Gladius: an amateur review and first glance

McGizmo

Flashaholic
Joined
May 1, 2002
Messages
17,304
Location
Maui
Hi guys,
I received a pre production Gladius that was floating in a sea of popcorn and sans any instructions or notes today. I have not read up on the functions or UI of the switch other than to know the basics that the light is capable of from reading some posts. I wanted to see if I could fathom the light without instructions. I am pleased to report that I was able to figure it out on my own with the exception of the Lock-Out feature. I found out about the Lock-Out feature by referring to the specifications PDF which are well written and easy to follow with the light in your hand. I don't think anyone will have any problem mastering the functions of this light and once mastered, I believe they are easy to return to. I won't get into typing the various modes and means as they are clearly laid out in the spec sheet. I would state after using this light that if any tactical user was not able to master this light with some hands on time and refreshing if needed, I would be very concerned if said person had a leathal weapon at their disposal! This is not a complicated light! Now, in terms of when to use the strobe and how to use this light in a tactical arena, I am clueless and leave it to those who aren't! As a not tactical user, I learned real quick that the "middle" position of the selector was one to avoid! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif Even at the sending end, this is not an illumination mode that one would choose to use for sight enhancement!

For starters a picture for scale:

Gladius-Lineup.jpg


I didn't include any of the SF 5W lights in the picture because I think it is a mistake or at least misleading comparing Lux5 lights with LuxIII lights. Since I took the picture, I got to pick the players! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

The Gladius uses an IMS so27xa reflector so I think it is fair to compare its beam with both the LH (same reflector) as well as the Aleph 1 and or any of the PR lights using LuxIII's and of course the Pelican M6 LED. Any of these lights are a very close representation of beam angle and spill geometry. There are some differences but I think the Luxeon Lottery can skew your results more than these reflectors do. Anyone familiar with a 27 mm reflector and a well driven LuxIII will have a good idea of what you get from the Gladius. Without knowing the actual drive current on high of the Gladius, I can say no more here.

First Impressions:
The light is well made and fits nicely in the hand. I had some concerns about the flare in the tail but the hand accepts it easily and comfortably. It is refreshing in a sense to grab a light with no knurled surface. The switch is easy to activate in terms of both turning the selector and pushing in the button. The button has a fair amount of stroke to it and a very light spring. It's kind of noisy though if you advance it rappidly. Since the button is easy to push, the Lock-Out feature is likely need for some metnods of carry. The Lock Out feature specifically locks out the button from completing a stroke and it can also be used for locking in the current active light output. It is cool how the selector is independent of what ever mode has been initiated and it can be advanced to a different selection from that which has been accessed and is currently in play. For those too lazy (like me) there are three positions for the selector and the push button activates your selection. In the first postion... nah..... read the PDF! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Now to personal prefferences. I accept that this light, as programed, is a tactical light and the merits of the strobe are for others to determine. The far closkwise selection allows for momentary high output and this is great and useful to me and likely most others. The far counter clockwise position is for constant on light as well as varible levels. Now this selection is essentially what all of the other UI based lights have had to deal with in terms of one button and many modes desired. Since the light is tactical, the first result from a momentary push of the button is constant on high. Likely a good call for its intended use. If you hold the button in the light will start to go down in intensity until it reaches low and it will stay in low if the button is held on or released. This might be an "Oops" for the tactical user who falsely assumed they were in the momentary high mode. This UI is not friendly to those wanting to start with minimal and ramp up to a sufficient level. If you grab this light and want to break the darkness with low light, you will take the light and place the head against your body or point it up and or away and push the button in and holding the button in, count to three and then release the button. You now have constant on low and can bring the light into the field of view without blinding yourself. This is a viable work around for anyone who wants the default to be full brightness. For me, I would prefer the light to start in low. I should add that when the light is in the very low mode, constant on, you can push the button in and allow it to ramp up to a higher level and then release to remain in constant on of that higher level.

The one thing this light does not allow is unfortunately the most prevalent use I find in a flashlight and that is momentary and immediate low. It would be great for a less tactical model to have the middle selection based on a momentary activation of what ever level had last been chosen in the variable level, constant on mode. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif
Regarding low and high, on the unit I have to test, at one meter, I read 19 lux on low and around 2900 lux on high. This is an impressive spread.

Ingress and Egress is through the removed tail cap:

Gladius-Open.jpg


There is a plastic inner battery sleeve with what appears to be some flex circuitry laid in a milled or broached channel of the Al tube. There is also a small key on the switch module that must locate in this slot for the tail cap to be re installed. It took me a minute to realize this. (tool familiarity)

This light goes well beyond a simple machined Al tube with batteries and a light engine forward. I have seen comments on the price of this light and as I have stated in consideration of other expensive lights, there is more to tooling, design and engineering costs than one might assume. Ultimately the price needs to be in sync with the utility of the tool and a match is a match and a mismatch isn't. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

This light may be simple in function but it is not simple in construction or design. With a rare earth magnet, I was able to determine that there is some proximity switching of some nature going on in this light.

No beam shots since this is a "known" beam. However this is the first light I have done a run time on that I needed three graphs to get a good picture of what was going on!

Gladius-High.jpg


Gladius-Low-Warning.jpg


Gladius-Single-Warning.jpg


Now I found it interesting that after 45 minutes of running, unattended in mid 50 F ambient, it would appear that the light backed off due to thermal conditions? I did touch the light after 5 and 10 minutes of running and it was warm but certainly not as hot as other lights I have tested. If this light has a good thermal path to the outside, I would have stated that it was not running too hot. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thinking.gif Since we don't know the drive level or indeed the internal layout of the light, speculation can abound but answers likely need to come from the manufacturer. I will state that even though the output dropped, there is still plenty of light and if this drop was due to protection of the LED or circuit, cool! I would also expect that in a tactical application, the likelihood of using a light in constant on for 45 minutes seems low?!?! The low battery warning is very nice and unobtrusive. You are given plenty of time and the fraction of a second every 15 seconds really doesn't cause any interuption in the use of the light.

In conclusion of this ramble, I think this is a very interesting light of significant design and engineering consideration. Aside from the annoying strobe, the use of the 27 mm reflector is probably one of the best compromises in terms of photon management when throw must be weighed against size. The light provides a wide dynamic range of light in a reasonably accessable manner. I am in no position to guess at or judge the durability of the components but the design is original and for that reason alone, I assume that the designers knew what they were doing. Time and use will of course tell. The only recommendation I am very comfortable making at this point is by all means, if the opportunity arises, check one of these out! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Oh yeah, I almost forgot, I have no idea if this light is designed to function properly on Li-Ions and since I am supposed to return it in working order, there are many things I was not able to answer to my satisfaction! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif I am just as satisfied with the red light shown in the picture for a similar beam and output but I just might be biased as all get out! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif The red light doesn't have the dynamic range to be sure, or the strobe but it does have instant momentary low! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinser2.gif

To those behind the Gladius, thanks for bringing something new and different to the plate! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif For a first entry, you have found fresh ground to stand on!
 
Thank you for taking the first objective look at it from a consumer point of view.

Keep in mind the light is programmed to have that drop off if left unattended. When you pick it up at that point is feels fairly cool to the touch.

All one has to do is cycle the switch and it returns back to full output.

This protects the LED from heat damage issues according my much smarter electrical engineering associates.

We are also going to program future variants of this light to start low and go up in the adjustable mode. The possibilities are limitless as this functions are digtially programed. We can have the thing spell out the Star Spangled Banner in Morse code if we think that would help!
 
Ken,
I realize that all of these unattended run time tests are poor indications of real use. I would expect that if the drop off is due to thermal considerations, the thermal relief of being hand held would extend the "play" time of the light. Frankly, seeing that drop in the graph is a plus to my way of thinking because it presumably shows that a designed protection measure is in fact functioning!

A light left on and unattended for 45 minutes is hardly an example of tactical usage, me thinks!

Do you have any comments on the usage of Li-Ion rechargeables with this light? I don't believe any are available yet with UL approval so I understand if you choose to leave your 10 foot pole where it is and offer a no comment! I have been given to understand though for duty lights that many prefer the "free" power from rechargeables.

EDIT: With the "three chanel" input for UI, I can imagine that you can cater specifically to group needs with this light. Very flexible and cool!

For what it's worth, do I need one of these lights? No. Will I be buying one? Yes. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Great review Don!

Couple of follow up questions:
-What would you estimate the LED is being driven at, given the beam it is putting out (what is its "equivalent" in Downboy)?

-What do you think of the strobe function? Do you find it annoying or extremely disorienting?

Thanks!
 
Nicely done, Don. "thumbsup:

Be nice to also hear from an objective *tactical* user as well. Sitting here on my decidedly NONtactical butt, I'm just itching to use that middle channel for something useful to us mere mortals! The ability to start a ramp sequence from low is just about mandatory for my usage. But then, I've also never killed anybody - at least not that I'm aware of. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif

Man, a momentary button AND three channels. That's like a UI designer's wet dream!
 
Another consideration for a civilian version, if it ever comes available, would be a tailstanding capability.
 
We have and will certainly be looking at Li-Ion as a power source. On this go around, we went with a known quantity.

UI & flexibility:
Yes we have already been approached by several other groups wanting programming changes.

Not a problem if quantities justify it.

For example: A sportman might never want the strobe....
So, we take that slot in the UI and make it a stand alone adjustable area. It can start low and go up, then we can have it remember where you left it. Next time you access it, it is exactly where you left it.

We orginally thought about creating another slot/mode turn, but then we knew there would be a hue & cry for sure that this thing was too complicated to operate.

I am very pleased that the UI was intuitive without the instructions.

My 9-year old son figured it out in one sitting and loves to blast me with the strobe unawares....But then again he is 3X smarter than I am anyway.
 
sithjedi333,

I believe the LED could easily be at or even above spec. It is really hard to say. It depends on the LED too much for a reasonable guess. I held it next to a Aleph 1 with DB 917 that I had just built and the DB917 had a lux reading of 3300 but that seems higher than typical and the beam in this light was noticibly tighter than the Gladius. SInce the Gladius does have thermal protection, I believe they can push the envelope in terms of drive. I assume that the reduced levels are a result of PWM but I have no idea if this driver is constant current, constant power or what? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif

I reckon that one of the EE whizes will get one of these apart at some point and tell us laymen what's going on. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Darell, I have no idea if the three channels are completely wide open to UI programming but it would seem to be the case. I would imagine that it would be cool for you UI guys! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif I have my sights down a simpler path; too old for digital! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon15.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
McGizmo said:
...I held it next to a Aleph 2 with DB 917 that I had just built and the DB917 had a lux reading of 3300 but that seems higher than typical and the beam in this light was noticibly tighter than the Gladius...

[/ QUOTE ]

Don, 3300 LUX from an Aleph 2 is so extraordinary that I suspect you were testing an Aleph 1, and an outstanding one at that. But if it IS an A2 then.....Paypal standing by!

Brightnorm
 
Brightnorm! Oops! You are absolutely right! It was an Aleph 1 and I was surprised at its output as well! Usually I see high 2000's and an ocassional over 3000. I mailed that light off but will be getting it back eventually. I will take a closer look at it! Who named these stupid Aleph's anyway! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

EDIT: BN, you are going to love the soft spring and easy button on the Gladius!
 
Don,

Now my appetite for that over-achieving Lux III has really been whetted! I know you only sell what you have on hand but is there any way for me to "reserve" that one with a deposit or full payment?

BTW, excellent review /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/happy14.gif

Brightnorm
 
BN,
If I do get it back, it's yours.

Now back to the drop at 45 minutes on the run time. This has been perplexing my simple mind as I am sure thermal steady state is achieved well before this time. Duh! What is changing is the Vin probably as the batteries are being depleted. I am now assuming that at some point, the lower Vin of the batteries is probably causing the converter to work harder witn more current and possibly less efficiency. It may be that this additional thermal burden is enough to tip the scales. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif If that is the case the it may be that once the batteries near their end of usefullness, it may only take a shorter period of constant on time for the thermal protection to kick in. If this is true, it is likely that a Pila in this light with the lower Vf would see the thermal safety come on much sooner.

Of course I could test my theory by running the light on fresh batteries for say 40 minutes, shut it off for a cool down and then start the test again. OK.................
 
Good write-up! Now, if it could only go back to K.G via Concord, Ca, and my grubby over-eager paws could fondle it enroute. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

I can see some not liking the strobe capabilities; as they may have no use for it. Personally, I'm looking forward to trying it out on duty, as I deal with a lot of folks who tend to have "issues" with the police, and this would be an interesting alternative to my usual hands-on routine.

-dan
 
McGizmo, thanks for the review!

IYO, how much difference would a few "cooling fins" in the housing make towards temperature regulation? I don't think it would take away from the overall attractiveness of the light.

Also, can you tell me what the outer diameter is of the bezel? I'm wondering if it will fit properly bezel down in a SureFire holster (V70/G2Z).

Thanks!
 
[ QUOTE ]
McGizmo said:
BN,
If I do get it back, it's yours...

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks Don

BN
 
Hi guys,
I didn't bother with a fresh set of batteries as I only had a 10 or 15 minutes at the most on the set in the light. I proceeded to do another run time but went ahead and shut the light off twice for between 10 and 15 minutes to cool off after the the light had dropped into its thermal relief mode:

gladius-interuptus.jpg


You can see that after the first shut down, the light started out again at full power and went for about 25 minutes before it again backed off. I suspect now two things, 1) I am guessing about stuff over my head and 2) it seems that some type of steady state is never really reached in the high mode and eventually the circuit drops down in power for conservation of the components. If you notice the light output in the "safe mode" you get a very straight line and in all cases graphed of the full output level, the line is in a downward slope; never does level off. I suspect that some level could be chosen from the varible output mode that would give you a straight line until low battery warning and then the drop from regulation. For rather obvious tactical reasons, it would appear that the LED is being driven at a level that ultimately can not be sustained for long periods; certainly in an isolated condition without external thermal relief. I suspect that this was a conscious decision made by the designers with the consideration that the light would not be used for long runs in constant on. Since the circuit has the ability to protect itself and the LED, I think this is a reasonable decision on the designer's part. When you enter the constant on mode, you have the ability at your fingertips to drop the output level down some. It would seem to me that it would be prudent in a tactical or non tactical environment to drop the level down as much as practical and if the case be that you need full power at all times in a long run, it is likely that you don't have the proper tool for the job, IMHO.

With no real knowledge of what's behind the curtain, it is an interesting proposition to try to guess! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

EDIT:
Samuel,
I am real weak on the thermal dynamics of these lights but something in my gut tells me that extra fins would not make a big difference here. Perhaps they would if you are going to leave the light unattended or wear gloves while holding it but in real use, I doubt the difference would be significant. If anything, I think backing down from full bright would give you a sustainable run of light and likely increase the runtime significantly. Realistically, I doubt most users of this particular light will ever have those considerations or even fathom the fact that a 50% reduction in power may only represent a 30% reduction in light output or the fact that a 30% reduction in light output would have negligible effect if the illumination task is well within the range of the tool! Unless the tool needs to be as bright as it is in the constant on mode, one solution might be to set the max level on constant on a bit lower to the level that could be sustained. If the user understands that he (she) can get a brighter beam by switching to the momentary mode, perhaps the thermal relief package would be called up much less. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/icon3.gif Again, just how often will these lights be subjected to being on for a half hour or 45 minutes, non stop?!?! This light is based on tactical criteria and not walk about criteria. With the safety net in place, it is likely that the current program is optimal for those it was designed to serve.
 
McGizmo,

Vaughn & I spoke this morning.

Rather then get the Gladius back to us by SHOT, can you send the light to Dano here on this Forum for his review from a tactical perspective?

I believe his input and viewpoint would be appreciated by everyone here.

I will leave it up to you 2 to coordinate mailing addresses it that is Okay.

If not, send it back to me & I will get it to him.

Again, thank you for provided the data\perspective from your end.

Dano please send it back to us when you are done.
 
Great write up Mr. Don. But I am disappointed you did not speak of the tactical cartwheet out the sailboat. He hehe. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nana.gif
 
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