Lance Armstrong done______

kaichu dento

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

...no; perception doesn't become truth. But it does become what the vast majority of folks believe is the truth.
Unfortunately this is all too true.
On a baser note, Armstrong made millions as a professional athlete. Not just winning races but sponsorship dollars as well. Who is really going to give up on all of that? Who wouldn't fight for that if they weren't guilty?

On a much higher note, you're going to let down all of the young kids who look up to you as a hero? You're going to do that if you're not guilty??
Just because a spectator cannot fathom why one would continue in the face of difficulty, or why they would give up when it seems unreasonable from the outside, does not mean that there can be only one conclusion.
Lacking facts and knowledge, presumption should not be allowed to rule the day.
 

TONY M

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

I imagine not many can believe his pleas of innocence anymore... he is well and truly smoked now.
The question now is will or won't he admit guilt. :thinking: Lots of money at stake either way.
 

Fresh Light

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

My opinions on whether he doped or not are exactly that, just my opinions. But that fact remains that he finished in first position 7 times in the TdF and an 8th podium standing. There were many cheating riders, who were caught, out there that couldn't beat him. Were those riders not at an advantage or at least at a level playing field? Yet they could not beat him. That is why I think he's the greatest TdF rider in history, irregardless of the outcome of any of this.
 

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

On a baser note, Armstrong made millions as a professional athlete. Not just winning races but sponsorship dollars as well. Who is really going to give up on all of that? Who wouldn't fight for that if they weren't guilty?

What if they don't have the money to fight it? What if they don't have the energy to fight it? How do you think Apple wins so many cases that either they initiate or are initiated against them - they've got all the money and lawyers in the world and will out arbitrate any company that comes up against them.

The truth is - some fights just aren't worth fighting.

On a much higher note, you're going to let down all of the young kids who look up to you as a hero? You're going to do that if you're not guilty??

Unfortunately our youth is fickle, as is most of the world. Our heros are always forgiven no matter what their malaise and life goes on. This will blow over in another year and no one will care because there will be propaganda over the next news breaking item.
 

z17813

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

What if they don't have the money to fight it?

Armstrong has an estimated net worth of $125 million. The USADA is a non-profit NGO that has a yearly budget of approximately $13-15 million.

What if they don't have the energy to fight it?

A fair point and certainly one that Armstrong made. Though I would like to believe that people would continue to fight to clear their name if they are innocent and accused of cheating, especially when their life's work and legacy is at stake.

The truth is - some fights just aren't worth fighting.

While a matter for the individual about whether or not to fight I would think it would always be worth it to, if possible, defend your name.


The USADA now say that the "....different categories of eyewitness, documentary, first-hand, scientific, direct and circumstantial evidence reveal conclusive and undeniable proof that brings to the light of day for the first time this systemic, sustained and highly professionalized team-run doping conspiracy."
They also have testimony from 26 individuals including 15 riders.
I am not sure how Armstrong could possibly defend himself against that, though if as he maintains he is innocent, I think it is unfortunate that he would not use some of his considerable resources and media influence to do so.
 

jtr1962

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

Not really a defense per se, but it seems just about every rider at that level was doping. In the interests of consistency, if they strip Armstrong's titles because of doping, they'll need to go down the line until they find a "clean" rider to hold the title. Good luck with that. Besides, if nearly everyone was doping, the playing field was pretty much level.
 

Monocrom

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

I imagine not many can believe his pleas of innocence anymore... he is well and truly smoked now.
The question now is will or won't he admit guilt. :thinking: Lots of money at stake either way.

It's a lot like a civil case in which the NYPD gets sued for wrongful death. They settle out of court. The victim's family gets a gag order not to talk about the settlement. And the NYPD doesn't admit to any wrong-doing. But, the fact that they paid out is the admission of guilt. Being the NYPD, and not a private individual, it's not as though they couldn't fight due to a lack of money in their savings account. Armstrong isn't the average person. He's worth at least a few million dollars. If he had wanted to, he could have fought it. (At least from a financial perspective.)
 

97catintenn

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

Speaking of money, Lance is holding one last card. Next year, he'll write a book, "The Real Story" and be right back on top!

Remember the saying about bad publicity, :)
 

Monocrom

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

Not really a defense per se, but it seems just about every rider at that level was doping. In the interests of consistency, if they strip Armstrong's titles because of doping, they'll need to go down the line until they find a "clean" rider to hold the title. Good luck with that. Besides, if nearly everyone was doping, the playing field was pretty much level.

Saturday Night Live once, obviously as a joke, proposed a special Doping Olympics. Designed specifically for those on the juice.

Sounds like the guys in the biking world decided that was a great idea.
 

Monocrom

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

Speaking of money, Lance is holding one last card. Next year, he'll write a book, "The Real Story" and be right back on top!

Remember the saying about bad publicity, :)

Oh please. I predict his book will be in the Bargain Bin selling for $2.oo six months after it comes out. No one is going to care what excuses a disgraced national athlete will be able to come up with, and put into print.

When Ben Collins (former Stig on Top Gear) wrote that tell-all book of his because he was greedy for more money, the bad publicity surrounding it backfired. His book was one of the biggest flops in UK publishing history. He sold out his friends, and his good-name. Lost his job too. All for what? A bit of extra money. Collins also had a side business related to his driving talents. You can bet that suffered as well.
 

ShineOnYouCrazyDiamond

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

I'm not really concerned about Armstrong's future money making deals - and if he is it doing for more money or not. I wouldn't buy the book either way.

I think the move he made was smart. It sounds like he knew he was guilty and bowed out before both he and his name were publicly dragged through the dirt. But now he only has to worry about the case through one side. They can throw as much evidence of the obvious out there but he doesn't have to acknowledge or respond to it. He was already doomed - personally I think he made a very wise tactical decision early on. Whether or not the decision was ethically correct is not something I care to get into a conversation over because that is all a matter of opinion.
 

kaichu dento

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

I imagine not many can believe his pleas of innocence anymore... he is well and truly smoked now.
The question now is will or won't he admit guilt.
How people can know what they don't know is beyond me. :thinking:
The evidence against him is anything but concrete and at best people should continue with their own lives and quit weighing in on either side of the unknown.
One thing is for sure - there are those who would have forced him to defend himself all the way to the grave and his decision to get on with his life shows that he actually has one.
 

blasterman

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

Saturday Night Live once, obviously as a joke, proposed a special Doping Olympics. Designed specifically for those on the juice.

HeHe.......various riders can be sponsored by the drug company of their choice.
 

TONY M

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

How people can know what they don't know is beyond me. :thinking:
The evidence against him is anything but concrete...
Not entirely sure what you mean? As a former competitive road cyclist who does not live with his head in the sand I have known what Armstrong has got up to and who he has associated with for over 10 years, the evidence is clearly there and is as close to undeniable as you are going to get. It is interesting to hear lately from the horses mouths the wipers now coming out that have been going around in the cycling would for many years.
 

Monocrom

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

One thing is for sure - there are those who would have forced him to defend himself all the way to the grave and his decision to get on with his life shows that he actually has one.

What?

His Life was biking. When you're a professional athlete to the extent that he was, his life consisted of biking in competitions or training to bike in competitions. That training eats up so much time, there's barely room for socializing. You're right about Armstrong having a life. It was one filled with training and competiting. And he just threw all that away. Will be interesting to see what he does next.
 

Chicago X

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

Not sure if you're being sarcastic or serious. The New York Times isn't respected by any New Yorker except Uber liberal Manhattanites...

Are you sure this isn't code for something else ?
 

jtr1962

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

His Life was biking. When you're a professional athlete to the extent that he was, his life consisted of biking in competitions or training to bike in competitions. That training eats up so much time, there's barely room for socializing. You're right about Armstrong having a life. It was one filled with training and competiting. And he just threw all that away. Will be interesting to see what he does next.
Very true. I don't even compete and I'd say cycling on average takes up a good 40 hours a month of my time (25-35 hours actually riding, then time working on my bike, looking at data from my rides, reading about cycling, etc.). The pros easily spend at 6 or 7 hours a day training, most of the rest figuring out how to optimize their training and equipment. When they're no longer competitive (Lance probably still would have had perhaps 5 more years, maybe even more, where he would be reasonably competitive) they go into coaching or other pursuits related to cycling. He can't do any of that now. The only thing he can do now is ride a bike recreationally or as transportation. That can hardly replace being involved in the sport at its highest levels.
 

Launch Mini

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

Just an observation.
So, many of his teammates he raced with were taking PED, that were not caught by the strict testing, yet Mr A was clean.
Mr A has said many times, he has been tested and passed. Well apparantly so his teammates were "dirty" yet passed these same tests.
Just making an observation.
I agree, he has won the TdF 7 times. That is a fact. Did he win it within the rules? Yet to be determined.
 

TedTheLed

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Re: Lance Armstrong done contesting drug allegations

one thing for sure; he won with testicular, lung, and brain cancer, and a brain operation for necrotic tumors. there should be EXTRA medals for that.
 
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