First time posting in Years and so disappointed to see manufacturers/influencers claim Turbo as the ratings

KITROBASKIN

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+

Most high performance things state their highest ratings.
Take a new American muscle car, it'll state & advertise 600hp / 0~60 of like 4.5sec. and can go 160 mph
These are the max it can do all full RPMs' and is not how you drive normally.

1lumen was listed, look at the runtimes for flat regulation on High,,
you'll find lights that'll do 1800lm for 2hrs on a 26650 or 21700. That's important.


Really don't have an issue listing what an emitter can do,, back to the car analogy.
It is disgusting to see the hype and misleading implied performance. Yet we are faced with this frequently in advertising. Not sure this outrage rises to the level of regulatory reform. As individuals, we can help point out hype and suggest companies that treat customers with accuracy and respect.
 

LRJ88

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I get a white screen, for whatever that is. But let's say that you have 2.5Wh (around what you get from good Eneloops). Unless my math is way off, three hours at 900 lumens, assuming about 75% OTF, and zero switching losses, would require a 1400+lm/W LED. High capacity NIMH would be more like 1100-1200lm/W, and Lithium about 900lm/W.

White LEDs as we know them (blue+phosphors) can't get close to those numbers, even if absolutely perfected.


Does this work then?
 

orbital

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It is disgusting to see the hype and misleading implied performance. Yet we are faced with this frequently in advertising. Not sure this outrage rises to the level of regulatory reform. As individuals, we can help point out hype and suggest companies that treat customers with accuracy and respect.
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Think we got our signal crossed.
What if that car I mentioned has that performance or more.

Companies state what they've worked hard to produce, I would.
Every product lists the max it can do.

(not talking about crappy 18650 batteries stating 7000mAh)
 

Stress_Test

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Speaking of car HP ratings, Ford caused a big stink (I think they got sued) with the Mustang Cobra back sometime in the late 90s I think. The cars were found to not produce anywhere near the advertised power rating. I assume it was discovered by enthusiasts who were putting their Cobras on dynos and finding out something seemed off, even accounting for powertrain loss.

With flashlights, probably 99.999% of consumers won't notice or care about the hyped performance vs the real-world performance of any particular light. And it's not exactly easy to test, either. Other than some hardcore CPF nerds!! :LOL:
 

letschat7

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Would that be this?

A4E90461-C980-4983-8559-5B83298EE096.jpeg
 

dc38

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A do all light would be awesome...HCRI with full spectrum including reds and blues, turbo burst at 500lm for 2s ramping down to 250lm with 5kcd @ 3 hrs, collimated lens with decent flooding, low mode of 8lm @100hrs, mid mode of 80lm at 1kcd @8 hrs...seems feasible to me.
 

KITROBASKIN

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How nice to see dc38 on the forum!

Yeah orbital, my gripe is the claim of such and such turbo lumens AND it lasts for 50 minutes or something. No disclosure that the standard allows decreasing output to a certain level while on max.

I do use the hot outputs for a couple seconds a few times every night when checking dog locations, yet prefer to keep lumens low for situational awareness (pupils as open as possible)...

We live about 7,000 feet in altitude. What a car performs at sea level is not what we will see. (An electric car should, though)
 

KITROBASKIN

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OK, Imalent flashlights first came on candlepowerforums with some bold claims about the brightness of their flashlights. I never really looked at them but just saw a President´s Day sale they posted here. Many of their flashlights are sold out, perhaps over half, but I did click on a compact number.

What do you think about the way they handle their claims for this flashlight?


IMALENT
Product CodeLD70
LED Type1 pieces of American CREE XHP70 2nd LED
Batteries Required1x Built in 1100mAh 18350 Li-ion battery
Luminous FluxUp To 4000 Lumens
Run TimeUp To 15h
Intensity10350cd (Max.)
Distance203m (Max.)
Operating ModesTurbo / High / Middle / Middle Low / Low
Output and RuntimeTurbo output : Turbo: 4000 -900 Lumens (1+38min)
High output: 2000-900 Lumens (1.5+39 mins)
Middle output: 900 Lumens (45min)
Middle low output: 200 Lumens (3H50min)
Low output: 20 Lumens (15H)
 

Stress_Test

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Me, I'd call that a 900 lumen light that has a 4000 lumen burst mode.

It would take a fairly savvy consumer to realize those specs mean it only goes for 1 min and 1.5 min on Turbo or High, then after that it runs at 900.

Calling ~1 minute of runtime a "mode" is a bit of a stretch in my mind....

But jeez, if it really can run at 900 lumens for 45 minutes, that alone is impressive; people have just gotten spoiled nowadays! ( git off mah lawn! )
 

idleprocess

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What do you think about the way they handle their claims for this flashlight?
I'm OK with the table, but I've read more than a few spec sheets, seen many runtime graphs, and operated several flashlights with thermal/timed stepdown. My deduction for both Turbo and High runtime values is that they hit the time limit once, step/dim down to Middle, then the light extinguishes after the cell is depleted.
 

dc38

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How nice to see dc38 on the forum!
Thanks! It's been a while...my internal battery is still chugging along lol.

Burst modes realistically should last no longer than 20 seconds with a smooth rampdown IMHO, as bursts are usually meant for blinding or momentary illumination for flooding stuff...or signaling for that matter. Personally I'd like to see one with the burst at 2 seconds with a quick but smooth ramp down to a sustainable high mode lol.

Maybe include a programmable option where 10 quick half presses puts it into "burst only mode" for morse signaling and whatnot
 
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letschat7

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🍿ie watching for updates
Right now trying to resolve issues regarding corrosion in the tailcap and threads. When I can get to the shop I'm going to try to use these rubber strap tools to open it up.

The head is mostly fine and with the polymer tube on the inside most of the body is fine too. Worse comes to worse I may have to load the batteries from the top.

I really liked the style and ergonomics of the neck area as it fits nicely in the hand. That said it is very weak in power and nearly useless. I once gave it to a friend who had seen my LED Lenser F1 and he wanted his own flashlight. He returned it some time later saying he felt prepared having it and put it in his car, then needed it and it had no light. Then I gave it to another friend and it was in with some junk he was scrapping years later. He never felt it was worth keeping so it is back again. I lost a Suprabeam that was bright with his friends once. This they won't even steal. lol

CE999E78-5AD2-4368-BD7C-7CD653DC506F.jpeg


3380D354-E5E9-42DA-ADF7-02A046675C4C.jpeg
 

defloyd77

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Honestly I have no problems with the idea of turbo modes. I know what they are and what to look for and most folks here should too, so it's no big deal to me. Some companies do give specifics as to how long turbo mode runs and what output it steps down to and how long it runs at that output.

Honestly though, I think ANSI FL1's implementation is responsible for this trend though. Companies figure figure "Okay, we now have this badge to confirm we're being honest, how can we take advantage of that?" "Well sir, if we can maintain a high output for 31 seconds we can use that number and we can advertise a longer runtime if we drop it just above 10 percent and keep it there."
 

turbodog

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A do all light would be awesome...HCRI with full spectrum including reds and blues, turbo burst at 500lm for 2s ramping down to 250lm with 5kcd @ 3 hrs, collimated lens with decent flooding, low mode of 8lm @100hrs, mid mode of 80lm at 1kcd @8 hrs...seems feasible to me.

I think you just described a HID light. I had some light & motion bike lights that were very close to this spec.
 

DonnyD

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I've been away from CFP for 5 years or so, and haven't kept up like before. It seems like progress has slowed, or stalled. The turbo hype is rampant, looks silly for the pro light class, Luminus LEDs are filling in for Cree. WTH? My Fenix HP25R V1, now several years old, feels alone and lonely, holding 1000 lumens. I returned, interested to see progress and what design changes had come with it, and found little.

Cree's website shows a timeline of milestones, with the last mentioned LED advance around 2018. After that, they feature progress in horticultural lighting. Sounds like they're focused on spectrum analysis for boosting plant growth rather than achieving new efficiency standards.

Any thoughts?
 

turbodog

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I've been away from CFP for 5 years or so, and haven't kept up like before. It seems like progress has slowed, or stalled. The turbo hype is rampant, looks silly for the pro light class, Luminus LEDs are filling in for Cree. WTH? My Fenix HP25R V1, now several years old, feels alone and lonely, holding 1000 lumens. I returned, interested to see progress and what design changes had come with it, and found little.

Cree's website shows a timeline of milestones, with the last mentioned LED advance around 2018. After that, they feature progress in horticultural lighting. Sounds like they're focused on spectrum analysis for boosting plant growth rather than achieving new efficiency standards.

Any thoughts?

Diminishing returns... was going to happen. We are talking about something that's been in sustained r&d for >20 years.

We started with 20(?) lumens on 1x123 years ago.

A fair question would be 1) are the leds overdriven or 2) are we running headlong into thermal limitations?
 

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