Keeping things in perspective...

[ringzero]

Most of the detailed analysis and micro-criticism of headlamps that goes on here is valuable as a reference, but I wonder sometimes if we "allow the perfect to become the enemy of the good."

Really, in the great scheme of things, all the nitpicking about low not being low enough, having to go through extra clicks to get the output you want, etc. is fairly silly. And I should know, because I've been one of the worst nitpickers. ;>

Nearly all of the headlamps that get talked about here, even the inexpensive ones available in big box stores, are far ahead of what was used in the great outdoors not all that long ago...

I used various 2AAA, 2AA, 2C, 2D, and 4D incan headlamps for the great outdoors.

The smaller ones didn't offer much in the way of output or runtime. OK for use around camp, very limited night hiking, or as backup lights.

The bigger ones had decent output and more runtime, but required a heavy, bulky beltpack. Carrying a big headlamp with a set of spare cells was often too much additional weight for backpacking.

All of these headlamps offered ONE output level. Well strictly speaking, you could get a different output by changing out the stock bulb. (Bulb with lower output for more runtime, or a higher output bulb for less runtime.)

My other option was a carbide lamp, with 4 hours of runtime per charge. Massive output with several hundred lumens of flood was great for night hiking, night backpacking, and caving. The big downside: once fired up, you were pretty much committed to burning through that 4 hours of fuel. Turning it off for more than a few hours with the intent of restarting it later could be problematic, and would cut way down on runtime.

Nowdays even the inexpensive LED headlamps, those with the lamest user interfaces and questionable water resistance, are far ahead of what was available not all that long ago.

Be happy to have a headlamp that isn't too heavy!

Rejoice at having usable ouput with decent runtime!

Learn to appreciate any UI that lets you set usable outputs without too much aggravation. ;>

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[robostudent5000]

all true. but i think the pursuit of better things spurred on by the knowledge that the possibility of perfection exists is what keeps most of us coming back here for discussions. that's why i'm here. back in the days of incan headlamps, you lived with the bulk, the crappy beams, the short runtimes because you knew that there were no better options. why bother being dissatisfied when satisfaction was not an option. but now, there are options. the world of lighting technology is advancing at a rate we haven't seen before. and only by trying different things, and having discussions about them can we figure out what it is that we are really looking for, what applies to us and doesn't. sometimes, the discussions devolve into whining, and that's not cool. cuz that's not helping anyone, least of all the whiner. so we shouldn't whine. and shouldn't encourage that. and especially, please, no more whining about the 3AAA format. please, i beg you all. but i think we should encourage curiosity even if it comes from a little bit of dissatisfaction, because without that where would we be. not here, definitely.

 

[tedh]

Good points. I ran across my Petzl zoom and Petzl micro the other day. I remember when the Zoom was state of the art, with 3 AA batteries. Whole thing weighed a half pound, I think. And then the Micro came out, with 2 AAs in the same housing as the lamp itself! Wow!

And now we have multiple levels, programmable levels even, single AA formats, and that's not even counting the improvements in efficiency.

Ted

 

[ringzero]

Good points. I ran across my Petzl zoom and Petzl micro the other day. I remember when the Zoom was state of the art, with 3 AA batteries. Whole thing weighed a half pound, I think. And then the Micro came out, with 2 AAs in the same housing as the lamp itself! Wow!

Ted

Petzl has long been a leading headlamp maker.

Petzl incan headlamps were among the very best available, back in the day.

Petzl carbides were expensive, but truly state of the art headlamps. They didn't have much real competition in the area of high quality, long runtime carbide lamps.

Petzl also made expensive, but excellent, Incan/Carbide hybrid headlamps that were also state of the art.

I never owned any of those expensive top of the line Petzls, but was able to borrow different models to check out from time to time. All were excellent headlamps.

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[ringzero]

all true. but i think the pursuit of better things spurred on by the knowledge that the possibility of perfection exists is what keeps most of us coming back here for discussions. that's why i'm here.

Perfection is illusory. Don't allow the perfect to become the enemy of the good.

There will always be brighter, more efficient emitters coming down the pike, making obsolete the headlamps you bought a few years back.

Get outdoors and enjoy using the headlamps you have now. ;>

back in the days of incan headlamps, you lived with the bulk, the crappy beams, the short runtimes because you knew that there were no better options. why bother being dissatisfied when satisfaction was not an option. but now, there are options.

There were options back in the day when incans ruled.

Petzl offered incan headlamps with a two bulb setup, for throw or flood. There were also fancy bulbs with dual filaments. All sorts of battery packs were available.

People modded production headlamps with NiCad or lead acid battery packs, diffuser lenses, higher output bulbs, different reflectors for throw and flood.

Beam quality could actually be pretty good, with decent color rendition and very good throw if desired.

the world of lighting technology is advancing at a rate we haven't seen before. and only by trying different things, and having discussions about them can we figure out what it is that we are really looking for, what applies to us and doesn't. sometimes, the discussions devolve into whining, and that's not cool. cuz that's not helping anyone, least of all the whiner. so we shouldn't whine. and shouldn't encourage that. and especially, please, no more whining about the 3AAA format. please, i beg you all. but i think we should encourage curiosity even if it comes from a little bit of dissatisfaction, because without that where would we be. not here, definitely.

You make some good points here.

The point I've been trying make in this thread, is that there are some darn good production headlamps available at very reasonable prices.

Are they perfect? No, of course not.

Are they good enough for most purposes? I'd say yes, and getting better as time goes by.

Enjoy using what's available right now, and be on the lookout for improvements.

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[robostudent5000]

...The point I've been trying make in this thread, is that there are some darn good production headlamps available at very reasonable prices...

...Get outdoors and enjoy using the headlamps you have now. ;>

dig it! :thumbsup:

 

[gcbryan]

I'm guessing that those who are the most interested in this subject are also among those who are getting out there. I know I am. It's the same in scuba diving as well. The most frequent posters are told to go and dive but most of them do dive as much or more than those giving that advice.

The point is well taken that all of these headlamps that we discuss are good particularly by yesterdays standards.

However this is a discussion board and those most passionate about headlamps will not have much to discuss if every thread has to be about "How did you use your headlamp today" or "What's a good headlamp" 🙂

It's kind of like watching the news on TV. Some people complain that all the news is bad and that the good stories aren't told. Although good news is great for the people involved it's not particularly interesting to discuss or watch 🙂

How many threads will most of us continue to read if they are all about how great Surefire, Petzl, etc. are?

If a thread was entitled "All headlamps are good...get out there and hike" how much more is there to say about that subject 🙂

I do agree however that we have it good. When I was a kid I wasn't interested in lights at all. Even several years ago when someone gave me a Surefire 6P for Christmas I thought...OK...it's a flashlight...uh...thanks.

As Robostudent mentioned it's only because good lights are easily available that there is even anything to discuss. In the day of 6V incand 2 D cell flashlights there was nothing to discuss. They sucked and weren't likely to be any different the next year either 🙂

 

[ringzero]

Good points, gcbryan.

I wasn't intending to discourage any discussion of headlamps, or elevate any particular brand above other brands.

I love most headlamps and flashlights, including cheaper ones that work well, and appreciate discussions of even the less expensive brands that can be found in big box stores.

For casual use - camping, nighthiking, or use around the house - those Energizer 6-LED headlamps look pretty decent for the 15 bucks they cost, including batteries. For backpacking, I'd prefer something more robust and water resistant, but the Energizer 6-LED would probably suffice. I've backpacked with far worse.

I have many memories of changing burned out bulbs in my headlamps, bulbs that seemed to wait to burn out at the worst possible time. Of using headlamps only in short bursts to conserve the batteries. Of struggling to find trail markers using headlamps with dimming, yellowish beams.

When viewed against the backdrop of those memories, that Energizer 6-LED is looking pretty darned good!

Sometimes, it seems to me, we become excessively critical when discussing some model headlamp, often based on fairly minor flaws. I don't want to see us discourage newbies from trying their first decent headlamp and seeing how useful it can be.

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[robostudent5000]

I have many memories of changing burned out bulbs in my headlamps, bulbs that seemed to wait to burn out at the worst possible time.

and singeing your fingertips because the bulb was still too hot to handle... i definitely don't miss that.

 

[gcbryan]

Halogen dive lights always seemed to work in the parking lot and die just after you got in the water 🙂 I had one UK dive light that had a backup bulb that would swing into place when you turned the switch in the other direction. That seemed like a big deal...dive saved!

Regarding newbies and headlamps...I am a newbie and am not discouraged by my or anyone else's critical discussions 🙂

I used to work in the testing and developing of new products to find the faults before they made it to the production stage so I guess it drives me a little crazy to see easily preventable flaws making it into production headlamps.

It is great however that we are at the stage where we are talking about details rather than major issues as in the not too distant past.

 

[ringzero]

I used to work in the testing and developing of new products to find the faults before they made it to the production stage so I guess it drives me a little crazy to see easily preventable flaws making it into production headlamps.

It is great however that we are at the stage where we are talking about details rather than major issues as in the not too distant past.

I understand how you could have that reaction, coming from a product development background.

I've never worked in that area, but still feel great frustration when a maker like Petzl produces what is nearly a perfect headlamp, except for one little detail that drives me crazy! ;>

That one little detail means that while I realize it's a great headlamp, it's not a perfect headlamp - for me.

However, I now realize that in the past I've been overly critical of Petzl and some of the other manufacturers. They make products to sell in a competitive marketplace, not to satisfy the whims of impossible to please flashaholics.

We should be thankful that there are many competitors in the headlamp marketplace offering so many products. Compared to the not very distant past, we are living in headlamp nirvana.

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[Sparky's Magic]

I agree with all the above. I would like to state that, as I see things, the quest for more lumens seems to, at times, overshadow other important issues. This is not true of all manufactures and thankfully we have the likes of Malkoff, HDS., Surefire etc. who are dedicated to beam quality and acceptable runtimes.

I find it exciting that we can choose not only tint in an accurate Kelvin deg. but also output in a variety of beam shapes; not to mention Color Rendering Index. All good stuff!

 

[gcbryan]

Chasing the lumens is a lot of the problem I think. When companies "update" their product line their main focus seems to be on being able to advertise more lumens in the new product. In the meanwhile they change good aspects of their older line and introduce negative aspects for no apparent reason other than either insufficient testing or simply insufficient thought.

Given that there are a few different manufacturers it's a shame that most of their offerings are more or less the same.

Petzl says that they are taking a look at upgrading the Tikka line but I don't really have a good feeling that this will mean anything other than increasing the lumens and randomly changing one or two other characteristics and hoping that all will be well 🙂

 

[ringzero]

Petzl says that they are taking a look at upgrading the Tikka line but I don't really have a good feeling that this will mean anything other than increasing the lumens and randomly changing one or two other characteristics and hoping that all will be well 🙂

Oh ye of little faith! ;>

Petzl has been making headlamps for a long time, longer than most all of their competitors. Over the long haul Petzl headlamps have gotten better. They do have the occasional mistep when introducing a new model, but usually straighten things out in subsequent iterations.

What I'd like to see Petzl do is to bring back the old Tikka XP, but with an upgraded emitter.

They wouldn't need to change anything else, just upgrade the emitter to double the output. I think the old XP was one of the best, if not the very best, all around backpacking and general outdoor lights. Great close up light for tasks and reading. Great little trail light, with a bit of extra punch in reserve when needed. It was even better looking than the new XP2. ;>

Of course they'd have to call it something else to avoid confusion with the existent Tikka line.


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[gcbryan]

Oh ye of little faith! ;>

Petzl has been making headlamps for a long time, longer than most all of their competitors. Over the long haul Petzl headlamps have gotten better. They do have the occasional mistep when introducing a new model, but usually straighten things out in subsequent iterations.

What I'd like to see Petzl do is to bring back the old Tikka XP, but with an upgraded emitter.

They wouldn't need to change anything else, just upgrade the emitter to double the output. I think the old XP was one of the best, if not the very best, all around backpacking and general outdoor lights. Great close up light for tasks and reading. Great little trail light, with a bit of extra punch in reserve when needed. It was even better looking than the new XP2. ;>

Of course they'd have to call it something else to avoid confusion with the existent Tikka line.


.

I more or less agree with this. I would like to see a red LED added rather than a filter and I'd like to see it made waterproof and be somewhat regulated just to be up with the times.

However if all they did was to update the emitter I'd certainly buy it!

 

[ringzero]

I more or less agree with this. I would like to see a red LED added rather than a filter and I'd like to see it made waterproof and be somewhat regulated just to be up with the times.

However if all they did was to update the emitter I'd certainly buy it!

gcbryan, maybe you should consider the Tikka +2 for 32 bucks:
http://www.brightguy.com/products/Petzl_Tikka_Plus_2_LED_Headlamp.php

I agree that the Tikka XP2 is sort of pricey at 55 bucks, but this model appears to be nearly the same thing, lacking only the sliding diffuser.

At 32 bucks the +2 is more tempting to me than the Tikka 2 at 30 bucks.

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[gcbryan]

gcbryan, maybe you should consider the Tikka +2 for 32 bucks:
http://www.brightguy.com/products/Petzl_Tikka_Plus_2_LED_Headlamp.php

I agree that the Tikka XP2 is sort of pricey at 55 bucks, but this model appears to be nearly the same thing, lacking only the sliding diffuser.

At 32 bucks the +2 is more tempting to me than the Tikka 2 at 30 bucks.

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Looks like a good deal but I have two headlamps (just bought EOS for $35) so I'll wait to get a Petzl when there is something like a true upgraded version of the old XP. From all the report (and from my personal experience) most people who had the old XP are disappointed with the XP2.