Fossil or renewable. What is the future?

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
Here we go, fixit spreading his FUD again.
Gaslighting and browbeating.

There's too many rational, free thinking individuals here. Why not out grow your narcissism and accept truths and realities?
Join us.
You might even like it?

Further to that I'll call you out as being a climate criminal. Peddling your false messiahs of said to be eco friendly batteries, solar panels and so on. Your advocation of poisoning the planet is abhorrent. I bet you're not even a real vegan!

Now when you've released yourself from your wicked ways of the modern technology that is killing our planet, come back to us with your new decree scribed in your mud hut onto a piece of bark.
You are delusional. The energy transition will happen. You will wind up with stranded assets. See what is really happening. It is not as bad as you think. Salt batteries are being used right now. Technology is changing so fast you obviously can't keep up. Electric cars are already at parody with gas. Cheaper to run and buy. What are you crying about? https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-solutions/2024/03/18/electric-vehicle-price-drop/
 

Sjvalleydave

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Feb 16, 2023
Messages
33
Location
Caruthers. CA
Here we go, fixit spreading his FUD again.
Gaslighting and browbeating.

There's too many rational, free thinking individuals here. Why not out grow your narcissism and accept truths and realities?
Join us.
You might even like it?

Further to that I'll call you out as being a climate criminal. Peddling your false messiahs of said to be eco friendly batteries, solar panels and so on. Your advocation of poisoning the planet is abhorrent. I bet you're not even a real vegan!

Now when you've released yourself from your wicked ways of the modern technology that is killing our planet, come back to us with your new decree scribed in your mud hut onto a piece of bark.
I so agree with you. It is interesting that some of the major (not Tesla, pimple on an elephant butt) are starting to look away from pure EV vehicles. Looking seriously at Hydrogen, much easier to change infra structure over. We dont have the electric power grid to switch 100%. Lithium is a much more scarce mineral. All these kool aid drinking EV lovers will soon be made to look like fools
 

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
I so agree with you. It is interesting that some of the major (not Tesla, pimple on an elephant butt) are starting to look away from pure EV vehicles. Looking seriously at Hydrogen, much easier to change infra structure over. We dont have the electric power grid to switch 100%. Lithium is a much more scarce mineral. All these kool aid drinking EV lovers will soon be made to look like fools
You clearly don't know what you're talking about. They are making salt batteries. Tick tock. The majors can't figure out how to make money on EVs. Tesla and the Chinese will eat their lunch. https://www.technologyreview.com/20...erial-could-unlock-cheaper-batteries-for-evs/
 

DRW

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Joined
Mar 27, 2022
Messages
374
Location
Michigan
Only ones destroying the environment are the Diesel Brothers. They got fined $800k for modifications allowing rolling coal. That's a lot of dough for childish fun.

The mods gave the trucks significant increases in MPG, horsepower, and torque. The mod also eliminated need for DEF. There were significant cost savings for the trucking companies. I have often wondered if the money saved was greater than the fine. Far from childish fun.
 

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
Yup those chinese are doing such a good job at that whole green house gasses reduction thing.

Yay, let's all send our money to a country whose leaders vow to over throw ours..... that's some stellar long term thinking there.
I don't want the Chinese to win, but it's like betting against Kansas City. I would hope people will wake up to the danger. GM, Toyota, Big Oil are not on your side and can't meet emissions standards, so they push hybrids and hydrogen. Deluded foolishness. Toyota sends reenforced vehicles destined for crash tests. Criminal behavior.
 

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
I so agree with you. It is interesting that some of the major (not Tesla, pimple on an elephant butt) are starting to look away from pure EV vehicles. Looking seriously at Hydrogen, much easier to change infra structure over. We dont have the electric power grid to switch 100%. Lithium is a much more scarce mineral. All these kool aid drinking EV lovers will soon be made to look like fools
https://www.technologyreview.com/20...erial-could-unlock-cheaper-batteries-for-evs/ Not to mention all the LED lights and energystar devices lowering usage, energy providers are hoping EV usage keeps surging so they can sell more electricity. I can say for more than a decade with OEM electric vehicles, I have never had more dependable vehicles.
 

bykfixer

Flashaholic
Joined
Aug 9, 2015
Messages
20,698
Location
Dust in the Wind
IMG_5855.jpeg


IMG_5943.jpeg
 

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
Here we go, fixit spreading his FUD again.
Gaslighting and browbeating.

There's too many rational, free thinking individuals here. Why not out grow your narcissism and accept truths and realities?
Join us.
You might even like it?

Further to that I'll call you out as being a climate criminal. Peddling your false messiahs of said to be eco friendly batteries, solar panels and so on. Your advocation of poisoning the planet is abhorrent. I bet you're not even a real vegan!

Now when you've released yourself from your wicked ways of the modern technology that is killing our planet, come back to us with your new decree scribed in your mud hut onto a piece of bark.
How can you like flashlights and be a luddite?
 

gunnertwo

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Jul 1, 2007
Messages
10
Location
Free Idaho
Jumping in- our electrical grid needs a major overhaul. There have been great strides in developing safe small nuclear reactors able to produce electricity. The US navy has nuclear ships since the 1960's. The development of AI has jumped the need for more electric power. More server farms will be built demanding more power. These basic needs must be fulfilled before electric vehicles will have real practicality. Fossil fuel will still be needed and isn't going away.

G2
 

LuxLuthor

Flashaholic
Joined
Nov 5, 2005
Messages
10,661
Location
MS
Elmer FUD. My home charging station was $220. I already had a 14-50 to plug it into. I can take it anywhere. There is absolutely no reason to have a "Home" charging station.

2024 Kia EV9 Review, Pricing, and Specs - Car and Driver

The EV9 is a new three-row electric SUV from Kia with a starting price of $56,395 and a range of up to 304 miles. It offers decent performance, a spacious interior, a…
There are a number of things that are wrong with mandated EV's off the top of my head.

1) Environmentalists are pushing this because they have 100% bought into global warming ONLY being man-made, and mostly hydrocarbon related. They further have decided that all hydrocarbon use is the enemy, and force their view through government regulations and mandates, rather than letting the market drive innovation, new product desire, and changes.

2) Emission standards are made up by global warming fanatics, and not valid outside of that political fanaticism. Sure having clean water, land and air are great...but mandating standards are more of the government shoving it down our throats. No thanks.

3) The amount of air, land, water pollution in China, Mexico, India, etc. using whatever energy source they want to mine, manufacture, and dispose of materials related to batteries is astounding. Global warming advocates seek to impose regulations and mandates on USA & developed nations (as if China is not), and are oblivious to those doing the most pollution.

4) The amount of electricity independently generated by coal, gas, nuclear, etc. pollution to charge EV batteries is always overlooked.

5) The lack of adequate power grid stability and electricity supply (as well as a paucity of charging stations) in the USA is not adequate...examples are California brownouts and EV charging bans.

6) Poor performance of EV batteries in cold weather is paralyzing.

7) If you can find a charging station on a longer trip, there is a significant time delay to receive a maximum charge vs. quick fill up of gasoline.

8) Relative high costs of EV and battery replacement is significant.

I'm sure there are more valid points if I were to waste time delving further.
 

vincent3685

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Mar 14, 2015
Messages
183
There are a number of things that are wrong with mandated EV's off the top of my head.

1) Environmentalists are pushing this because they have 100% bought into global warming ONLY being man-made, and mostly hydrocarbon related. They further have decided that all hydrocarbon use is the enemy, and force their view through government regulations and mandates, rather than letting the market drive innovation, new product desire, and changes.

2) Emission standards are made up by global warming fanatics, and not valid outside of that political fanaticism. Sure having clean water, land and air are great...but mandating standards are more of the government shoving it down our throats. No thanks.

3) The amount of air, land, water pollution in China, Mexico, India, etc. using whatever energy source they want to mine, manufacture, and dispose of materials related to batteries is astounding. Global warming advocates seek to impose regulations and mandates on USA & developed nations (as if China is not), and are oblivious to those doing the most pollution.

4) The amount of electricity independently generated by coal, gas, nuclear, etc. pollution to charge EV batteries is always overlooked.

5) The lack of adequate power grid stability and electricity supply (as well as a paucity of charging stations) in the USA is not adequate...examples are California brownouts and EV charging bans.

6) Poor performance of EV batteries in cold weather is paralyzing.

7) If you can find a charging station on a longer trip, there is a significant time delay to receive a maximum charge vs. quick fill up of gasoline.

8) Relative high costs of EV and battery replacement is significant.

I'm sure there are more valid points if I were to waste time delving further.
Oh, haven't you heard? Just strap some solar panels to your cars' roof and you too can have free energy.🤣
Every study or opinion the knob cites is from some left wing liberal rag or think tank that gets their funding from the govt. or someone who has a climate tard agenda. Unless their studies show the earth is dying and the reason is man made climate change...no more funding for them. It's all a lie.
 
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vincent3685

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Mar 14, 2015
Messages
183
Yup those chinese are doing such a good job at that whole green house gasses reduction thing.

Yay, let's all send our money to a country whose leaders vow to over throw ours..... that's some stellar long term thinking there.
The Chinese have flooded the US with cheap solar panels in order to corner the market. When they take over the industry, they will be the only place to buy new panels when the old ones soon have to be dumped in our landfills.
 

Photolunatic

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Joined
May 23, 2024
Messages
25
Location
England
That poison was built up over billions of years. We used it up in a couple of centuries renewables are the only logical choice, unless some rocket scientist gets fission to work. Otherwise it's batteries or pumped hydro to store energy from wind and solar. If Texas is doing it, it must be good. US coal plants face a new rule. Capture CO2 or close up. I guess you didn't watch the video on how solar, wind and batteries are working and eliminating Peaker plant operation. Not to mention renewables are cheaper than fossil fuels.
https://about.bnef.com/blog/us-coal-plants-face-new-rule-capture-co2-or-shutter/
I am sorry to say that, but you've been brainwashed. Those are your beliefs, not facts.
Oil is renewable. The old fields that were emptied years ago filled again by now. Do your research, do not rely on TV.
 

TPA

Enlightened
Joined
Aug 26, 2005
Messages
468
Location
Florida
Oil will never go away. We NEED it to function.

People forget that oil, by definition IS organic! Organic Chemistry is the study of carbon chemistry. You can't get closer to hydrocarbons than oil.

Unless you live in Alaska and do 100% subsistence living, if you want to eat, you need oil. Agriculture runs on oil. Fertilizers? They come from petroleum. Pesticides? Petroleum. Farming equipment? Diesel. Refrigeration? Diesel, then grid. Transporting the food from the farm to the store? Diesel.

Healthcare? Plastics, including IV bags and syringes, all come from petroleum. Many medications also come from petroleum. Vitamins you buy in the store come from petroleum distillates. Medical devices? Petroleum too.

Electronics? Oil is the only way. From obtaining the raw materials through the use of diesel power to mine the lithium for batteries, to the production, to transportation, it's all oil. Those plastic keys on your keyboard came from oil.

Homes? Plastic siding? Petroleum. Insulation to make the home more "environmentally friendly"? Fiberglass and spray foam are both petroleum. Drywall requires large amounts of energy to make, so it's likely some form of petroleum was used.

I certainly think it's wise to consider ways to use less of it, BUT, we need to look at the TOTAL cost and consumption. My Mercedes luxo-barge, cradle-to-grave, including the oil and gas it will use in its lifetime, is more environmentally-friendly than a Prius. It actually uses less fuel than a Prius. At the same time, it will never see the service life that my 1977 Mercedes 240D diesel saw (>1 million miles @ 30-35 MPG).

/rant ON
Manufacturers and politicians look the other way when it comes to the environmental impact of manufacturing and service life. Today's "high efficiency" air conditioners don't make sense in any sense. To get these high efficiencies, manufacturers use smaller compressors, larger thinner coils, and poorly-designed electronics. All of this leads to breakdowns and that it'll have to be scrapped long before older units would. Unlike HVAC systems of old, new ones are manufactured with parts and materials from all around the world. All of these are shipped multiple times across the oceans. Again, the environmental costs of this are ignored. Then there's the financial costs. I did the math. Even in Florida, a high-SEER system from the usual suspects (Trane/Carrier/Lennox/etc) does not financially make sense. The savings don't justify the higher price, not to mention higher-SEER systems have more complexity, so will break down more often and won't last as long. If it doesn't make sense in Florida, it's never going to make sense.
/rant OFF
 

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
I am sorry to say that, but you've been brainwashed. Those are your beliefs, not facts.
Oil is renewable. The old fields that were emptied years ago filled again by now. Do your research, do not rely on TV.
No, oil is not a renewable resource. It's a fossil fuel, along with coal and natural gas, that takes millions of years to form and is non-renewable because it can't be replaced once it's extracted and used.


1718121636054.png

Department of Energy

Fossil - Department of Energy
Fossil energy sources, including oil, coal and natural gas, are non-renewable resources that formed when prehistoric plants and animals died and were gradually buried by layers of rock. Over millions of years, different types of fossil fuels formed -- depending on what combination of organic matter was present, how ......
1718121636236.png

un.org

What is renewable energy? | United Nations
Renewable energy sources are plentiful and all around us. Fossil fuels - coal, oil and gas - on the other hand, are non-renewable resources that take hundreds of millions of years to form. Fossil fuels, when burned to produce energy, cause harmful greenhouse gas emissions, such as carbon dioxide.
1718121636447.png

National Geographic Society

Petroleum - National Geographic Society
Oct 19, 2023 — There are huge quantities of petroleum found under Earth's surface and in tar pits that bubble to the surface. However, petroleum, like coal and natural gas, is a non-renewable source of energy. It took millions of years for it to form, and when it is extracted and consumed, there is no way for us to replace it. Oil supplies will run out. Eventually, the world will reach "peak oil," or its highest production level. Some experts predict peak oil could come as soon as 2050. Finding alternatives to petroleum is crucial to global energy use, and is the focus of many industries. Formation of Petroleum.
Oil is formed when prehistoric plants and animals die and are buried under layers of rock, sand, and silt. Over time, the pressure and temperature change the organic matter into petroleum, which is trapped in the rock formation. Humans are consuming oil much faster than it can form, and some experts predict that the world will reach "peak oil," or its highest production level, as soon as 2050.


Burning fossil fuels like oil to produce energy also releases harmful greenhouse gas emissions, such as carbon dioxide. However, some research suggests that it may be possible to turn oil into a renewable resource. For example, ocean algae can produce oil to help them float near the surface and get enough light. Researcher Ed Laws at the University of Hawaii has found that algae produce large amounts of oil when he puts blue plastic filters over shallow ponds where they are raised.
AI Overview
Learn more…Opens in new tab


There are multiple theories about whether oil is renewable, including the abiotic oil theory and the fossil fuel theory:
  • Abiotic oil theory
    This theory suggests that oil is a primordial syrup that is continuously created by the Earth under high pressure and extreme heat. As the oil moves toward the surface, bacteria attack it, making it seem like it has an organic origin that dates back to dinosaurs. Alexander Kitchka, a member of the Ukrainian National Academy of Sciences, estimates that 60% of oil is abiotic in origin and not from fossil fuels. However, some say that this theory doesn't explain the variety of biological compounds found in oil from different parts of the world. For example, oil from younger rocks contains compounds linked to flowering plants, but oil from older rocks contains more primitive organic compounds.
  • Fossil fuel theory
    This theory suggests that fossil fuels were created by living organisms and could be renewable given enough time, heat, and pressure. In theory, organic matter from today could become oil millions of years in the future. However, the time it takes for this process to occur has prevented oil from being considered a renewable resource.


 

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
Oh, haven't you heard? Just strap some solar panels to your cars' roof and you too can have free energy.🤣
Every study or opinion the knob cites is from some left wing liberal rag or think tank that gets their funding from the govt. or someone who has a climate tard agenda. Unless their studies show the earth is dying and the reason is man made climate change...no more funding for them. It's all a lie.
solarteameindhoven.nl Do your own research then. 1,200 miles range. Seats5.
 

gunnertwo

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Jul 1, 2007
Messages
10
Location
Free Idaho
No, oil is not a renewable resource. It's a fossil fuel, along with coal and natural gas, that takes millions of years to form and is non-renewable because it can't be replaced once it's extracted and used.


View attachment 63422
Department of Energy

Fossil - Department of Energy
Fossil energy sources, including oil, coal and natural gas, are non-renewable resources that formed when prehistoric plants and animals died and were gradually buried by layers of rock. Over millions of years, different types of fossil fuels formed -- depending on what combination of organic matter was present, how ......
View attachment 63423
un.org

What is renewable energy? | United Nations
Renewable energy sources are plentiful and all around us. Fossil fuels - coal, oil and gas - on the other hand, are non-renewable resources that take hundreds of millions of years to form. Fossil fuels, when burned to produce energy, cause harmful greenhouse gas emissions, such as carbon dioxide.
View attachment 63424
National Geographic Society

Petroleum - National Geographic Society
Oct 19, 2023 — There are huge quantities of petroleum found under Earth's surface and in tar pits that bubble to the surface. However, petroleum, like coal and natural gas, is a non-renewable source of energy. It took millions of years for it to form, and when it is extracted and consumed, there is no way for us to replace it. Oil supplies will run out. Eventually, the world will reach "peak oil," or its highest production level. Some experts predict peak oil could come as soon as 2050. Finding alternatives to petroleum is crucial to global energy use, and is the focus of many industries. Formation of Petroleum.
Oil is formed when prehistoric plants and animals die and are buried under layers of rock, sand, and silt. Over time, the pressure and temperature change the organic matter into petroleum, which is trapped in the rock formation. Humans are consuming oil much faster than it can form, and some experts predict that the world will reach "peak oil," or its highest production level, as soon as 2050.


Burning fossil fuels like oil to produce energy also releases harmful greenhouse gas emissions, such as carbon dioxide. However, some research suggests that it may be possible to turn oil into a renewable resource. For example, ocean algae can produce oil to help them float near the surface and get enough light. Researcher Ed Laws at the University of Hawaii has found that algae produce large amounts of oil when he puts blue plastic filters over shallow ponds where they are raised.
AI Overview
Learn more…Opens in new tab


There are multiple theories about whether oil is renewable, including the abiotic oil theory and the fossil fuel theory:
  • Abiotic oil theory
    This theory suggests that oil is a primordial syrup that is continuously created by the Earth under high pressure and extreme heat. As the oil moves toward the surface, bacteria attack it, making it seem like it has an organic origin that dates back to dinosaurs. Alexander Kitchka, a member of the Ukrainian National Academy of Sciences, estimates that 60% of oil is abiotic in origin and not from fossil fuels. However, some say that this theory doesn't explain the variety of biological compounds found in oil from different parts of the world. For example, oil from younger rocks contains compounds linked to flowering plants, but oil from older rocks contains more primitive organic compounds.
  • Fossil fuel theory
    This theory suggests that fossil fuels were created by living organisms and could be renewable given enough time, heat, and pressure. In theory, organic matter from today could become oil millions of years in the future. However, the time it takes for this process to occur has prevented oil from being considered a renewable resource.

I do not trust info from the DOE, UN or Nat GO. They have become "woke" and place the environment agenda above truth.

G2
 
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