Has anyone run KL1 with 3x123s?

TOB9595

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What, is it possible that with all the tinkerers here, no one has used the kl1 in 3 cell?
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McGizmo

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I made the one "universal" holder primarily because Jolly Roger was hounding me for a holder to take two NiMH A cells. He now has this holder and I told him that some CPFers wanted a runtime on 3 123's and a KL1. He said he'd do a run time test but I think he needs some brow beating! I'll forward this thread on to him and see if I can't shame him into providing some info.
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It's the least I can do to, I mean for him.

- Don
 

brightnorm

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Originally posted by McGizmo:
I made the one "universal" holder primarily because Jolly Roger was hounding me for a holder to take two NiMH A cells. He now has this holder and I told him that some CPFers wanted a runtime on 3 123's and a KL1. He said he'd do a run time test but I think he needs some brow beating! I'll forward this thread on to him and see if I can't shame him into providing some info.
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It's the least I can do to, I mean for him.

- Don
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Right on Don, beat his brow!

Brightnorm
 

JollyRoger

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OK, OK! Sheesh! You guys are ruthless....
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OK, I'll do the runtime tonight....
Work has eased up, and I was going to go for a bike ride tonight, but maybe I'll make it *part* of my bike ride and use it as my light! (And then just keep it on after that.)

The thing is, I don't have a light meter, and my digital camera (along with my laptop) were recently stolen...so it'll have to be an "eyeball" light meter. I think this should be fine, though, since Surefire's runtime graph of the 2 123 setup shows that regulation falls off rather noticeably (so I should notice it).

Man, you guys....brow beating...sheesh....
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Deviant

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tedbearruntimechart.jpg


base on Mr. Ted Bear, my guess is that the KL1 with 3x123s will have approximately the same runtime as KL3 with 3x123 but approx 7-10% dimmer.

Why so?
base on KL1 with 2x123s and KL3 with 2x123s in the run time chart. the graph has a similar pattern. but maybe differenc in lux and run time by at most 10%.

then comes the questions i have been thinking
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assuming that my guess above is correct, then why get the KL3? the KL1 has a smaller form factor relative to the KL3 but maybe 10% dimmer which i guess it isn't that significant. trade that 10% of lux for a smaller light. the only reason that i can give is that the KL3 has a better heat dissipation design that can handle 9V compared to the KL1. this translates to the issue on the lifespan of the the electronics and the LED of the KL1 when running @ 9V

can anyone pls comment on my idea, i having been pondering whether to get order the KL3. my concern is, is the KL3 going to be another KL1 but bigger and better heat dissipation and the risk or heat acculmulation when running the KL1 @ 3V. in the end my concern may be uncalled.
 

McGizmo

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Josh,

On the standard size SF's (1") , the annode contact of the battery is well within and recessed from the lip of the battery tube. Given this and the required longitudinal didtance to effect a female to male connector, you would end up with probably over an inch of dead space requiring a long jumper to connect the battery train. I think you would have a really long and porportionally ugly assembly. To correct this, you would need to machine the battery tube and tap it to accept a male nipple that would connect the KL1 to the tube. I am not sure the geometry would support such a modification and it's a mute point in that you would have more than a simple adapter.

This is my take anyway.

Don
 

Josh

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Don, your right, I didn't think about the base of the KL and the + battery contact. Would have been cool though, thanks for answering my question
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brightnorm

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Originally posted by JollyRoger:
OK, OK! Sheesh! You guys are ruthless....
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OK, I'll do the runtime tonight....
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">JR,

Eagerly looking forward to your test.

Brightnorm
 

brightnorm

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Originally posted by McGizmo:
BrightNorm,

I believe you forgot something................
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Nope,

First the civilized testing and then:

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Brightnorm
 

JollyRoger

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Jeez...you guys....
brow beating me to death!

OK, ok....here goes.

Last night, I got home and decided I *needed* to do this before both Don and Brightnorm came knocking on my door to break my kneecaps.
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So I put in 3 Toshiba 123's (from Botach?). And switched the light on. (Remember, since I'm using Toshiba's, you could think of this as a "low-end" runtime...)

Since my digital camera was stolen, I decided to just use my eyes and compare against an ARC LS hybrid running on two recently charged nimh AA's. I only turned on the ARC LS for comparison purposes...only as a reference to see if the KL1 was dimming, etc.

Plus, since the constant current driver gives out pretty much flat light output until the end (look at Surefire's 1 123 and 2 123 graphs), I decided this fall off would be dramatic enough for me to tell when this happens...

Turned on the light at 8:30pm. Noticeably brighter than the ARC LS, but the beam had more of a hotspot, so I can't really say as to how much brighter the overall beam is.

After 5 min., the light got noticeably warm...but not hot (never got *hot*)...just warm. This is a good sign that the heatsink is working well. The head got "nice and warm," but never hot.

I decided to use it as my bike light and went for a ride with it. The KL1 lit up the road ok. Better than my ARC LS with nimh batts (of course)....just sufficient to see the road and potholes, etc. I think for real riding, I'd need atleast two luxeons driven to 400mA each or 1 5W. (of course neither of these would compare to my NiteRider...)

OK, enough rambling.
Got back from my bike ride. At 10PM (2 hours into the runtime), the KL1 was still just as bright (still brighter than the ARC LS).

Midnight: Still just as bright. Constant current drivers are a nice thing...
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OK, here's the fishy part....
I fell asleep during the test!

Woke up at 3am...and it was still bright!
At this point, it was about the same brightness as my ARC LS...so the "flat" part of regulation had ended. I think it was on the way down.

Woke up at 5:00am, and although it was noticeably dimmer than before, it was still going strong. Now is was much (noticeably) dimmer than the ARC LS but still plenty bright to navigate through my cluttered room, etc. The beam looked like a very bright ARC LE...probably a bit brighter.

I turned it off at this point.

So to sum it up, the runtime was around 6 to 6 1/2 hours of BRIGHT, CONSTANT light. The KL1 never got hot, or even hottish...only warm to very warm.

If you guys want me to throw in more technical terms, like specific operating temperatures, light meter readings, etc....then send me some more 123's, a light meter, and..well...just kidding.
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I might be up for a more accurate runtime test with *fresh* Duracell 123's or something. But maybe at a later date. (The Duracell 123's might give 6 1/2 to 7 1/2 hours of runtime?)

For now, I hope the 6+ hour runtime (with crappy 123's) (constant brightness) on 3 123's is sufficient...but then again, didn't we think this already, based on the KL3?
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For some reason, I feel like this test might not have been good enough...but I was tired!
 

Deviant

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JollyRoger,

um.... so i guess the KL3 and KL1 might be using the same regulation, only that heat might be an issue when running for a prolong period of time.
if the usrface feels warm or very warm then inside the KL1, the electronics and the die might be hot
 

McGizmo

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Thanks Roger!

Had I known it was going to take you into the early hours of the morning, I would have called you to keep you awake :) I got stuck in project completion mode myself and now my wagon is draggin'. It sounds like the 3x123's is a good program for extended use! When Doug's cool holders get out there in service, I'm sure we will hear more but thanks for taking the time!

Still, I think you might need some
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Darell

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I'm a big one for "rough math" so it sure looks like the KL1 is giving us 2hrs per 123 cell. And that's pretty good news!

(I notice that the KL1 literature states that the KL1 (on the E1) begins to fade after two hours. And they show a nice output chart to back it up... but the chart shows the output to be severely dropped at the two hour mark. Oh well.)
 

JollyRoger

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Yep....what are you doin' tonight, Don?
Maybe I can sneek up to your shop and blind you with my KL1!
Okay...maybe not...
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Yeah, the KL1 seems like a pretty useful/versatile module.
While the ARC LS is more efficient at the "3V and under" input range (and has pretty darn good regulation now), the KL1 has the ability to use more batteries for extended runtime...

For the pocket, perhaps the ARC LS will be my favorite. But the KL1 is still great in the single 123 mode.

Now, if I can just buy Don for a 5 "A" pack....
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