More EV fires after salt water flooding

mrfixitman

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No amount of solar panels in a car can make enough power to even turn ac compressor, maybe a small fan, but definitely not an AC compressor
Heat pumps are a bit more efficient. These guys made solar vehicles that work. The formula is 850 pound weight. Moped wheels 15kwh battery, 1.5kw solar panel, coefficient of drag .16, 5 passenger with a trunk. Top speed 80 mph. Ability to cruise, not touching the battery, at 45mph infinitely, in bright sun. solarteameindhoven.nl Not sure if they had air conditioning but in August in Australia you might need it. Their last race car had a 1,200 mile range. In bright sun.
 
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TPA

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No amount of solar panels in a car can make enough power to even turn ac compressor, maybe a small fan, but definitely not an AC compressor
C'mon, you're just being pessimistic. A Renology 320w solar panel measures 65.6"L x 39.4"W, which is in the ballpark size of a car roof. A Tesla Model S has a ~100kW battery pack. So, in theory, with no losses at all and the panel operating at 100% it'd only take 52 days (assuming 6 hours of peak sun) to charge the battery.








Of course, theory isn't reality.

Standby losses on a Tesla are pretty extreme, approximately 1kWh/day, or ~70 watts continuous. When the car is turned on, it draws about 400 watts continuous at idle, no AC. Reports on the Tesla forum show the car uses 2kW-5kW to run the aircon, so you'd need about 20 of these solar panels to run the aircon safely. So ~360 sq ft of solar panels, a bit larger than a typical hotel room footprint, is needed just to run the aircon.

See? simple! It's the future!
 

alpg88

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A Renology 320w solar panel measures 65.6"L x 39.4"W
And how many watts does a heat pump need? 3x as much minimum, and that is excluding all loses. like i said in reality it would not even turn the compressor a single revolution. Future is always based on reality, not a politically motivated wishful thinking. but you know what is based on that? chaos, destruction of functional society.
 

mrfixitman

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And how many watts does a heat pump need? 3x as much minimum, and that is excluding all loses. like i said in reality it would not even turn the compressor a single revolution. Future is always based on reality, not a politically motivated wishful thinking. but you know what is based on that? chaos, destruction of functional society.
Engineering is involved here. You can't run an F 150 on a few panels. It is just too inefficient. However a 1.5 kw solar panel, attached to the roof, can push an efficient design 1,200 miles solarteameindhoven.nl
 

TPA

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And how many watts does a heat pump need? 3x as much minimum, and that is excluding all loses. like i said in reality it would not even turn the compressor a single revolution. Future is always based on reality, not a politically motivated wishful thinking. but you know what is based on that? chaos, destruction of functional society.
For cooling, a heat pump usually consumes slightly MORE power than a traditional straight-cool aircon. When you're doing a cool-only system, you can optimize the condenser (outside coil) and evaporator (inside coil) for the task at hand.

When you do a heat pump, the coils have to be capable of handling both heating & cooling, which are two different functions, so you end up with coils that don't excel at heating or cooling, thus more inefficiency.

In the case of a Tesla, the HVAC system can draw 5kW when running.
 

mrfixitman

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I just saw this.
For 27 out of 30 days in April – and the last 17 days straight – we have had stretches of time ranging between 15 minutes to 9 hours where the production of renewable energy sources (wind, solar, hydro, etc..) exceeded the demand on California's main energy grid.

Then we exported the excess to other states.

As the Scientific American put it, "It is impossible to understate how monumental this clean, renewable energy milestone is..."
 

Lips

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I just saw this.
For 27 out of 30 days in April – and the last 17 days straight – we have had stretches of time ranging between 15 minutes to 9 hours where the production of renewable energy sources (wind, solar, hydro, etc..) exceeded the demand on California's main energy grid.

Then we exported the excess to other states.

As the Scientific American put it, "It is impossible to understate how monumental this clean, renewable energy milestone is..."

California has the 3rd highest cost of power in the United States... California ranks 47 out of 50 states for power cost...
 

alpg88

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Messages
5,418
For cooling, a heat pump usually consumes slightly MORE power than a traditional straight-cool aircon. When you're doing a cool-only system, you can optimize the condenser (outside coil) and evaporator (inside coil) for the task at hand.

When you do a heat pump, the coils have to be capable of handling both heating & cooling, which are two different functions, so you end up with coils that don't excel at heating or cooling, thus more inefficiency.

In the case of a Tesla, the HVAC system can draw 5kW when running.
Ok......... so hvac system in tesla draws 5KW, and the best solar panel today, the size of the car roof makes 320w, that is 15.6 times less than required. You just proved my point, solar does not make nearly enough power to run tesla's AC.
What point exactly are you trying to make?
 

TPA

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Ok......... so hvac system in tesla draws 5KW, and the best solar panel today, the size of the car roof makes 320w, that is 15.6 times less than required. You just proved my point, solar does not make nearly enough power to run tesla's AC.
What point exactly are you trying to make?
Sarcasm, of course!

I've been using solar power since the 1990s and still have every Home Power magazine ever published... and while the technology has improved over the years, it's still nowhere near practical for most uses. Major, radical improvements in technology need to happen for EVs to be practical for widespread use.

Some of this stuff is just crazy, like a Tesla needing ~500 watts at idle, no aircon on. My entire home idles at less than that!
5kW for a Tesla's HVAC system in full-cooling mode? My central maxes out around 1.6kW, possibly 1.8kW under absolute extreme conditions.
A Tesla loses about 1kWh of electricity per day parked and turned off. They've sold 4.5 million vehicles. So that's 4.5MWh *per day* consumed by parked Teslas alone. 1,642MWh wasted per year. Keep in mind a space heater only draws 0.0015 MW.
 

tonkem

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Frisco, TX
After reading thru many pages of one party trying to convince us all to use "renewable" energy. The glaring issue, is there is no renewable energy sources available affordably at the consumer level for everyone. As has been stated that some areas get less sun light than other places, and some homes have roof pitches that don't permit the use of solar. I have some in my neighborhood. For me, I drive Hondas and will continue to do so, as they employ a vast number of Americans to build the majority of their cars. They are reliable and last hundreds of thousands of miles when maintained. EV's are in their infancy, as has been stated here as well. There are early adopters that buy them because they want them, my brother being one of them, but he also has the money to purchase them without concern for resale or repairs needed, etc. I don't have any problem with people buying what they want to buy, it is a free country, but telling everything they have to buy them, that is where I have an issue. The free market should decide what is viable, as we are seeing EV demand, even for Teslas, tank right now. The American public is not convinced that EV's are the future, and I am one that agrees. I own 5 Honda's in my family, and will continue to buy them, even if they go full EV in the future, because of the way they take care of their employees and customers, but that is my right to do in a free country. One thing to remember, is to love your neighbor as yourself, and don't talk down to people, but share your own experience and let others make their own decisions.
 

mrfixitman

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After reading thru many pages of one party trying to convince us all to use "renewable" energy. The glaring issue, is there is no renewable energy sources available affordably at the consumer level for everyone. As has been stated that some areas get less sun light than other places, and some homes have roof pitches that don't permit the use of solar. I have some in my neighborhood. For me, I drive Hondas and will continue to do so, as they employ a vast number of Americans to build the majority of their cars. They are reliable and last hundreds of thousands of miles when maintained. EV's are in their infancy, as has been stated here as well. There are early adopters that buy them because they want them, my brother being one of them, but he also has the money to purchase them without concern for resale or repairs needed, etc. I don't have any problem with people buying what they want to buy, it is a free country, but telling everything they have to buy them, that is where I have an issue. The free market should decide what is viable, as we are seeing EV demand, even for Teslas, tank right now. The American public is not convinced that EV's are the future, and I am one that agrees. I own 5 Honda's in my family, and will continue to buy them, even if they go full EV in the future, because of the way they take care of their employees and customers, but that is my right to do in a free country. One thing to remember, is to love your neighbor as yourself, and don't talk down to people, but share your own experience and let others make their own decisions.
Android vs. iPhone is a choice. I used to have an 8 track and a Betamax. Oops. However numbers don't lie.

1. Tesla Model 3

Tesla Model 3

  • 10-Year Cost: $3,587
  • Annual Costs: $169 In Year One, $610 By Year 10
  • Chance Of Needing Major Repair: 8.6%
Smaller than the Model S, the Tesla Model 3 offers the lowest overall expected maintenance and expect repair costs of any car on the market today. Most scheduled service visits involve little more than a tire rotation.

FAQs

What Car Brand Is The Cheapest To Maintain?
Toyota and Honda have typically been among the cheapest brands to maintain, but many models by Nissan, Mazda, and Mitsubishi have low repair costs as well. Among premium brands, Lexus and Tesla are at the top of the list, with good reliability scores and a lower cost of ownership than average.
What Car Lasts The Longest?
The Toyota Sequoia and Toyota Land Cruiser have the longest predicted life span, with many vehicles lasting 300,000 miles or more.
How Long Will Most Cars Last?
Most cars will last more than 200,000 miles with proper maintenance, with some vehicles reaching 300,000 miles or more. The average age of a passenger vehicle in the US is about 12 years old. Assuming those vehicles average between 12,000 and 15,000 miles a year, they have between 144,000 and 180,000 miles on them.
[h2][/h2]
 

mrfixitman

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After reading thru many pages of one party trying to convince us all to use "renewable" energy. The glaring issue, is there is no renewable energy sources available affordably at the consumer level for everyone. As has been stated that some areas get less sun light than other places, and some homes have roof pitches that don't permit the use of solar. I have some in my neighborhood. For me, I drive Hondas and will continue to do so, as they employ a vast number of Americans to build the majority of their cars. They are reliable and last hundreds of thousands of miles when maintained. EV's are in their infancy, as has been stated here as well. There are early adopters that buy them because they want them, my brother being one of them, but he also has the money to purchase them without concern for resale or repairs needed, etc. I don't have any problem with people buying what they want to buy, it is a free country, but telling everything they have to buy them, that is where I have an issue. The free market should decide what is viable, as we are seeing EV demand, even for Teslas, tank right now. The American public is not convinced that EV's are the future, and I am one that agrees. I own 5 Honda's in my family, and will continue to buy them, even if they go full EV in the future, because of the way they take care of their employees and customers, but that is my right to do in a free country. One thing to remember, is to love your neighbor as yourself, and don't talk down to people, but share your own experience and let others make their own decisions.
 

mrfixitman

Enlightened
Joined
Apr 16, 2023
Messages
581
Location
San Francisco
After reading thru many pages of one party trying to convince us all to use "renewable" energy. The glaring issue, is there is no renewable energy sources available affordably at the consumer level for everyone. As has been stated that some areas get less sun light than other places, and some homes have roof pitches that don't permit the use of solar. I have some in my neighborhood. For me, I drive Hondas and will continue to do so, as they employ a vast number of Americans to build the majority of their cars. They are reliable and last hundreds of thousands of miles when maintained. EV's are in their infancy, as has been stated here as well. There are early adopters that buy them because they want them, my brother being one of them, but he also has the money to purchase them without concern for resale or repairs needed, etc. I don't have any problem with people buying what they want to buy, it is a free country, but telling everything they have to buy them, that is where I have an issue. The free market should decide what is viable, as we are seeing EV demand, even for Teslas, tank right now. The American public is not convinced that EV's are the future, and I am one that agrees. I own 5 Honda's in my family, and will continue to buy them, even if they go full EV in the future, because of the way they take care of their employees and customers, but that is my right to do in a free country. One thing to remember, is to love your neighbor as yourself, and don't talk down to people, but share your own experience and let others make their own decisions.
I will not miss going to a gas station. I will not miss laying under a car and changing the oil. I will not miss wondering if my car will pass smog. I would keep going but maybe some here enjoy these diversions.

 

mrfixitman

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Sarcasm, of course!

I've been using solar power since the 1990s and still have every Home Power magazine ever published... and while the technology has improved over the years, it's still nowhere near practical for most uses. Major, radical improvements in technology need to happen for EVs to be practical for widespread use.

Some of this stuff is just crazy, like a Tesla needing ~500 watts at idle, no aircon on. My entire home idles at less than that!
5kW for a Tesla's HVAC system in full-cooling mode? My central maxes out around 1.6kW, possibly 1.8kW under absolute extreme conditions.
A Tesla loses about 1kWh of electricity per day parked and turned off. They've sold 4.5 million vehicles. So that's 4.5MWh *per day* consumed by parked Teslas alone. 1,642MWh wasted per year. Keep in mind a space heater only draws 0.0015 MW.
I left my Model 3 parked for three days. When I went to work I still had 100%. I do turn off all parasitic draws. Except security. I am not sure how much that draws but obviously not much. However since it was in the garage maybe security isn't on. A 120vac space heater might draw as much as .0018 mw or 1.8kw. 1800 watts.
 

mrfixitman

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When one business fails another successful one takes over. It is not the deep state. People are just doing the math.
To add to the his, as more people choose electric and renewables, you think big oil and auto won't respond? The market will be in turmoil. Gas stations are already shutting down due to cleanup regulations. It is simply not economically prudent to continue. You may have noticed some gas stations with EV charging. Those are the ones that will survive. I have already switched. Fossil free since the pandemic,,,,I also prefer glass and paper, when buying food.
 
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