HDS Systems EDC # 20

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Hogokansatsukan

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The current mechanical Rotary mechanism is different from the older Rotary mechanism. The older one had 7 tiny fingers and the current one has 3 much more robust fingers. Some of the lights will make the noise, and some won't. It all depends on how those fingers are going over the contact board. It won't effect the light. Some that start smooth will end up with the noise, and some with noise will go silent. It's normal. Not great, but yes, it is normal. The next iteration of the Rotary tail is going to address this issue even though it doesn't effect reliability... in fact, it is more reliable than the first Rotary tail that was quite smooth... but the noise is annoying, and Henry doesn't like it either.
 

Hogokansatsukan

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500 out of a single CR123... someone’s trying to keep up with surefire! haha jk. HDS is in a totally different league...

No. What we were saying was that the next step would be 500 lumens. No current emitter will do that with the HDS and how it is designed.
 

Lithium466

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Actually, it will! Take an old EDC Basic 60 that went through a CR123A in 20 minutes and put an XP-L or something similar, and you should get that :D Or was it just the circuit overhead?
 

moltenmag

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Seriously though. I got sick of the “lumen race” a long time ago. When does it end? HDS opened my eyes to the fact that owning a flashlight is more than blasting stuff with “x-amount” of lumens... it’s about seeing what’s truly there... enter HCRI LEDs... (start slow clap)
 

emarkd

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I can't even tell the difference between my 200 lumen HDS lights and other 400 lumen lights. I can barely tell the difference between 200 HDS lumens and most 600 lumen lights, unless they're especially focused and throwy. Honestly I think candela probably registers with our eyes and brains more easily than lumens do, so the fact that HDS lights have a nice focused hotspot, with good throw, makes them seem brighter than they are. That's not to say I wouldn't buy a 500+ lumen HDS, of course I would, but its gonna take a lot more lumens than that to make a real difference in how usable the light is for me.
 

moltenmag

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I can't even tell the difference between my 200 lumen HDS lights and other 400 lumen lights. I can barely tell the difference between 200 HDS lumens and most 600 lumen lights, unless they're especially focused and throwy. Honestly I think candela probably registers with our eyes and brains more easily than lumens do, so the fact that HDS lights have a nice focused hotspot, with good throw, makes them seem brighter than they are. That's not to say I wouldn't buy a 500+ lumen HDS, of course I would, but its gonna take a lot more lumens than that to make a real difference in how usable the light is for me.

500 lumens might be better for the middle of the day with ambient light (or a throw reflector). But 200 lumens from an HDS is extremely bright in pitch black. I RARELY use it on max output at night. On the other hand, moonlight mode is very important to me at night.
 

peter yetman

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Using my HDSs has taught me to appreciate my sub 400Lm lights.
I love my Malkoff M61 Nichia and MDCs, but was always craving for something brighter. Now that I had my HDSs for a while, I appreciate my low level Malkoffs so much more. In fact I think I'll get another drop in.
Don't forget that runtime will suffer the more light that comes out, a 16340 / CR123 is only a small tank.
P
 

calypso699

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Seriously though. I got sick of the “lumen race” a long time ago. When does it end? HDS opened my eyes to the fact that owning a flashlight is more than blasting stuff with “x-amount” of lumens... it’s about seeing what’s truly there... enter HCRI LEDs... (start slow clap)

I completely agree. Run times and efficiency are much more important to me. Sure it’s cool to impress your friends, but the fun only lasts a few seconds before becoming too hot to handle.
 

Hogokansatsukan

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I see the lumen race as the second stage of flashaholism.

The 12 steps of flashaholism:

Stage 1: Illumination: It makes light. It shoots photons. I'm enthralled.
Stage 2: A little is good, a lot is better: I need the sun in my hand... or at least I need the brightest light. I don't care how big it is.
Sage 3: I will pay over $50 for a flashlight.
Stage 5: Recharge: I need rechargeable batteries.
Stage 6: Downsizing: I still need the sun, but I need it smaller.
Stage 7: Blinky lights: I need blinking and I need the sun, but sometimes, I need cloud cover. I'm blinding myself and my family.
Stage 8: UI importance: How the light works now becomes more important.
Stage 9: Failure: I will pay $100 or more for a "good" light. Several non functioning lights in collection.
Stage 10: Low, tint, CRI: Lowest modes become import. I want only 1 photon to leave the end of the light. Tint is now important along with CRI
Stage 11: Secret: I won't tell my friends and especially the wife, what I paid for my flashlight.
Stage 12: Art: A good light is around the same cost as my mortgage payment. Special materials.

At any stage, tritium can add itself to the addiction. Steps can be skipped depending on the individual.
 

indigon

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All good points, especially since 90% of my use is on lower levels. And the HDS maximizes output with it's beam pattern to an incredible level, no complaints here.. -There are those few rare occasions when I wish I had "just a little more"..
The TIR optic idea looks interesting.
 

moltenmag

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I see the lumen race as the second stage of flashaholism.

The 12 steps of flashaholism:

Stage 1: Illumination: It makes light. It shoots photons. I'm enthralled.
Stage 2: A little is good, a lot is better: I need the sun in my hand... or at least I need the brightest light. I don't care how big it is.
Sage 3: I will pay over $50 for a flashlight.
Stage 5: Recharge: I need rechargeable batteries.
Stage 6: Downsizing: I still need the sun, but I need it smaller.
Stage 7: Blinky lights: I need blinking and I need the sun, but sometimes, I need cloud cover. I'm blinding myself and my family.
Stage 8: UI importance: How the light works now becomes more important.
Stage 9: Failure: I will pay $100 or more for a "good" light. Several non functioning lights in collection.
Stage 10: Low, tint, CRI: Lowest modes become import. I want only 1 photon to leave the end of the light. Tint is now important along with CRI
Stage 11: Secret: I won't tell my friends and especially the wife, what I paid for my flashlight.
Stage 12: Art: A good light is around the same cost as my mortgage payment. Special materials.

At any stage, tritium can add itself to the addiction. Steps can be skipped depending on the individual.

Stage 13: Stages 1-12 in one day. Black Hole created from purchasing a titanium rotary... is there a cure?
 

emarkd

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I see the lumen race as the second stage of flashaholism.

The 12 steps of flashaholism:

Stage 1: Illumination: It makes light. It shoots photons. I'm enthralled.
Stage 2: A little is good, a lot is better: I need the sun in my hand... or at least I need the brightest light. I don't care how big it is.
Sage 3: I will pay over $50 for a flashlight.
Stage 5: Recharge: I need rechargeable batteries.
Stage 6: Downsizing: I still need the sun, but I need it smaller.
Stage 7: Blinky lights: I need blinking and I need the sun, but sometimes, I need cloud cover. I'm blinding myself and my family.
Stage 8: UI importance: How the light works now becomes more important.
Stage 9: Failure: I will pay $100 or more for a "good" light. Several non functioning lights in collection.
Stage 10: Low, tint, CRI: Lowest modes become import. I want only 1 photon to leave the end of the light. Tint is now important along with CRI
Stage 11: Secret: I won't tell my friends and especially the wife, what I paid for my flashlight.
Stage 12: Art: A good light is around the same cost as my mortgage payment. Special materials.

At any stage, tritium can add itself to the addiction. Steps can be skipped depending on the individual.

:laughing: This is great. I may have gone through them in a different order, or maybe even skipped one or two, but I definitely still wound up at #12! Guilty as charged.
 

recDNA

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Among HDS users there is a LOT of anti-output snobbery. I love my HDS 3 oclock but I use it in a lab with lots of fluorescent light so it does need to be very bright to illuminate a specimen to show colors better than fluorescent does. Even in shadowy spots there is still a LOT of ambient light and my eyes are not dark adjusted so I need every High CRI lumen I can get! Bottom line is when more efficient led's are plentiful so it is possible to get more Hi CRI candella (Eyes register hotspot better than flood) I definitely want one. Don't discourage them! My light is 200 lumens so I probably won't be in the market again until they get to 400 or more for me to see the difference.
 

Hogokansatsukan

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Among HDS users there is a LOT of anti-output snobbery. I love my HDS 3 oclock but I use it in a lab with lots of fluorescent light so it does need to be very bright to illuminate a specimen to show colors better than fluorescent does. Even in shadowy spots there is still a LOT of ambient light and my eyes are not dark adjusted so I need every High CRI lumen I can get! Bottom line is when more efficient led's are plentiful so it is possible to get more Hi CRI candella (Eyes register hotspot better than flood) I definitely want one. Don't discourage them! My light is 200 lumens so I probably won't be in the market again until they get to 400 or more for me to see the difference.

Brighter does make the light better in several ways. Ambient light greatly effects what you can see. After all, you aren't always in a cave. It also makes the lower levels much more efficient, so runtime is greatly extended. Currently, it is just a matter of emitter technology. When they make one that will do it in an HDS, we will implement it. For the hiCRI lights, a 300 lumen would be the next step in progression.
 

ironhorse

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Pennsylvania
I see the lumen race as the second stage of flashaholism.

The 12 steps of flashaholism:

Stage 1: Illumination: It makes light. It shoots photons. I'm enthralled.
Stage 2: A little is good, a lot is better: I need the sun in my hand... or at least I need the brightest light. I don't care how big it is.
Sage 3: I will pay over $50 for a flashlight.
Stage 5: Recharge: I need rechargeable batteries.
Stage 6: Downsizing: I still need the sun, but I need it smaller.
Stage 7: Blinky lights: I need blinking and I need the sun, but sometimes, I need cloud cover. I'm blinding myself and my family.
Stage 8: UI importance: How the light works now becomes more important.
Stage 9: Failure: I will pay $100 or more for a "good" light. Several non functioning lights in collection.
Stage 10: Low, tint, CRI: Lowest modes become import. I want only 1 photon to leave the end of the light. Tint is now important along with CRI
Stage 11: Secret: I won't tell my friends and especially the wife, what I paid for my flashlight.
Stage 12: Art: A good light is around the same cost as my mortgage payment. Special materials.

At any stage, tritium can add itself to the addiction. Steps can be skipped depending on the individual.

I've been through most of the stages and am happy with the High Noon. But I still want a light that will light a piece of paper on fire.
 

emarkd

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Don't discourage them!

Oh I hope my comment wouldn't be considered discouraging! I'd never want to discourage HDS from advancing, in any way. But the bottom line is still the bottom line -- HDS lights are 1-amp max and will remain 1-amp max. So until an emitter comes out that'll do 500 lumens (OTF) with a 1 amp draw, this is all just an academic discussion. We're just passing time :)

..but on that note, I've got a new emitter I've been playing with a bit. I've used it in several builds and its very good. I can't recall it being mentioned here yet, so I will -- Samsung LH351d is the model number. I've built several lights using them and they're pretty great - fat and floodyish kinda like the XP-L used in the current 325, but with tint and cri like the 219c AND even more efficient than either of them. Some independent testing on another forum showed that one sample of the emitter output 514 lumens at 1 amp, so they're bright. That's at the LED though, no losses with the reflector/glass assembly, so in the light it will read less. I should drop one in an HDS and just see what it does....unofficially.
 

redryder

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The other variable is size/footprint of the led. Hogo said they wouldn't use leds if they aren't the same as the current leds.


Oh I hope my comment wouldn't be considered discouraging! I'd never want to discourage HDS from advancing, in any way. But the bottom line is still the bottom line -- HDS lights are 1-amp max and will remain 1-amp max. So until an emitter comes out that'll do 500 lumens (OTF) with a 1 amp draw, this is all just an academic discussion. We're just passing time :)

..but on that note, I've got a new emitter I've been playing with a bit. I've used it in several builds and its very good. I can't recall it being mentioned here yet, so I will -- Samsung LH351d is the model number. I've built several lights using them and they're pretty great - fat and floodyish kinda like the XP-L used in the current 325, but with tint and cri like the 219c AND even more efficient than either of them. Some independent testing on another forum showed that one sample of the emitter output 514 lumens at 1 amp, so they're bright. That's at the LED though, no losses with the reflector/glass assembly, so in the light it will read less. I should drop one in an HDS and just see what it does....unofficially.
 

Random Dan

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I brought up the LH351D a while ago, but there wasn't much interest at the time. Maybe it just got drowned out during the special run talks. It should be a drop in fit.
 

emarkd

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It is a drop-in fit. Same 3-pad 3535 footprint. I've built several lights using them, both single and multi-emitter setups. It'll fit perfectly on the current mcpcb. I've got plenty of those emitters here, I'll drop one in an HDS in the next couple of days and report back. :)

..unofficially of course.
 
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