshed eneloops reading 1.46 volts off the charger @ 800+ mah each

I fired up the following:

Fenix E01
Peak Eiger #1 Luxeon
Peak Eiger #1 XP-G
Ti Preon on low
Quark on moonlight for comparison

I'm doing this to see if I at least get similar results on the E01 and Preon as you did with the same batteries. The Peaks are for kicks, but it will be interesting to see how the Luxeon does vs. the Cree.

Will keep you posted

 

[Zendude]

I also took off 4 Duraloops that completed the refresh cycle. Since that involved it charging to full and then doing a slower discharge and charge and discharge repeatedly till it was optimized, that should have formed the batteries properly, effectively getting them broken in correct? They all read 800+ mAh so they should be good to go correct? I will test the problem lights and see if their results change. I'm most interested in the E01, Maratacs, Preons and the LF2XT since they seem so off from what they are "supposed" to be able to do on low mode. The other 4 Duraloops are still being refreshed and I am at work now but they should also be done when I return later tonight.

I too, want to say thanks for doing this.:twothumbs

I think part of the discrepancy is est. runtime for some of those lights are based on Alkies(which I believe are rated at ~1200mAh).

 

[defloyd77]

I think part of the discrepancy is est. runtime for some of those lights are based on Alkies(which I believe are rated at ~1200mAh).

This is exactly right. The E01, which you got 11 hours from sounds textbook for NiMH, if you want those insane moon mode runtimes, you have to do alkaline, NiMH and lithiums will give you better sun mode, but then drop like a brick. The simple sad fact is, your results reflect exactly what I thought was going to happen and why I don't give lights like the iTP much credit when they boast these ludicrous "50 hour" runtimes. I don't at all feel your tests were flawed due to the Duraloops, between your 2 tests, the numbers look consistent, I don't think you did anything wrong here.

I think the lessons to be learned, don't believe in stated runtimes, simplicity reigns supreme (the simple 1 mode unregulated Eigers) and although they suck in high drain applications, alkalines are going to give you really huge runtime numbers in lights such as these.

Thanks for doing these tests and also for your part in bringing the #0 and Sub Zero into the flashaholic world.

Now, where's that Mortal Kombat guy? "Sub Zero wins. Flawless victory."

 

[Beacon of Light]

The Duraloops I took off tonight were at 1.49v 868mAh/1.49v 861mAh/1.48v 833mAh so I will try these in the E01 with ther 833mAh and the 861 and 868 in the 2 Maratacs.

Beacon,

At 4:30 pm ET, I had 4 refreshed eneloops reading 1.46 volts off the charger @ 800+ mah each

I fired up the following:

Fenix E01
Peak Eiger #1 Luxeon
Peak Eiger #1 XP-G
Ti Preon on low
Quark on moonlight for comparison

I'm doing this to see if I at least get similar results on the E01 and Preon as you did with the same batteries. The Peaks are for kicks, but it will be interesting to see how the Luxeon does vs. the Cree.

Will keep you posted

 

[Beacon of Light]

I guess the alkie vs NiMH is the area I overlooked. I didn't realize alkaline AAAs were rated at 1200mAh. That would explain the extra runtimes then. I thought it was odd though as I thought NiMH had longer runtimes in general at least for AA lights, but maybe that applies to high modes which would make sense as high modes are high drain and that is where NiMh batteries should excell.

I think I will let the Eigers both go until they die so I can get an idea of total runtime before failure. Very impressed that they are the runtime leaders so far.

This is exactly right. The E01, which you got 11 hours from sounds textbook for NiMH, if you want those insane moon mode runtimes, you have to do alkaline, NiMH and lithiums will give you better sun mode, but then drop like a brick. The simple sad fact is, your results reflect exactly what I thought was going to happen and why I don't give lights like the iTP much credit when they boast these ludicrous "50 hour" runtimes. I don't at all feel your tests were flawed due to the Duraloops, between your 2 tests, the numbers look consistent, I don't think you did anything wrong here.

I think the lessons to be learned, don't believe in stated runtimes, simplicity reigns supreme (the simple 1 mode unregulated Eigers) and although they suck in high drain applications, alkalines are going to give you really huge runtime numbers in lights such as these.

Thanks for doing these tests and also for your part in bringing the #0 and Sub Zero into the flashaholic world.

Now, where's that Mortal Kombat guy? "Sub Zero wins. Flawless victory."

 

[wyager]

simplicity reigns supreme (the simple 1 mode unregulated Eigers)

One particularly important reason for this is that a PWM regulation microcontroller sucks anywhere from 6-10mA most of the time (that's with an ideal picoPower AVR, which are essentially the most efficient at 8mhz. If they're using a different micro at high speeds, it could suck even more.). As I said, depending on the design it could suck even more than that. That means that it's sucking as much as the LED, maybe more, on low mode. With the peak, you don't have to worry about that as it's only 1 mode, linear regulated (or not regulated at all?).

 

[Beacon of Light]

This give me reason to want an Ultra Low dedicated light even further. One of the reasons I have several E01s were based on the fact it gives 11 sun and 10 moon mode hours. I guess I recharge batteries more frequently to never get to moon mode in that light, so I never noticed until this test it just dies on NiMH before it ever gets to moon mode (that's disappointing in itself). I like the Eigers and how they slowly dim, which is what I was expecting from the E01.

The E01, which you got 11 hours from sounds textbook for NiMH, if you want those insane moon mode runtimes, you have to do alkaline, NiMH and lithiums will give you better sun mode, but then drop like a brick.

 

[Sir Lightalot]

Ya, the LF2XT seems off as Im pretty sure that someone tested the preceding LF2x and got 2 weeks or something crazy like that. But it was probably with alkies. At theses low drive currents, they would prevail.

Also the FUI of the LF2XT defaults at 1% low not .2%. It looked like minimum from the pics though so its probably good.

PS, If you haven't changed it yet low voltage cutoff on the LF2XT is 4C+H.

 

[Darvis]

This has been extremely educational. I had never really considered the different discharge curves between the types of batteries before, as well, and had always thought I wanted heavily regulated lights-but that's not the case anymore.

It's not to say I'll stop using NIMH, no way! It's just that I'll make sure to have a healthy supply of lithium primaries on hand for the times when I may need light for a loooonnng time without any surprises. I'll keep some alkaleaks around as well since these are not high drain lights...

This also endears my peaks to me even more... I now have a valiant concepts Arc AA conversion body enroute for really insane runtimes and I'm glad to have scored some of the last Matterhorns from RMSK! I'll be ordering me a pair of those Eiger/Beacon specials as well (subzero!!!)

Anyhow, 5 hours into my runtime test and all 4 lights are holding steady. The 2 peaks are at simlilar brightness levels to each other and both the E01 and Preon are looking good. Not much has changed at this point.

One last thing to mention, not one of the lights is even the slightest bit warm to the touch, even after 5 hours of continuous on....

 

[Beacon of Light]

yeah the only one out of the lights that got incredibly hot was the Ray S20, but that thing is putting out like 180 lumens or something crazy from a single AAA. I told them if they made that light with a moon mode instead of 180 lumens I'd buy it, or at least a 2 mode moon/low or medium