My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce CREE '135' Lumens!

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

flashy bazook said:
greenstuffs,

that is why I quoted flashlightreviews measurements which are standardized, and according to which the U2 is below the P1D CE in light output.

which is amazing given how small in size the P1D CE is - and given that the U2 uses TWO batteries to P1D CE's one.

in my experience, the flashlightreviews measurements have been accurate, and when I compare visually and subjectively the results of flashlights that I have, the ranking is always the same to that you get from flashlightreviews' measurements.

so personally I'll continue to follow and depend on the review data.
The first runs of U2s were rated at mere 65 lumens by SureFire. That's the sample Quickbeam had when wrote the review. The newer runs come with LuxV with higher Bins. That's why SF now guarantees a minimum of 100 lumens instead of 65. Therefore, your data is obsolete.
 
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Ty_Bower

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

I think some people will find the U2 a little brighter than a Fenix P1D-CE/L2D-CE, and some people will find the Fenix a little brighter than the U2. On average, I'd say the two are pretty closely matched for overall output.

I think the Fenix has a relatively tight spot, and will tend to throw a little farther. But, I don't think it's really enough to make a big difference.

I agree completely with Andrew Nik in post #8. The U2 has a more even, uniform output which makes the target easier to view. People say the Fenix rings don't exist, or they don't make a difference once you're spotting something more than 10 feet away. They say it only bothers the white-wall hunters. Well, I think Andrews picture shows the smooth output from the Surefire has less "visual noise" in the image than the Fenix.

I don't know why Fenix didn't bother to put a textured reflector in their Cree series. I'd have gladly paid an extra $10 for it. I am impressed by my Fenix L2D-CE. The output, runtime, form factor, user interface, and convenient battery source all make it a very fine light. My biggest irritation is the stupid yellow ring, which could have been easily diminished by a textured reflector.
 

TORCH_BOY

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

Surefire U2 running with 2 Cells should be as bright if brighter than
the Fenix P1DCE running from 1 Cell
 

thehappyman

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

TORCH_BOY said:
Surefire U2 running with 2 Cells should be as bright if brighter than
the Fenix P1DCE running from 1 Cell

Should be but Is It ?????????
 

Art Vandelay

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

The U2 and L4 had their catalog lumens changed, but this was just to make the estimates more accurate. When they put the first estimates out in the catalog it was a conservative estimate based on the information they had at the time. When they got more information they changed the information they gave us. They did not change the flashlights, and then change the numbers to reflect that change. This was covered very well at the time. They made what I felt was a convincing case that this was not a "marketing upgrade".

Outdoors Fanatic said:
The first runs of U2s were rated at mere 65 lumens by SureFire. That's the sample Quickbeam had when wrote the review. The newer runs come with LuxV with higher Bins. That's why SF now guarantees a minimum of 100 lumens instead of 65. Therefore, your data is obsolete.
 

xiaowenzu

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

yellow said:
as the U2 eats the same current than two Fenixes, why should it not be brighter?

use two Fenixes against one U2 and no doubt what "light" will be brighter, in advance.

If the Fenix was somehow modified to use 2xCr123, the light output would remain the same because it's limited by the LED emitter, but run-time would almost double.
 

Bullzeyebill

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

A one cell (CR123) can run a Seoul P4-U at one amp to the led, and it will be brighter than a U2 with 2 cells. Now, that one amp to led will be hard on the poor little CR123, and runtime will be short, but that little one cell light will be outputting about 150 real lumens. Up the bias of the U2 to one amp to the led with a high flux lux V, and it will be close, maybe.

Bill
 

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

xiaowenzu said:
If the Fenix was somehow modified to use 2xCr123, the light output would remain the same because it's limited by the LED emitter, but run-time would almost double.
That's true. Two batteries = more runtime. Not more lumens. LED's world is not Incan's world.
 

golden_creature

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

surefire always underate their lumens.gc.
 

Lobo

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

Outdoors Fanatic said:
That's true. Two batteries = more runtime. Not more lumens. LED's world is not Incan's world.

I'm afraid that's not true. Depends how the light is designed. For example most 2AA lights are much brighter than their 1AA-counterpart, even though theý use the same circuits.

And for the comparision between the P1D and U2, as someone else said, it's like comparing oranges to apples. One is a small keychain light, and the other one is a larger light for serious use. A better comparison between a luxeon light and a cree would be U2 vs Lumapower M1, Huntlight FT01 Cree etc.
 

xiaowenzu

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

I'm still so surprised that my U2 (rated 100 lumens) is brighter than the supposedly 135 lumen Fenix P1DCE! :D
 

65535

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

SF ratings are nearly always lowballed, and can greatly exceed their ratings, especially in the LED arena, where they rate it at the lowest batch of LEDs, rather than the best, so if you get a better bin than what is rated you will exceed their ratings.
 

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

xiaowenzu said:
I'm still so surprised that my U2 (rated 100 lumens) is brighter than the supposedly 135 lumen Fenix P1DCE! :D
Maybe you should actually by a P1DCE and see for yourself. How can you say your U2 is brighter if you don,t have a P1DCE to compare it with. You quote Led museums review but seem to ignore Flashlight Reviews ratings which I think most people would agree are fairly accurate. Keeping in mind the variables that exist in LED bins, I would not say that my P1DCE is brighter than Your U2.
I would say that all my lights, so far, have tested out relative to flashlight Reviews test, as far as brightness goes.
 

xiaowenzu

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

jled said:
Maybe you should actually by a P1DCE and see for yourself. How can you say your U2 is brighter if you don,t have a P1DCE to compare it with.
Well I just compared it with my friend's P1DCE yesterday and it was certainly noticeably brighter, not heaps but enough for my eyes to discern at a distance. Contrary to the review at 'flashlightreview.com'.... many reviews here and people on this thread have also explicitly stated that their U2 is much brighter to their naked eye than P1DCE.

I think the 'flashlightreview' was using one of the earliest Surefire U2 made, where that particular LED was a rare dud. Maybe he should review the light again, because majority reviews seem to disagree with his findings. :)
 
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xiaowenzu

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

Lobo said:
I'm afraid that's not true. Depends how the light is designed. For example most 2AA lights are much brighter than their 1AA-counterpart, even though theý use the same circuits.
But in the Fenix P1DCE case, it was designed to use only 1 Cr123, so the circuitry is not really optimised for two batts. Therefore, it will only be the runtime that's prolonged.
 

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

Outdoors Fanatic said:
The first runs of U2s were rated at mere 65 lumens by SureFire. That's the sample Quickbeam had when wrote the review. The newer runs come with LuxV with higher Bins. That's why SF now guarantees a minimum of 100 lumens instead of 65. Therefore, your data is obsolete.
Surefire's U2 (or any of their Lux V lights) comes in such "varieties" of quality that a recognizable number of foks actually paid $300 for a lemon?
That's one thing about Cree's XR-E that we can all attest to: their general quality is many times more uniform than Lux Vs.

I wonder why Surefire is switching their lights to Cree-based LEDs when their Lux Vs are obviously superior to the Cree powered lights? :huh2:
I guess this means that all the hype about Surefire "going Cree" in June is rather pointless, and that we should absolutely refrain from buying any Surefires with those inferior Cree LEDs come June, according to some of these "eyeball experts" posting in this thread?
 

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

daveman said:
Surefire's U2 (or any of their Lux V lights) comes in such "varieties" of quality that a recognizable number of foks actually paid $300 for a lemon?
That's one thing about Cree's XR-E that we can all attest to: their general quality is many times more uniform than Lux Vs.

I wonder why Surefire is switching their lights to Cree-based LEDs when their Lux Vs are obviously superior to the Cree powered lights? :huh2:
I guess this means that all the hype about Surefire "going Cree" in June is rather pointless, and that we should absolutely refrain from buying any Surefires with those inferior Cree LEDs come June, according to some of these "eyeball experts" posting in this thread?


Surefire's U2 (or any of their Lux V lights) comes in such "varieties" of quality that a recognizable number of foks actually paid $300 for a lemon?

A lemon?? Surefire never lied about the output of its products, quite the contrary, they underrate the lumen numbers by a good margin. Quite different from our asiatic friends's common business practice isnt it? So if anyone bought the older version of the U2 and got more than the originally stated 65 lumens, how's that paying for a lemon? They ADVERTISED the U2 as a 65 lumens flashlight, not 150!

I wonder why Surefire is switching their lights to Cree-based LEDs when.their Lux Vs are obviously superior to the Cree powered lights? :huh2:
I guess this means that all the hype about Surefire "going Cree" in June is rather pointless, and that we should absolutely refrain from buying any Surefires with those inferior Cree LEDs come June, according to some of these "eyeball experts" posting in this thread?

They are switching to Cree because of the increased runtimes, and that's pretty damn to clear to anyone who bothered browsing through their 2007 catalog. And nobody in this particular thread disagrees that the Cree XR-E is more efficient than Luxeons, nor has anyone mentioned that the Lux V is "better". The consensus here though, is that the Cree XR-E-- or SSC P4 for that matter, are not necessarily brighter than a good Luxeon 5. Quit the childish cynism will ya?
 
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Lobo

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

xiaowenzu said:
But in the Fenix P1DCE case, it was designed to use only 1 Cr123, so the circuitry is not really optimised for two batts. Therefore, it will only be the runtime that's prolonged.

Hence "Depends how the light is designed.".
The fact that the P1DCE is designed for just one battery makes this a pretty unbalanced comparision. A more interesting one would be the cheap creed U2-clone and the original.
 

xiaowenzu

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

Lobo said:
A more interesting one would be the cheap creed U2-clone and the original.
A dangerously over-driven U2 clone is NOT a fair comparison! :laughing::grin2::lolsign:;)
 

Lobo

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Re: My Surefire U2 (100 Lumen) brighter than Fenix P1dce '135' Lumens!

Who said it was overdriven?
Don't know if we're talking about the same light here, since there are a bunch of different versions of the "U2-style cree", but I have never heard anybody said any of them were overdriven? :thinking: But I said more interesting one, not fair. :) It's not that fair to compare old tech with new tech anyways.
But if you insist, as I said before, other better comparisions between LuxV and Cree would be Lumapower M1, Huntlight FT01 etc. But the whole point might be moot since Surefire is comming out with crees themselves "soon".
 
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