Lumens Factory Questions

[CQB]

(i think i posted this in teh wrong section so I am now posting it here)

received my LF lamp assemblies! Didnt take too long either.

Does anyone knwo if the HO-M3T will work with the SF M6? I know I can use the HO-M3T with three 123s but I was hoping it would be ok to use with 6 123s in parrallel as well.

Also I am using the EO-4 with my SF 6P and rechargeable 3.7V PILA cell. I charged the cell completely but I dont think this lamp is giving off the advertised 190 lumens. Rather it looks like a typical 60-65 lumens output from a normal 6P with 2x123s. I thought the Lumens Factory outputs were torch lumens(?), and I mean actual lumens passing thru the lens, etc... not bulb lumens.

Anyone have any comments or explanations/advice?

Overall I am pleased with the build quality and am happy these products are available to begin with.

And the EO-M3 in my SF M3 puts out a RIDICULOUS amount of light!!!! very happy with this!! Great for spot checks while on night shifts, etc.

Tks!
CQB

 

[KentuckyMike]

I thought the Lumens Factory outputs were torch lumens(?), and I mean actual lumens passing thru the lens, etc... not bulb lumens.

According to the LF website "...lumens output listed in this table is the maximum bulb lumens..." Great products, overall, though! Bright, good runtime, good quality, and very fair prices.

 

[DUQ]

Does anyone knwo if the HO-M3T will work with the SF M6? I know I can use the HO-M3T with three 123s but I was hoping it would be ok to use with 6 123s in parrallel as well.

Tks!
CQB

I would have to say yes.

 

[mdocod]

The M3T series lamps from LF should work in the M6, but keep in mind that the bulb will be driven harder in the M6 and will have a lower life.

LF will generally replace lamps when premature failures occur in *supported* configurations, I would NOT consider the M6 a supported configuration and therefor would not request a replacement if you were to have a premature failure. (though many folks here have had success with the LF M3T lamps in M6s, I just want it to be clear that it is hard on the lamp, and that you should do so "at your own" risk.")

LF lamps have always been listed as *bulb* lumens @ voltage @ amperage @ CCT. They give more detailed information about their bulbs than any other tactical lamp manufacture I am aware of, which gives us as CPFers the power to calculate pretty accurately how the lamp will behave given various battery configurations, and we can always calculate torch lumens with the simple 0.65 conversion.

Keep in mind, that the EO-4 is a HIGH CURRENT / LOW VOLTAGE lamp, lamps of these types are the most critically effected by resistance issues and/or battery performance issues.... I highly recommend cleaning and pro-golding contacts in you 6P to improve performance.... I don't know much about SF switches, but maybe it can be dissembled and cleaned up as well.

Overall, Pila makes pretty darned good cells... I assume you have a 600S cell? I would check that the cell is coming off the charger at 4.2V open circuit. (with a volt/multi-meter)

here are some more things to keep in mind when trying to determine why the EO-4 may not seem as bright as it's supposed to be....

The 190 lumens claimed by LF is at 3.7V, then you multiply that by 0.65 to get torch lumens... ~120 torch lumen when you have 3.7V at the bulb.. If the cell or charger isn't performing "up to par" or you have a lot of resistance, then that number drops fast..

have a look at the charts over here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=117117

The EO-4 draws about 2.35A, you can take a look at the performance of the 600S cell at 2 and 3 amps on the charts, and kinda figure the performance will be in-between these 2 discharge graphs, closer to the 2 amp performance.... So you can pretty much figure that the cell is going to start off at about 3.8V, and steadily decline from there, dropping below 3.7V pretty quickly. ending around 3.25V before it "drops out" and should be recharged. So more realistically speaking, after resistance losses, you are probably starting around 120 torch lumens, and ending around 80 torch lumens after around 45 minutes.

With this in mind, you could gain runtime stepping down to the HO-4, and you may not loose much noticeable performance at all...

The EO-4 is a tough call IMO, I think it would be a little better suited to a high quality 18650 cell.

Now, a P60 from Surefire is under-rated by SureFire. The SF lumen rating is as follows IMO:
To state a guaranteed minimum performance that is extremely conservative, The only time the output drops below the stated claims, is towards the end of the discharge..

The SF P60 IMO, could also be rated as follows (rough estimate): 4.8V, 1.2A, 130 bulb lumen.
Such a lamp would actually start off around 95 torch lumens, and diminish to around 50 torch lumens before falling on it's face...

Now this brings me to a very important point: It takes LARGE differences in output for a human to really perceive much change. So, if you are comparing 95 torch lumens, to 120 torch lumens, that's barely enough to notice, it takes about 30% difference before a human can say "yes, I see a difference" and you are just barely at a 30% difference there. (fresh cells either configuration).. a full 100% difference (double) is where things become very obvious. So when thinking it's time for an "upgrade" in performance, I suggest looking to a light that is at least double where you are at now. If not more...

 

[Dinan]

Sorry if this is a little off topic but I recently received 2 EO-E2R LA's from LF and they seem to have some fitting issues. One of them is almost identical to the stock lamps in my E2D, allowing the bezel to screw down *almost* all the way. But the second one, while not appearing different to the other, prevents the bezel of the E2D from completely covering the o-ring.

Should I contact LF or just try and sand it down myself?

Here's a pic of the 2 (don't have any pics of the LA inside the E2D yet):

See if you can guess which one causes the bigger problem... heh

 

[CQB]

mdocod: thank you for such a detailed response, much appreciated!

i will try to get a higher quality / newer 18650 cell and will re-evaluate.

yes i will try the HO-M3T with my M6 at my own risk. If the lifespan of the lamp decreases so be it, i will reorder more from LF. I am very impressed with the quality thus far from LF. Albeit I too had a fitting issue but with the EO-M3. That was quite the tight fit! The bulb was slightly crooked when potted so i was sure the bulb itself was going to burst whiel putting it in the bezel, but luckily it *popped* in fine. Whew!

 

[mdocod]

well keep in mind, an 18650 won't fit in a 6P...

Idunno if it would be a big enough difference to bother with anyways, (like I was explaining before, how it takes large differences to make a noticeable difference.)