how many lumens do you reasly need

[Stress_Test]

+

Imagine you own a business & you walk out into the yard where your machinery/inventory/life/is..
there are people trying to harm or rip you off.

I want every lumem to stun there ***, PERIOD!

so I can rerack

On a serious note, I'd be very leery of an ultra-high lumen light for defensive firearm use. You don't want to blind yourself as well as whoever you're lighting up. Presumably, for a shotgun or other long-gun, we're talking weapon lights.

It may be fine if you're aiming at someone/thing outside in your big acreage front yard, but what if you had to use that same weapon inside the house (or business)?

If it were me, I'd make a few trial runs to make sure my light isn't going to be a hindrance instead of an asset. Waking up, grabbing a firearm, and hitting the switch on a 5000 lumen light? Ouch. I know for myself at least I wouldn't be able to see what to shoot at (or not) since I'd be squinting so badly from that level of light output.

But hey I'm just some guy so don't follow my advice on serious stuff like this. :shrug:

There are some training centers out there that probably cover these sorts of things (which names I've completely forgotten at the moment )

 

[Hooked on Fenix]

One of my favorite posts ever was from you HoF. I wish I could find it anymore. But I think it was:
“If you don't use a flashlight, you'll probably fall off a cliff, get hurt, or die.”

Has made me chuckle for years. 😉

I remember that. It was referring to a Mt. Whitney hike. Near the top, there is an area with what are called windows. The trail is a 6-10 foot wide path of rocks piled up to make a somewhat flat trail between the pinnacles. The trail itself is a trip hazard, you have constant 60 mph winds pushing you to the side, and between the pinnacles in these windows you have a vertical drop of 3,000-4,000 feet on each side. Go through that section at night without a flashlight, and you likely will die.

 

[greenpondmike]

i was walking around the woods tonight with 2 lumens . till i saw what u thought was a donkey i hit turbo it was a odd looking deer

Please be careful around odd looking deer.

 

[greenpondmike]

btw i was heart broken when i found out it was not a donkey! i was going to bring him home do they eat pizza?

Maybe the end crust after you eat the rest.

 

[greenpondmike]

I think candlepower is more important than lumens, but it just depends on what you need your light for. 9-30 lumens fits most of what I need, but sometimes a ML50 on high can be real handy.

 

[AstroTurf]

greater than the daylight i battle with...

 

[bykfixer]

I think a lot of people who "need" more lumens, really need more throw, not lumens.

Old school thinking. :candle:

When I shine a high output number 3 doors down in humidity to say hello to my neighbor I can see him but can't tell if he is saying hello back or not. Using a high candela, not so high output light I can see he's giving the thumbs up.

I have a 1.5 lumen 'night lighter' that shines a useable beam the length of my house. It replaced a 6 lumen flooder, which is great for seeing 8 feet in front of me when goose stepping through a dark house. Furniture avoidence technique means less busted toes. But if that bump in the night is an unwelcome guest I'd like to know from as far a distance as practical. More time for a groggy reaction.

Now if I'm trying to ceiling bounce a proper amount of light for a couple of people to see by during a blackout more flood works better. Therefore more lumens is required. So it really boils down to what you are using the lighting tool for.

And old deer got old by not eating pizza. Rigatoni works better.

 

[Lumen83]

If it were me, I'd make a few trial runs to make sure my light isn't going to be a hindrance instead of an asset.

Very good advice. If the application is within the home, particularly, a lot of people make the mistake of buying the latest and greatest Millitary/LE weaponlights. Which are amazing tools, for sure. But there is a difference in application between someone jumping out of a swat truck or squad car all amped up on adrenaline and without night adapted vision, and a homeowner waking up with fully night adapted vision in a pitch black house. My tip would be to find older models of the current lineups. 1-500 lumen Surefire, Streamlight, etc. weaponlights can be found in the same model that now boosts 1000 lumens. And the older ones are going to be less expensive too.

 

[orbital]

+

Having the right tool for the job.



&

Having the right tool for the job.



..both are needed

 

[mickb]

Sure, I guess I could survive with 100 lms if needed. So an honest question: what did you do 15 years ago when the XR-E putting out 200 lms was the best we had?

id say similar to what we did before ED glass in spotting scopes or 50x optical zooms in cameras. You enjoyed closer ranges, accepted blurrier images or the fact you didnt have the time to see everything you wanted. Life went on, when the improvements came out, you grabbed them. I remember specifically for hunting in the day, the go-to was much heavier lights, like vehicle spotlight setups as handhelds and car batteries in a backpack or on the ATV.

I tend to agree light tech went too crazy though. For me I dont care what people get into until it starts effecting choices . The more lumens and UI and gimmicks got out of control, the more research you have to do to find a 'sensible light' or older specs. I miss so many light models like Fenix E01 and HL23 and Nitecore EC4GT which are either out of production or replaced with models with multiple x more lumens I dont need.

 

[mickb]

Your wish.....

Is my command.
P

Thats clever 😀

 

[idleprocess]

I tend to agree light tech went too crazy though. For me I dont care what people get into until it starts effecting choices . The more lumens and UI and gimmicks got out of control, the more research you have to do to find a 'sensible light' or older specs. I miss so many light models like Fenix E01 and HL23 and Nitecore EC4GT which are either out of production or replaced with models with multiple x more lumens I dont need.

The market is going to do whatever moves product in volume. If that means a new model making 5000 peak lumens out of an 18650 sized host sells like hotcakes while sales of a similar 18650 topping out at 500 lumens then fall off a cliff, the latter is destined to be discontinued. If the 5000 lumen model has a reasonable UI and acceptable low modes - where it's going to spend most of its runtime anyway - then best learn to love it.

Of note - many of these performance bumps don't cost anything once they're past the bleeding edge. Take 4K (read: 2160) televisions - initially they were priced at a stupid premium over comparable 1080 models, but now several years on there are pretty much only 4K TVs and they're priced about the same that comparable 1080 TVs went for.

Most of these gains are because the technology has gotten better. I did a maglite mod some ~15 years ago that pushed a trio of Luexon IIIs to the tune of 3.6W each (10.8W total) to produce something like 300 lumens or ~28 lumens per watt. That same 10.8W now at 120 lumens/watt could spit out just shy of 1300 lumens, likely at a lower absolute - not adjusted for inflation - price. I dusted off said maglite about a year ago and still use it occasionally despite the lumens/cm³ density being terrible by modern standards.

 

[peter yetman]

Thats clever 😀

Not mine, it belongs to our friend Archimedes. But I can't resist blowing the dust off sometimes.
P

 

[mickb]

The market is going to do whatever moves product in volume. If that means a new model making 5000 peak lumens out of an 18650 sized host sells like hotcakes while sales of a similar 18650 topping out at 500 lumens then fall off a cliff, the latter is destined to be discontinued. If the 5000 lumen model has a reasonable UI and acceptable low modes - where it's going to spend most of its runtime anyway - then best learn to love it.

Thats basic market economics, no one debates it. However it doesnt mean the market is smart or useful to me. A market can be driven by good ideas, bad ideas, fear or sheer lunacy. I dont care how many lunatics want a 5000 lumen light , I'm not interested in all the modes, large gaps, or complex programming to get around it. As mentioned I research older spec models or have lights modded to suit my requirements. But I do like complaining about markets you got me there 🙂

 

[idleprocess]

Thats basic market economics, no one debates it. However it doesnt mean the market is smart or useful to me. A market can be driven by good ideas, bad ideas, fear or sheer lunacy. I dont care how many lunatics want a 5000 lumen light , I'm not interested in all the modes, large gaps, or complex programming to get around it. As mentioned I research older spec models or have lights modded to suit my requirements. But I do like complaining about markets you got me there 🙂

I agree - the markets don't serve everyone to the degree that we'd like, such is the reality of manufacturers only able to make so many models and retailers only able to stock so many SKUs. The much-celebrated era of 'mass customization' almost exclusively centers on the likes of software tweaks, different colored skins/covers/trims, and swap-able modules - all of these ideally able to be performed as close to the point of sale as possible. In the case of microprocessor-controlled lights it seems like firmware - or at least a configuration file for UI, thermal protection, battery life management - ought be easily changed, however this is not something I've seen done in a production light.

Personally I miss everyone else subsidizing my previous desktop PC building hobby - I used to build a new machine every few years until around 2009. Alas, the markets have chosen laptops and tablets - costing considerably more for less computing utility than desktop machines - in exchange for sleekness and portability; a large percentage of laptops end up being stationary. I blame almost 20 years of TV commercials showing consumers deliriously shopping for insurance in their living rooms on a laptop.

 

[Scotty321]

For my uses and preferences in pocketable lights:

Average "path light" or "seeing something a little better" light I usually use the 16 lumen "medium" setting on my 14500 Clicky (0.7" head dia; floody). I'll use the 405 lumen "turbo" mode for quick identification of surroundings when outside, and the high mode (232 lum) when searching for something outside in the dark within 25 yards.

High lumen applications (populated and well lit city-suburban environment): a 300-500 lumen flood light (like a COB) works great for me when working/repairing something up close or something in the shadows with a streetlight nearby. 700-1000 lumens flood light works well for identifying or working on things up to 15 yards away (from light source). 300-400 lumens works fine for me in a spot light (tight hotspot) for identification out to 50 yards. 600-700 lumens out to 100 depending on how tight the beam is. 800+ lumens for spot lights past 100 yards (tight hot spot)... but usually these have heads that are starting to get too big for pockets.

My issue is finding a good combination beam that works well for my needs. I've been pretty satisfied with popular offerings from SF, Streamlight, Nitecore, Eagletac, and Fenix for combination beams with ~1" bezels (haven't tried other brands). I like the floodier lights for my personal needs, but it can work against me in certain environments, e.g. when I'm trying to identify something over 25+ yards away but I'm surrounded by close equipment, brush, or fog, which reflect spill and affect my night vision.

 

[CanAm]

My brightest is +/- 525, and to be honest I can't imagine really ever needing more. Maybe 600-700 in a very floody light, though I have 1000 lumen mains power work light that is frequently TOO BRIGHT, despite being full-flood.

I do like having various levels of power though. 500 is good to have in your back pocket, but for around-the-house or work use usually something in the 20-200 range is much more appropriate. My most-used light is 140 on high and about 40 on low and I find that's good for most of my uses.

Run time is a much bigger concern, I'd take a long-running 200 over a short-running 500 in most situations. Dead batteries are a pain at best and dangerous at worst.

CRI is also very important - I don't care how bright it is if it's 6600K and purple.

 

[Megalamuffin]

Around 500 lumens with a good flood is about the most I need. I work in construction and use a light every day and it’s nice to have something fairly bright but not eye scorching.

 

[parang]

100 lumens for EDC, 1000 for a thrower, and 3000 or more for a nice CRI flood light used for photography and videography.

 

[Tasky]

People are saying they NEED thousands of lumens! For what?!?! Are you lighting a football game singlehandedly on a cloudy moonless night?!
This is probably just an old-man rant, but momma mia. It's nuts to read people talking like they NEED a 1000+ lumen light for their normal EDC usage! Sheesh!

Depends what your every day is like.
I move around the house, so will want 1 lumen or less.
I work inside PCs and engines, so will want 15-30 lumens.
I work inside man-entry pipes, so will want 200 lumens of throw.

However, I walk the dogs in big empty fields, at night when there is no-one else around so they can run free off lead, so will want 1000 lumens or more in order to spot one black dog and another very well camouflaged brown one, as collar lights aren't 360º or bright enough beyond 30yds... especially around crops, tall grass and shrubs. At that point, it is pretty much like lighting a football game singlehandedly!

I also live in the UK, so we can't carry weapons... but a blindingly bright torch isn't a weapon, and given that most people know I carry it every day, I could quite easily argue it's not specifically intended for use as a weapon.

So to that end, I need one torch with different levels for different situations.
I've needed 1000+ lumens most often when lighting situations up for other people, be that finding something dropped, or lighting an accident scene for the ambulance crews and Police.

People who say they have to check a huge property, well, yeah, people did that for centuries with a torch or candle by walking around.

And it was far easier to sneak past their guards back then! 😛

I think a lot of people who "need" more lumens, really need more throw, not lumens.

Depends.
A reasonably decent hot spot with some throw on it is good for keeping an eye on the above-mentioned dogs, but first finding them in the periphery of that spot requires a decent flood.
I generally prefer more of a flood, myself, so the more lumens being pumped out in that 120-150º arc, the better. I have a 1600 lumen TK11 which is an awesome tool... but totally useless on a foggy night, and even small amounts of moisture/dust/pollen/whatever in the air just results in this BEAM of throw that does more to block my view of what I'm spotting than it does to actually illuminate it. Under those conditions, it's like trying to light your way with a Lightsaber!