Help for Firemen - helmet light ideas?

[matrixshaman]

A friend at a local shop that supplies the LEO's and local EMT and Firemen with flashlights and other things sort of looks to me for flashlight info but I'm not aware of what he is looking for. He's been impressed with some of the small Cree lights I've shown him lately and said Firemen and some others are looking for a much lighter weight flashlight than what they currently have but it must still be fairly bright. If anyone has any suggestions for a small bright LED light in the Fenix P1 or P1D size range that is at least Cree XR-E level brightness (100+ Lumens) and comes with a way to helmet mount it on the side of the helmet or just a mount itself with an adjustable size for such smaller lights please post any info/ideas here. TIA

 

[VidPro]

i thought firemen needs are very specific, they have to meet certian safety protocols, like need hydrogen pellets?

and that they use INCADESCENT because the blue "white" leds light up smoke much faster per ammount that passes to what your trying to see.
if i were a fireman, or we lived where there was fog continually, i would avoid the bluish white leds.
you look on the fire supply sites, it LOOKS like they are stuck in the dark ages of incadescent, but you blast both through a campfire, and realise why.

 

[supes]

Yeah, its a little harder to find the right lights esp. for firefighters. Their needs are more specific and harsh. I was talking to my fire friend and he was impressed with my Fenix P2D but me and him both agreed on it being not suitable for him because of the rubber switch which would melt in a second in a fire. .and also other things like the construction of the light..

He was quite interested in fox's headlamps though. They have some fire proof lights which are pretty good but are expensive.

I also agree with the incandescent ones are better but LEDs are moving up there. I see a lot of SL Survivors(incandescent version) on the trucks, battered and worn out. But I do see a couple of dudes use LED 3 watters from Sam's on their helmets.

LEO and EMS people can pretty much use any of the lights out there, although I would prefer Surefire, Streamlight, or some other brands of reliability and unquestionable durability. I would prefer a plastic type, easy to clean light for EMS people with all these infectious substances out there. Because when you need a light in those situations, you WILL need that light to save someone's or your own @$$.

 

[bfg9000]

Not this one, no matter what Mr. Garrity says:

They're so proud to be the "#1 choice of firefighters" (maybe they donate thousands of them) that they put the picture of the fireman with two disposables strapped to his helmet on their main page; video here. BTW that says "Firefighter's Choice" in the lower right corner of the package.

 

[yellow]

both agreed on it being not suitable for him because of the rubber switch which would melt in a second in a fire. .and also other things like the construction of the light

wonder why this does not seem to be a problem with an "all plastic with rubber switch" Streamlight Propolymer 4aa, or similar lights :thinking:
problem with most lights (Fenix f.e.) would be no sure watertightness or safety rating, and unsure drop/abuse rating
(I wont drop mine, never)

A good bet would be a high power led light, like a mod in a good host. Those extreme mods into surefire lights (custom modded section) come to mind. Interesting again: rubber cap, but these seem not to melt here, like in onther lights)

PS: do firemen have much of a chance to use their own lights? Dont they have to use the equipped ones --> as for the safety ratings?

 

[fasuto]

Take a look at this:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/162838

The light is ATEX certified for firemen use

 

[ACMarina]

Yellow, most departments that I've worked with issued lights of some sort, but you were allowed to use your own lights if they were certified by UL or something for use in hazardous conditions.

I personally like Kohler Bright Star..

 

[clipse]

There are a few LED light geared for firefighters. Our department used the LED Survivor light. I have a Streamlight Propolymer 4AA lux on my helmet. UK also make an LED geared toward firefighters. The lights have have a hazard rating though, I can't remember what specifically but I know UK and Streamlight are ok. I'm not aware of any cree/seoul lights that are approved for firefighting.

clipse

 

[matrixshaman]

Thanks for all the suggestions and info. I knew that in fires lights needed to have special ratings. I'm not sure if my friend was thinking about that or maybe one to use outside of a fire or hazardous/explosive area. I'll pass on the info.

 

[Barbarin]

As I posted here before I think the only alloy high power LED light that is certified for firefighting is our Barbolight U-04

 

[Bogie]

Yes they give out the Garrity Light & there is one on my Helmet along with a G2 on the other side. I also have a Streamlight LED Survivor on my coat, I Carry a Streamlight Fire Vulcan as needed as well. The main thing is that light use inside a fire is very limited as it can make visibility worse using a hand light to point out something to another is most likely but keeping a bright light on constantly is not done.

 

[clipse]

I would be afraid to touch a metal light in some of the environments that I've been in. 99% of firefighter flashlights are plastic for a reason. Low conductivity and cooler to the touch. Also, you don't have to worry about corrosion. Just my humble opinion. If it was outside the fire environment then what every floats your boat.

clipse

 

[Barbarin]

Well, UL laboratoires certified our flashlight according to exhaustive testing and ATEX requirements.

Today they are being used by many firemen in Spain with satisfaction, I can say proudly.

BTW, the temperatures our flashlight can reach are lower than the ones some other can. Firemen are using always gloves.

Regards,

Javier

 

[BGater]

Sten Light.

http://www.stenlight.com/

 

[clipse]

Well, UL laboratoires certified our flashlight according to exhaustive testing and ATEX requirements.

-----snipped pic------

Today they are being used by many firemen in Spain with satisfaction, I can say proudly.

BTW, the temperatures our flashlight can reach are lower than the ones some other can. Firemen are using always gloves.

Regards,

Javier

I'm not saying your lights aren't good. I just know for my usage as a firefighter I would not want a metal flashlight. And once in a while we do have to take our gloves off. We just recently had a fire on the Missouri River bottoms in and area that had receeding flood waters. Where there wasn't 2 feet of water there was a foot of soupy mud. When you're wearing 30+ pounds of gear and tromping through mud, water, and muck with debris that can't be seen, you fall. The gloves got covered in the slickest mud I've ever felt, we couldn't get a good hold on anything with out gloves on. The came off as soon as we came out of the house. Like I said, its just my humble opinion. I have not found one single flashlight that I have thought was perfect. I wish I had the money for the U-04 and could try it out, I may change my mind but I don't so I can only assume and let people know what has actually worked for me on scene.

[edited to add:]Oh, by the way, when I say the flashlight heats up, I'm not talking about heating up from the LED, I'm talking about it heating up from the fire.


clipse

 

[stonehold]

Try Pelican. They have a few helmet lights and mounts.

http://pelican.com/home.php

 

[jason9987]

the pelicans with the recoil LED setup would be good probably You definitely dont want a blue tinted LED in a fire with an LED you also dont want a lot of side spill as this just lights up the smoke also as great as head lamps are for going where you look, the farther the light is from your eyes the less the effect of smoke lighting up effects you, I used Fire Vulcan and they are good both because of the blue lights in back so you can be seen and they are good at cutting through smoke, the shoulder strap will keep it right at your waist and does it even better if you have it under your SCBA waist strap. a light that uses a lens rather than a reflector may be better since there's less side spill.

 

[timjmayer]

I use a streamlight survivor and a garrity.

the suvivor hangs on my turnout, and the garrity is a back up.

dont rag on the garrity,,its cheap so you can use it, throw it, drop it,lend it, etc..
its bright, and it works everytime...

to me thats perfect...who wants to worry about a hundred dollar flashlight when battling a fire....the garrity is disposable..

they are actually used by alot of fireman for a reason,,,they are good

 

[Bror Jace]

That was a good post, timjmayer. Short and to the point.

I can tell you've been there and done that. As have I.

I'm not sure if there is any standard about what lights most North American firefighters can use. The firefighter that complained about rubber/plastic metal in a fire sounds like a probie/newbie. Tell him to look at the amount of plastic on/in his helmet and SCBA ... including, of course, the front face plate. Here's a rule, if that plastic is melting, you are in a wholelotta trouble and you need to get out ASAP! Melted spots on flashlight bodies and the occasional distorted lenses end up being pretty low on your list of concerns!

Most firefighters in the U.S. are volunteers ... "vollies" ... and I bet the rules and regs still vary greatly from company to company (or district to district) as to what gear they are issue and allowed, including lights. This was certainly true when I served. No one had anything to say about what I chose for my helmet ... or how it was mounted.

It's been about a dozen years since I've donned my turnout gear. When I did, I wore a pair of 2AA Minimags. If I had it to do over again, I might use the same (or similar) set-up. They weren't too expensive, they were incans that won't throw a lot of glare back into my eyes, they were fairly durable, waterproof, etc ... I might be interested in a 2 x CR123 xenon light like the Brinkmann Max-Fire ... but I'd have to re-examine the lights water-proof rating and o-ring configuration. I have a couple, slightly older Garrity 2AA xenon lights that might also be good choices. My #1 complaint about the Minimag is the lousy krypton bulb.

Another thing, when you get in a room with a lot of black smoke, even our large, rechargeable streamlight lanterns wouldn't penetrate very far. I used the two lights on my helmet to help with cold searches (little or no smoke present) and to see what I had my hands on ... not much more than that.

You have to be realistic about what the light can do and what you really want to use it for. It's easy to get caught up in the quest for the perfect flashlight, but honestly, having the ultimate light (toy) doesn't help get the job done ... and as timjmayer said, who wants to be worrying about a $100+ light in the mess and chaos that is the fireground?

Real firefighter veterans remember when the Garrity disposable light was one of the most popular with firefighters, especially the paid guys, and the preferred way to secure it to your helmet was a strip (loop) of rubber off an old pull-up boot ... the type of boots that aren't really used anymore.

The other firefighter light old-timers used to use was a metal 2D incan, slide switch on the body with a head turned 90 degrees and a black-spot in the center of the lens to reduce reflected glare to the user. I'm a little embarassed that I even remember lights like that.

 

[SmokeDiver]

My main light is a Survivor LED. It hangs on my coat so it faces forward. My backup is a SL ProPolymer 4AA LED. Both lights have about the same output, and I use the same batteries (Duracell/Energizer NiMH). Both will stay lit for longer than I will at a fire. The Survivor is for most practical purposes, indestructible. If it gets destroyed (heat, cold, impact, hazmat, etc.) while I'm wearing it, I've got other things to worry about than the light going out.

Ratings for hazardous atmposheres don't concern me, as I would use a light specifically rated if I were at a hazmat incident. I can say with alomst a 100% certainity that any hazardous atmosphere would be mitigated or eliminated so it wouldn't kill me, even with the suit on. I'm not a coal miner.

I prefer reliable, sturdy lights that don't weigh a ton, use commonly availible batteries, that will light my way down a dark or somewhat smoky hallway/room. The simpler, the better. I save my expensive modded lights for recreational pursuits.

One more thing to consider, and it's something I tell the new guys - don't put a light on your helmet that is "hard" mounted. They stick out and can get caught on hanging wires or other entanglement obsatcles. If it does, you may need to remove your helmet (and it's inherent protection) to untangle it. Everything I wear attached to my turnout gear, SCBA included, I can remove with one hand if necessary, to get that piece of equipment unstuck or untangled. A great solution for helmet mounting is to take a wide piece of old inner tube and customize it with holes to fit your light, or use the inner tube to hold it against the helmet like with the Garrity light. Yes, it can be bumped and can fall off, but if the excrement impacts the air handling device, you won't get held up trying to get out of the building.