fear from airport sec is overrated ...

[wyager]

are you talking from personal experience or from something else????

cuz to me sounds like from somewhere else.

I'm talking from personal experience... it's not that I've shot a gun in a plane, but I've had the experience of
A)watching mythbusters
B)shooting various calibers through various objects
C)internet research on the subject
D)decent knowledge of firearms

And where, exactly, are you speaking from?

 

[WDG]

...too many bureaucrats and not enough seasoned LEOs and firearms professionals had their hands in the forging of the regulations...

Ain't that always the way it goes? :shakehead

 

[RedLED]

Did it crack the sidewalk? 😀



Do they allow monopods & tripods in carry-on again? It's been a while since I've flown (prefer driving.) With the head removed, my tripod fits nicely into carry-on. Bogen geared head... that'd hurt, too!

Before 9/11, I carried a Spyderco Delica II as my small-enough-for-air-travel knife. So much for that.

Tile was cracked, and yes you may take a mono pod. At least for now.

 

[fyrstormer]

Such utility knives were all that were needed to take down multiple planes on 9-11-2001.

Incorrect. The planes were brought down by a combination of assailants with utility knives, and passengers who believed the best thing to do was sit tight, wait for the plane to land wherever it was being taken to, and wait for the local authorities to come rescue them. Every hijacking before 9/11 had ended that way. Do you really think nowadays an entire plane full of people would sit calmly and wait to find out if they're about to become part of a terrorist weapon? Not bloody likely.

 

[Connor]

Do you really think nowadays an entire plane full of people would sit calmly and wait to find out if they're about to become part of a terrorist weapon? Not bloody likely.

I think it's very likely.
People are people and they do what >99% of the other people do in an extreme situation: Waiting for someone else to do something while trying not to attract attention to themselves.

Don't get me wrong, I would definitely like it to be different, but if you read up on group dynamics you will see that there is little to no reason to expect it will be as you said.

 

[SureAddicted]

Incorrect. The planes were brought down by a combination of assailants with utility knives, and passengers who believed the best thing to do was sit tight, wait for the plane to land wherever it was being taken to, and wait for the local authorities to come rescue them. Every hijacking before 9/11 had ended that way. Do you really think nowadays an entire plane full of people would sit calmly and wait to find out if they're about to become part of a terrorist weapon? Not bloody likely.

It's wrong to assume that, you need to look at the bigger picture. A lot of people haven't been in a situation like that, neither have you by the sound of it. You just don't know what emotion is going to arise in a situation like that, you could clam up into a shell, break down, pass out, scared, confused etc. Unless you've been in a situation like that, you just don't know what to expect.
There is the exception of the people overcoming the BG's on 9/11, where the plane did not make it's destination, but, you have to ask yourself how many people died in the process before the plane was brought down.

 

[alpg88]

I'm talking from personal experience... it's not that I've shot a gun in a plane, but I've had the experience of
A)watching mythbusters
B)shooting various calibers through various objects
C)internet research on the subject
D)decent knowledge of firearms

And where, exactly, are you speaking from?

thanks, you made my day, not only mine, my entire shop is laughing at this.
tv, internet, lmao.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

thanks, you made my day, not only mine, my entire shop is laughing at this.
tv, internet, lmao.

It is easy to make fun of ones posts, and be disrespectful, but such behavior usually escalates and becomes disruptive to the thread, and other CPF'ers.

Bill

 

[wyager]

thanks, you made my day, not only mine, my entire shop is laughing at this.
tv, internet, lmao.

Pardon me? Are you an airplane designer or an air martial? Are you implying that TV or the internet aren't valid sources of information? How about you tell me what experience you have on the subject that apparently disqualifies you from having to answer my questions.... The fact that you are in a "shop" doesn't exactly suggest that you have any sort of knowledge about planes, guns, or anything related to the conversation, so forgive me if I don't give your opinion much weight.

It is easy to make fun of ones posts, and be disrespectful, but such behavior usually escalates and becomes disruptive to the thread, and other CPF'ers.

Bill

exactly... I'm trying not to get mad at him for posting an uneducated opinion and then responding with a smiley and a poorly thought out insult...

Please, alpg88, enlighten us as to why you are correct. I'm all ears.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

Pardon me? Are you an airplane designer or an air martial? Are you implying that TV or the internet aren't valid sources of information? How about you tell me what experience you have on the subject that apparently disqualifies you from having to answer my questions.... The fact that you are in a "shop" doesn't exactly suggest that you have any sort of knowledge about planes, guns, or anything related to the conversation, so forgive me if I don't give your opinion much weight.




exactly... I'm trying not to get mad at him for posting an uneducated opinion and then responding with a smiley and a poorly thought out insult...

Please, alpg88, enlighten us as to why you are correct. I'm all ears.

I do not think that other people following this thread are going to be interested in your argument with alpg88, and visa versa, particularly if the argument becomes heated. Best you continue this with PM's. You and alpg88 do not need to take over this thread, which will probably result in more flaming and baiting. See 4. Flaming/Baiting/Trolling/Banning

Bill

 

[wyager]

I do not think that other people following this thread are going to be interested in your argument with alpg88, and visa versa, particularly if the argument becomes heated. Best you continue this with PM's. You and alpg88 do not need to take over this thread, which will probably result in more flaming and baiting. See 4. Flaming/Baiting/Trolling/Banning

Bill

I'm just wondering where alpg88 gets his info. So far all he's done is post something that seems wrong and then insult me, so I'm curious as to what he's basing his opinions on. I think it's certainly related to this thread, it is after all about airport security.

 

[Akubra]

Years ago, a prisoner on an international flight was given a metal butter knife during his meal. The officer escorting him thought nothing of it . . . Until the prisoner took one of the stewardesses hostage with it. Held it to her neck. (Even a blunt metal knife can do damage if pushed into the soft portion of a person's neck. The stand-off lasted several hours.)

I recall at the time that the issue of blunt airline cutlery was a topic of debate among readers of both Tacticak Knives, and Fighting Knives magazine. (Right before FK went under.) That incident put the debate to rest.

Yeah, I know that that metal airline cutlery can be dangerous. And that`s what I meant actually - TSA doesn`t allow you to bring knives, but airlines provide you with them (although a blunt variety) as well as a nice fork.......... . Pure irony.

 

[flasherByNight]

*shrug, you can pick up a steak knife at any restaurant after security...or bigger I'm sure with some finessing.

 

[fyrstormer]

It's wrong to assume that, you need to look at the bigger picture. A lot of people haven't been in a situation like that, neither have you by the sound of it. You just don't know what emotion is going to arise in a situation like that, you could clam up into a shell, break down, pass out, scared, confused etc. Unless you've been in a situation like that, you just don't know what to expect.
There is the exception of the people overcoming the BG's on 9/11, where the plane did not make it's destination, but, you have to ask yourself how many people died in the process before the plane was brought down.

The point is, now that people know it's entirely likely they will die in a fiery crash, killing hundreds of other people along with them, they will more seriously consider the option of beating the crap out of the attackers in order to prevent that. They didn't have AK47's, they had razorblades. I've been sliced by a razorblade before, and not lightly. It hurts like hell, but if I thought I was going to die anyway, it wouldn't be an effective deterrent.

In an airplane with 100 people on it, 90 of them can be sheep and the remaining 10 will still be able to do some good. We already know this is the case from the attempted bombings of airliners since 9/11: in each case, as soon as it became apparent that someone was intending to attack, the passengers quickly "restrained" them. The only reason anything happened at all is because the attackers didn't try to hijack the plane, so there was no show of force prior to them using whatever weapon they'd smuggled onboard.

 

[Illum]

They will normally confiscate anything they think is prohibited or dangerous.

Consider yourself lucky you didn't lose the Lady.

I've had pens and my personal eating fork confiscated from me. I'm not entirely sure how you managed to pull that off but I wouldn't try it again😗

I think it's very likely.
People are people and they do what >99% of the other people do in an extreme situation: Waiting for someone else to do something while trying not to attract attention to themselves.

this is true, but is only true when individuals are confident there is another way for them to act which could minimize personal injury. In a hijack situation, its all or nothing... and the cornered mouse will attack the cat.

 

[Kindle]

Once while going through security in Charlotte NC the screener asked me if I had a knife in my carry on. Confused by the question I of course answered "no".

When I arrived at my destination I realized that I actually had 3 knives in the bag (a Ka-Bar, Western G-46-8 & a Gerber BMF) that I had completely forgotten to put in my seabag.

I have no idea why he didn't hand search the bag...maybe it was because it was a scarlet & gold USMC duffel.

But that was a long time ago.

 

[Monocrom]

I have no idea why he didn't hand search the bag...maybe it was because it was a scarlet & gold USMC duffel.

But that was a long time ago.

Nowadays, those types of bags get you singled out for extra scrutiny. As does any bag belonging to any American soldier.

It's disgusting how bags belonging to them get searched extra carefully. If that was done to everyone of middle eastern descent, the ACLU would be screaming their heads off about civil rights violations and profiling. :thumbsdow

 

[wyager]

Nowadays, those types of bags get you singled out for extra scrutiny. As does any bag belonging to any American soldier.

It's disgusting how bags belonging to them get searched extra carefully. If that was done to everyone of middle eastern descent, the ACLU would be screaming their heads off about civil rights violations and profiling. :thumbsdow

I personally have no problem with profiling, if they have research to back it up :shrug:
But I don't think there's any research to suggest that soldiers are more likely to hijack a plane... 😕

I would gladly wait extra time if it ACTUALLY helped keep the plane secure. All the crap we put up with nowadays clearly isn't very effective. I mean, come on, they put 3 year old kids through intensive screening because they have a similar name to a terrorist. I think it would be more effective to screen the guy wearing a turban and carrying only a Qur'an on the plane... (I'm looking at you, shoe bomber). :shrug:
But of course, the moment that guy turns out to be innocent the airline companies get their pants sued off.

 

[ejot]

I had my carry-on hand-searched at 2 of 3 checkpoints on an international flight with no problem. Got home and found a Leatherman Micra that I'd accidentally left in it.




Good job, guys. :thumbsup: 🙄

 

[Monocrom]

I personally have no problem with profiling, if they have research to back it up :shrug:
But I don't think there's any research to suggest that soldiers are more likely to hijack a plane... 😕

Nothing to do with research. It's all about hatred. Certain politicians with far too much power who literally hate the military, and are afraid of those who have both the inner desire and the outer strength to serve their nation. They believe that just because a soldier is trained to kill, then that means he's automatically a killing machine. And those politicians are afraid of that. It's like saying any woman can choose to be a "working girl," just because she was born with certain body parts.

It's a ridiculous thought process. But it's the same one behind why soldiers, and their bags, are specifically singled out at airports.