Legend LX- P60 conversion

[**DONOTDELETE**]

A month or so ago a member published the procedure to replace a Legend LX lamp with a Surefire P60, or for that matter a P61.

Does anyone know where I can retrieve that information?

 

[Bushman]

try to get a hold of quickbeam or aragorn i think that they are working on something to that effect...

 

[Gandalf]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Quickbeam:


Bushman - there were a bunch of beamshots out there. I believe the Legend LX was actually as bright or brighter than the P60 module, but the beam wasn't as clean.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've found the Legend LX, mine at least, to have a beam almost identical to my 6P. Some lamps I've had for my 6P weren't even as nice as the Legend LX's. Besides, there's something about putting an $18 lamp into a $20 flashlight.... OK, I admit that I tried it; but as there was virtually no difference in the beam, i went back to the stock legend LX lamp.

IIRC, doesn't the reflector on the P60 module push against the lens itself? This makes Lens meltdown a virtual certainty, using a P-61 module, unless you have a Pyrex lens...(?)

 

[TrevorNasko]

wimps all of you! p60 p61, is that your best? im sackin' 200 FRIGGAN LUMANS OUTTA MY SFLXHOLA!!! bow down, before its too late you simpletons!

sure its gusling 3 cr2 batts at a time but it doubles as a hand warmer
really now, did ya expect less from the lord of middle earth?

 

[mikep]

Odd- I can't locate the previous thread, where kogatana first posted his discovery that SF lamp assemblies fit.

Unscrew the head of the light, then unscrew the lens holder and take out the reflector. Take out the batteries. Look up into the flashlight body and you will see the white plastic lamp holder, and the wire 'retaining ring'. If you have really skinny needlenose pliers, you can grab the wire and pull the ring out. otherwise, you can snag part of the retaining ring with a thin blade screwdriver or similar, and push the lamp holder down throught the body. The surefire lamp assembly takes the place of the reflector when you screw the lens holder back on the head.

 

[Bushman]

now for the $1,000,000 question how much brigher is it. since the ledgend lx stock is brigher than the e2 (60 lu.) and the p-60 is 65lu. how much is the stock ledgend?

 

[Quickbeam]

Bingo, mikep - well described. I think KT removed the thread.

Aragorn and I have P61 modules on order - a 120 Lumen Legend LX! YA-HOOOOOOOOO!

(watch as the lens melts into a plastic blob...)

Bushman - there were a bunch of beamshots out there. I believe the Legend LX was actually as bright or brighter than the P60 module, but the beam wasn't as clean.

 

[mikep]

I currently have an LX hacked in half, and a section of 3/4" copper pipe waiting to be epoxied/soldered together long enough to hold 3 123 batteries. I'll see your 120 lumens and raise you 100!!!

 

[mikep]

Hey Aragorn- what did you use to extend the LX body to fit 3 batteries?

 

[Quickbeam]

KT - Good idea - I'll look into it.

Aragorn's a bit "over the top" there, eh?

Absolute power corrupts absolutely!

We're getting together again this weekend, so whatever he's done now to that poor LX, I'll post pics of!

 

[TrevorNasko]

extend i never extended anything cr5 is shorter than 123. power hahahaha heehee

 

[Mr Ted Bear]

HI QB and Aragorn,

Hope you can provide more specific details on those Quest NiHm 123s.

Last I sproke to Peter, he will be getting several sets for evaluation. If things work out, he said he would consider becoming a US distributor..... well, at least we would save on the shipping

 

[TrevorNasko]

look and see for your self

 

[Quickbeam]

OK! More details on Aragorn's 2 Quest 123a Rechargables.

Voltage 2.9 and 2.89 volts fully charged.

mAh not given anywhere, but someone good at math might be able to figure it out based on the numbers below and the wattage of the lamps tested.

E2 runtime test

minutes - Lux at beam center

00 - 1150
04 - 921
10 - 771
11 - 400 *losing it...
12 - 100 *pretty much dead

So about a 10 minute runtime at good light.

Since a normal set of 123a last 90 minutes in an E2, and these lasted about 10-12 minutes, the mAh should logically be about 1/8 to 1/9 that of the mAh in a normal 123a (does this make sense or am I way off?)

P61 runtime test was very quick - start at 5500 lux at beam center, "brown down" at 3 1/2 minutes, dead at 4 min.

Now these tests were done with "constant on". Momentary flashing type use may last longer.

BTW, a close look at the diameter of the batts shows that there is about a 1 mm thick layer of cardboard wrapped around the outside of the battery with the Quest label on it - effectively expanding the diameter of the battery. Under the cardboard a green plastic coated rechargable battery can be seen, but we didn't want to remove the cardboard for fear of ruining the battery. So it looks like this is actually a slightly smaller rechargable battery which has had it's diameter expanded so that it works in 123a applications.

The Quest charger had the batteries fully recharged in less than 40 minutes.

On a side note, when testing the P61 module runtime, it was installed in a Legend LX. The lens became warm after 4 minutes, but you could hold your finger on it and withstand the heat, so it didn't get too hot. There were no signs of meltdown. Oddly enough, a little bit of condensation formed on the inside of the lens as it cooled, but it evaporated instantly when we opened the light. The metal head and the body of the light became very warm, so the heat seems to conduct down the springs behind the reflector and into the body and the batteries.

On a cool note, at 2 inches we were able to get one of those science store "hand boilers" to bubble after about 10 seconds of shining the beam on the base

- pretty cool!

 

[Klaus]

@Aragorn,

using 3 CR2´s you swap the 1300ma of a CR123 against the 800ma of an CR2 - not so shure if this is really such a good idea runtimewise - and at least here the CR2 are even more expensive than the CR123s. I think someone on the SFDB (or here) did that earlier on and got very dissapointing runtime as would be expected by the theory.

@Quickbeam & Aragorn on the rechargeable 123s

Thx for posting that info - this is what I initially expected and my reason for not shellin out 100 bucks - I became a bit unshure when Aragorn got that excited about them - maybe the magic rings of his elve friends did give him some extra charge on those though

Some math and thoughts - at 10 min runtime compared to 75 you don´t even need to start calculating - but I think&guess that the guys are just putting two 1.2V NiMhs cells into that housing and freshly off the charger this would correlate with the measured voltage - actually this setup would get sucked down to approx 2 - 2.2V right away at that load so the 10 minutes runtime aren´t draining the battery empty but the voltage just gets too low for some useful output - using these in the ARC LS might give better results though as Peters circuit should drain the cells to a better degree.

As you posted re the 1mm cardboard - as it is around the cell maybe 2mm total - the 123 is 17mm - an AA is 14.5 - close enough. GP offers an 1/3 AA cell at 14.5mm dia and 16.6mm height - CR123 is 17 x 34,5 - I think this would mean the guys are just using 2 x 1/2 AA cells which IMO is the reason for the lousy runtime - the 1/3 AA cells are 250ma !

Quickbeams math of 1/8 runtime would be 1300 / 8 = 162ma - given the low voltage of 2 NiMhs this also would make sense that the 250ma aren´t fully used due to too low voltage.

I think for anyone who wants to use this setup its possibly easier and cheaper to just buy 2 (or 4) of those cells and create his/her own set of rechargeable 123s. BTW - there are quite a bit of those cells at GP cells and various setups are possible - like using 2 of the 4/5 AF cells in an 3 cells SF and using the 3P/E1 bulb to get longer runtime as those are 2100ma. Or two 2/3 AFs at 1000ma with E1 bulb in the E2 for approx 1h. Best bet maybe if SF are really to cancel the LiIOn project is to use a bundle of 3 1/2 AFs at 600ma which is around 2 123s length and then you have 3,6V and 3V or so under load and using this in the new regulated Sfs might be nice. Lots of choices to play with. This search for the rechargeable 123s had been discussed last year already on CPF when the 2/3As had been brought up as the best physical retrofit but I´m not shure if anyone ever tried it out.

Klaus

 

[Glow Bug]

Thanks Quickbeam and Aragorn for this test. It was very helpful to find out the real deal. I was going to order but decided to wait the weekend out since Quickbeam was going to test them this shortly. Again, thanks Aragorn for allowing us to obtain this info.

 

[TrevorNasko]

let me get this straight-
i pay 100 usd
give my morning to battery tests

in return all i have are a pile of "arent you stupid ,geuss you 'sucked and saw'" type comments along with one or two thank yous.

dont forget that there was no info on these before me. be grateful that i saved you 100usd. as for me -im not an leo and these are an affordable way for me to carry 123 lights. dont begrudge me my ranting as i have been nice and indured the impatient comments for quite a long time.
as for you youve spent enough time listening to me rant. you need to get back to trying to find 123s under $3 each

thank you for listening. i feel better now. please excuse me for offending any body

 

[Klaus]

@Aragorn,

I was the one who weeks ago wrote about that "suck and saw" as the guy from Quest told me to "suck and see" and I was interested in your findings - I pretty much think most everyone is happy that you not only bought those parts but also gave us the chance to participate in the results - even when they are IMO not as good - but again this in no way was to give you bad feelings - again my thanks to you and Quickbeam - and also in my earlier post where I speculated about what cells were possibly used in those parts I started with thanks to you and Q.

Klaus

 

[TrevorNasko]

thanks btw they are NOT n batts i measured and the 123 under the mask is still fater than an n

 

[Quickbeam]

I finally got around to putting the P61 module in the Legend LX. I became irritated when the LX kept getting out of focus. Turns out the bi-pin bulb was working it's way out of the socket and therefore changing the focus.

If you want to do it, this seems to be the best procedure:

Remove the head, tailcap, and batteries. Pull out the bulb.
Press with your finger on the ceramic bulb holder.
Reach into the battery compartment with a long probe and hook one of the curves on the clip at the end.
Press with your finger while applying pressure to the clip. The clip will come loose and the ceramic disk will press into the body.
Remove the clip and disc.
Place batteries in and attach tailcap.
Open head and remove old reflector.
Drop in P60 or P61 and close head.
Screw head onto light body until resistance is met - the head will just start to cover the 2nd O-ring on the body.
Blast away!

The lens seems quite resistant to the heat. The bulb does not touch the lens. The reflector does press against the lens, but I imagine the reflector presses against the lens in SF lights as well, it's just hidden by the lip of the bezel.

Enjoy!