Installed Nichia 219 into Surefire U2, now top 3 modes are all max brightness...???

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Norcimbus

Norcimbus

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
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118
Location
Michigan
Anyone have any help with this issue, or experienced this before?

I agreed to install one of the newly available (to me anyway) Nichia Hi-CRI 219 emitters into a member's Surefire U2, and everything went fine, until I tested the light and found that the lowest two settings on the rotary dial work fine, but starting at the third level, throughout the remaining levels, the emitter gives off identical output (at least no perceptible change in output).

I tried to troubleshoot by installing a cree xpg, and the same problem was present. Re-installing the stock emitter (I'm not even sure what it is, too new to the flashlight game I'm afraid😱) resulted in a return to normal operation.

I haven't asked the customer if it is acceptable for the light to only have three modes, because to me that seems unacceptable. Has anyone had this problem with an xpg install, and if so, is there a fix?

I've thought about whether the Vf of the newer emitters is lower than the stock emitter Vf, but I have no idea why this would effect the current output level of the higher modes. Also, I've read threads describing xpg emitter swaps with no mention of reduced mode level function.

Help!?!

-Jon
 
What was the original emitter? If had to guess, it sounds to me like you hit on the problem: different Vf. I remember swapping a premium-bin Seoul P4 into an older PrincetonTec Apex, and it resulted in slightly altered behavior as well - when the spotlight button was pressed, it went to a brightness beyond High Mode until the button was released.
 
The U2 is probably one of the older ones with a Luxeon V LED with Vf in the 6V range and using a boost driver. By changing out the LED to something in the 3V range, you are now driving the LED with a Vin > Vf, that is you are no longer in a boost condition.

Post a photo of the original LED.
 
Uh oh...Ok, thanks for the replies, I will post a pic of the old emitter later today and go from there.

I don't suppose there's a simple solution to allow installation of an ~3V Vf emitter if the driver in fact has a normal Vout of 6V? Adding an emitter (2x Nichia) comes to mind but I don't know how the beam would look.

I may have really stepped in it here, looks like I fell victim to the silly assumption that I would only need to worry about current when swapping single emitters. I can always put it back to stock but that would be a shame.
 
I am the customer who's U2 is giving Norcimbus the problem's. While my U2 may not get the upgrade I am still looking forward to one of his E2E drop ins.

I am wondering if there might be a different high CRI LED with a 6v Vf, maybe a slightly older one. Anybody have any suggestions for an emitter upgrade, preferably high CRI or even warm or neutral, but even a cool tint would work. By the way Jon, I fully expect to reimburse you for the any extra parts or time you incur, and appreciate your effort! And thanks to all who respond to this thread, you CPF'ers are a great community!


John
 
Below is a grainy image of the emitter, it has a black plastic case with four flat leads extending out the sides (one on each side removed by Surefire, the remaining soldered to rectangular copper pads on the heatsink. It appears to possible be a four-die emitter, although they're very closely spaced. The border of the die area under the lens has a hexagonal shape. Hopefully that will be enough to ID.

Photo%2520on%25206-4-12%2520at%252011.jpg
 
Just put leads on the output wires and measured ~6V across the emitter when on high, I think that settles it. If anyone knows of a way to step down the voltage or otherwise allow for installation of a 3V Vf emitter I'm all ears.

I'm going to experiment with a double emitter setup, maybe the beam will be acceptable. Thanks everyone for solving this one for me, I'm determined to get Jacklight up and running with a newer emitter if at all possible.
 
Looks to me like a Luxeon Lux V

Typical Vf on these is 6.84v with a max of 8.31v @ 700mA! What a bummer that surefire used a voltage regulating circuit vs current limiting.
 
Norcimbus, have you tried running the XPG or nichia in the light with a 17670 single cell?
 
Maybe you could use an easywhite 6V XM-L and sacrifice beam quality? Your description sounds like a luxeon V, but I don't know if SF made lights with the luxV stock.
 
Good ideas, I'll have to talk with the customer and possibly do some experimenting with different emitters. Since High CRI is a priority, I don't know whether or not an XML will fit the bill (if EZW tints are anything like the single dies). I will let everyone know what I end up trying, and what works. I haven't tried a li-ion power source, if that's an option the light's owner likes I may try going that route.
 
Yep, that's a Luveon V... Best bet is to remove the stock reflector and sub-in 2 smaller diameter reflectors, wiring the 2 new emitters in series [I think it should be series, as that would split the voltage btween the two, correct?].

Would be reminiscent of a Milkyspit U2SE [snake eyes] mod
 
Good idea, although I have a hunch that if I make a pcb that arranges the two Nichias immediately adjacent to each other, it just might be close enough to a point source that the beam looks good. I will definitely wire them in series. I seem to remember someone (maybe Milky) doing this with a single reflector and it seemed to work well from what I read. I don't know if this is how the customer will want this mod to go, but if it works well, maybe it will be a good way to use those great emitters.
 
Two emitters in one reflector is what Nailbender does with his "Linger Specials", results in a very floody beam. *He uses 2 x XP-G in an XR-E reflector. *Milky used to swap in 4x emitters (IIRC they were Rebels) and reflectors in his setups (named U2x2).

As for the stock driver/6v setup, the XM-L easywhite is a 6v emitter, basically an updated MC-E with the 4 dies connected 2s2p. *It is available in HiCRI as well.

Cheers,
Nova
 
I am looking now at an Easywhite LED (thanks Nova!) I am on a website called todaycomponents.com, and searching for a high CRI one. They have part numbers for at least 100 different bins, everything from cool to 90 CRI, but it looks like all they stock is about 9 different ones and they are all standard CRI. Price is cheap, 5 to 10 bucks, and you can order just one. I am going to do some more searching. I have a hunch that it is hard to get a high CRI Easywhite, based on my limited googling so far.
This is a data sheet from the website:
http://www.todaycomponents.com/media/datasheet/XMLEZW-02-0000-0B00T527F.pdf
Can anybody tell me the difference between a 2 step and a 4 step LED?

Thanks everybody,
John
 
I am looking at the MCE's now, same website (thanks Norm!) and it looks like the same deal, high CRI are not stocked.
I guess the hunt begins... Googling turns up nothing so far.
One more question, of those 2, the MCE or the XML, which would throw better, and would one be easier to install than the other?

Thank's for the help,
John
 
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