Hurrican SANDY 2012 - Prediction as to LIGHTS OUT?

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TedTheLed

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I dont suppose anything short of distillation would render flood water itself potable.

Freezing is just about the only ill this purifier is heir to. Not much of a threat around here.
Clogging is easily dealt with by simply reversing the flow with the supplied syringe..otherwise the flow rate from gravity alone is a claimed 1 liter a minute..
 
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H

Hooked on Fenix

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I dont suppose anything short of distillation would render flood water itself potable.

Freezing is just about the only ill this purifier is heir to. Not much of a threat around here.
Clogging is easily dealt with by simply reversing the flow with the supplied syringe..otherwise the flow rate from gravity alone is a claimed 1 liter a minute..

If you want to get a Sawyer filter for emergencies for yourself in southern California where, I agree, there is little chance of it freezing, go for it. It would be a great filter for you. However, this thread is about Hurricane Sandy and those living through it's aftermath on the east coast. They just got through a Noreaster that caused snow. I would not recommend the Sawyer filter for them at this time as it can easily freeze and get destroyed quickly if they use one. Please be careful when you say that freezing of the filter is not much of a threat around here. People on the East Coast may take this as an endorsement that it won't freeze under their current conditions instead of the warmer conditions of southern California where you are.
 
Burgess

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I dont suppose anything short of distillation would render flood water itself potable.


Not just Distillation, but Fractional Distillation !


See post # 213 by Sub_Umbra, above.
 
W

will

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My daughter had an apartment in Long Beach, that is on the south shore of Long Island. Fortunately, she was able to get some of her belongings out before the storm. The apartment did get flooded out and she did lose some furniture. She was not there during the storm and got back a few days after to clean out the apartment.

She has been able to move to a new apartment in a different town.

One comment, she has been dealing with F.E.M.A and has had a lot of good things to say about the agency. They have been helpful with her breaking her original lease and getting her security back. It could be she has been working with a 'good guy' or dealing with an apartment lose is simpler that dealing with a house.

Long Beach is still a real mess. Flooding really makes a mess of everything, not just the regular mess from wind and rain in a hurricane. There are still issues with power restoration and just getting rid of all the debris.
 
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TedTheLed

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Hooked, I lived in New York City for 15 years, I am aware of the weather there. I think youre nitpicking about the freezing issue. No one is going to die because they ordered a Sawyers .02 from Amazon. It wont die if it freezes without water in it. If its freezing out, and there is water in it, keep it warm in your place of abode, or in your pocket, like a good photographer keeps his, or her, film, or a flashaholic keeps it's batteries. Better to drink purified than not, especially when equipment and sources of heat may not be available..



If you want to get a Sawyer filter for emergencies for yourself in southern California where, I agree, there is little chance of it freezing, go for it. It would be a great filter for you. However, this thread is about Hurricane Sandy and those living through it's aftermath on the east coast. They just got through a Noreaster that caused snow. I would not recommend the Sawyer filter for them at this time as it can easily freeze and get destroyed quickly if they use one. Please be careful when you say that freezing of the filter is not much of a threat around here. People on the East Coast may take this as an endorsement that it won't freeze under their current conditions instead of the warmer conditions of southern California where you are.
 
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StarHalo

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A 30% increase in births is expected this summer for those areas affected by power outages during Hurricane Sandy. Glad you all on the East Coast found something to do!
 
EZO

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A 30% increase in births is expected this summer for those areas affected by power outages during Hurricane Sandy. Glad you all on the East Coast found something to do!

There is a high likelihood that this is merely a myth, of the urban kind. The same statement was made after the Great Northeast Power Blackout of 1965 but was eventually revealed not to be true as has been the case in many other natural disasters where people are confined to their homes for long periods of time.

Of course, time will tell.
 
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turbodog

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All well said, and the power grid is just the tip of the iceberg. Our roads and bridges are in a sad state also, not to mention our high speed internet capability. Most of those in charge are short sighted and only can see quarterly profit margins.

Ironic that you're calling people in charge 'short sighted' and this thread is full of people complaining about a few days without power.

:)
 
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jtr1962

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Ironic that you're calling people in charge 'short sighted' and this thread is full of people complaining about a few days without power.
Actually, people without power is related to the short-sightedness of those in charge. This area has plenty of trees and other things which take power lines out of commission in heavy winds or heavy snow (both of which occur often enough around here that they should enter into long-term planning decisions). As a result, all the power lines should have been buried decades ago. Yes, it'll be a hit on the profits of the local utility during the tenure of whatever CEO happens to be in charge then, but it's the correct thing to do in the long term. Down the road the utility will save more than it spends fixing the same power lines over and over again. Because any expensive capital projects impact the next several quarters at least, they never get done. Another great example-electrifying the mainline freight railroads. Once diesel fuel passed about $2 a gallon this would save money over the long haul. And of course, it wasn't done because none of the RR CEOs wanted to be the ones with a big loss from electrifying during their tenure. It wasn't like this 75 or 100 years ago. People spent more now if necessary to save even more down the road. The fact is far fewer people should have lost power. And power should have been restored a lot quicker to those who did. Modern society can't function without electricity. Remember this is an area where people are very heavily dependent upon electrical power. Imagine some elderly person needing to climb 20 flights of stairs because the elevator is out. And what about the subway tunnels going under the East River being out of service for weeks due to flooding? All of this, including the ConEd substations which were flooded because they were underground in lower Manhattan, could have been averted with better planning. Yes, we got through it, but future storms will probably come even more often, and might be even worse. In my opinion, the entire Northeast dodged a bullet this time. Yes, we sustained heavy damage, but if not through sheer luck it would have been way worse. If the storm surge was another 2 or 3 feet higher, even more of the subway would have been out of commission. I hope we learned from this storm. Good disaster planning involves doing whatever you can to prevent the worst from occurring, not fixing stuff which didn't need to break after the fact.
 
T

TEEJ

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I believe the irony was that the people who did not plan for needing a flashlight, etc....were complaining about the power company not being prepared. IE: The pot calling the kettle black.

So, YES, BOTH were not prepared....and, YES, both SHOULD HAVE BEEN.

:D
 
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will

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Does anyone really think that the existing power companies will spend the $$$ to bury the power lines? Trees will no longer knock down the lines, but, underground? What about water damage? There are lots of areas on Long Island that are currently subject to flooding. LIPA ( power company ) does routinely trim branches away from the power lines. Unfortunately, when the entire tree goes down, it will take the wires with it.

Natural disasters will occur from time to time, no matter how prepared we can be, there will still be issues.
 
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jtr1962

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Does anyone really think that the existing power companies will spend the $$$ to bury the power lines? Trees will no longer knock down the lines, but, underground? What about water damage? There are lots of areas on Long Island that are currently subject to flooding. LIPA ( power company ) does routinely trim branches away from the power lines. Unfortunately, when the entire tree goes down, it will take the wires with it.
We can run cables on the bottom of oceans with no problems. Certainly we can put power lines underground which aren't harmed by water. Sure, the power companies don't want to spend the money to bury the cables because in all likelihood the financial benefits of doing so won't happen until the next CEO's tenure, or perhaps the one after that. It's all the same type of short-sighted mentality. Nobody is willing to have losses under their watch to pay for a large capital project, no matter what the long term benefits of that project. Anyway, besides the obvious freedom from tree damage, buried power lines have lots of other advantages. Their temperature is more stable, thus making any electrical properties which vary with temperature more stable. And you get rid of the ugly mess of overhead power lines which is an aesthetic eyesore.

There will of course always be unforeseen problems when natural disasters strike. That shouldn't preclude reasonable preparations, such as burying power lines in storm-prone areas, and making structures out of reinforced concrete instead of timber in areas prone to hurricanes.
 
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will

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We can run cables on the bottom of oceans with no problems. Certainly we can put power lines underground which aren't harmed by water.

A single power line in the ocean is different than power lines buried in a residential area. It is relatively easy to waterproof a single line that goes for a few miles. Residential areas would need connections for each household. There also has to be access for all the step down transformers. Those are the large cans, you see on every few poles.
 
EZO

EZO

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Does anyone really think that the existing power companies will spend the $$$ to bury the power lines? Trees will no longer knock down the lines, but, underground? What about water damage? There are lots of areas on Long Island that are currently subject to flooding. LIPA ( power company ) does routinely trim branches away from the power lines. Unfortunately, when the entire tree goes down, it will take the wires with it.

Natural disasters will occur from time to time, no matter how prepared we can be, there will still be issues.

Municipalities, even smaller ones bury power lines all the time. Many towns in Vermont have opted to bury their power lines. Since we often experience ice storms the initial costs of burial lead to long term savings in repairs and fewer power outages. Additionally, a few towns that are comprised of architecturally important historical buildings have had the opportunity to eliminate telephone poles and wires and thus maintain the vintage look and feel of what the town was like long ago. Literally, just yesterday, our local paper published an article about the town of Jamaica Vermont opting to bury some of its power cables while a sidewalk was being torn up.

(Since the link I've included may disappear, here is an excerpt.)
Jamaica Selectboard approves burying wires

By CHRIS MAYS / Reformer Staff
Posted: 05/06/2013 03:00:00 AM EDT
Updated: 05/06/2013 07:25:07 AM EDT

Monday May 6, 2013 JAMAICA -- The Selectboard decided to move forward with putting electrical wires underground while a sidewalk project is still in works.

"If you drive down and look at the island, you see a telephone pole that the (Jamaica Community) Church uses to light the church," said board member Lou Bruso. "So, my idea was that since the sidewalk is going to be ripped out next to the church, they're going to put the handicap access ramp in there, that that will be an ideal time to perhaps take that wiring and put it underground rather than run it over to that pole."

Bruso told the board about his idea to put the wires underground at the previous Selectboard meeting, which will include removing the telephone pole and the stake, then putting the wiring from the church undergound.
On April 29, Bruso brought price estimates to present to the Selectboard. The project was approved after discussion."
 
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will

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I think that putting the power underground is a good idea overall. There are some hybrid setups, the main feeder lines are underground, then they go above ground to the individual drops. In addition to the power lines on the poles, there are the following:
Cable TV
Old copper telephone lines
the new FIOS - Verizon's version of cable TV using all fiber lines.
 
EZO

EZO

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For the most part, at least around here, everything goes up on the poles but as I've mentioned previously lines are often being buried. One of the the things I've seen happening is that new fiber optic is being placed underground in conduits that can handle whatever else comes along in the future, either electrical or telecommunications.
 
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will

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One of the the things I've seen happening is that new fiber optic is being placed underground in conduits that can handle whatever else comes along in the future, either electrical or telecommunications.

The 'OLD' phone company some years back did bury conduit along the main lines. These are serviced by tombstones, those boxes that seem to come out of the ground. Still, when they get to the residential areas, they go back up on the poles.
 
EZO

EZO

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will, I'm not quite sure what you mean by the "OLD" phone company, we have a fairly new one in northern New England, FairPoint. Be that as it may, here in mostly rural Vermont the term "residential area" often has a whole different meaning. As I've said previously, in most places everything is indeed up on poles but increasingly lines are being buried, even out where I live in the middle of nowhere. It is important to consider that not everywhere matches your frame of reference in New York.
 
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will

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will, I'm not quite sure what you mean by the "OLD" phone company,

I think the sequence of phone companies went something like this - New York Telephone, bought out by Bell Atlantic, bought out by NYNEX, bought out by Verizon....

Not sure if it was New York Telephone or NYNEX that installed the underground conduit.

I am referring to a suburban area, not rural. They buried the conduit on the major roads, where it gets to the actual houses, it comes above ground.
 

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