New to me compressor: Quincy QT-5 ...

[wquiles]

Just finished getting the compressor mounted/bolted down.

I am using 3 concrete screws to prevent the base from "walking" and wanting to rotate, and on those three ears I am using vibration/isolation pads that Campbell Hausfeld sells just for this exact use (although the kit comes with 4 and I am only using 3):

And then to make "sure" it can't tip over and cause any harm/damage, I got this strap which is bolted to studs on the wall:

Will

 

[precisionworks]

using 3 concrete screws to prevent the base from "walking" and wanting to rotate,

As long as the bolts are not tight to the mounting pads, your installation is fine. Tight bolts will cause one or more pads to eventually shear off ... here's a quote from an Atlas Compressor manual:

For permanent installation, the ATLAS air compressor may be bolted to the floor.
BE CAREFUL NOT TO BOLT DOWN ALL THE LEGS TOO TIGHTLY!
Shims or vibration pads must be used to level the compressor before bolting it to the floor. When an air compressor "starts", the entire unit begins to "vibrate". This movement is normal. If all the legs are bolted tightly to the floor, the "vibration" of the air compressor (either starting or stopping) may damage a "bolted down" leg. Greg Smith Equipment recommends the use of vibration dampener pads to be placed between the bottom of the foot and the concrete floor. These vibration pads allow the air compressor to "shake" during the start up and run time without causing any damage to the receiver feet.

 

[wquiles]

I used compression washers to get things tight, but not enough to prevent some very slight movement - I felt that if they were too tight, the compressor would eventually get the screws loose. The rubber pads also help in allowing some slight rocking/shaking while the compressor is running, and it also makes things quieter - before I used the pads you could feel the vibrations on the concrete floor.

Still, it was because this slight movement possible between the rubber pads and the washers that I decided to add the strap as a secondary holding method in case the screws do get loose in the future: I have two small kids and I did not want to take any chances with this top-heavy 600+ pounds compressor.

 

[precisionworks]

I did not want to take any chances with this top-heavy compressor

Reminds me of the time we first moved into this area & I drove to Home Depot & picked up a 60 gallon vertical compressor. They loaded it into the bed of the pickup & I proceeded to try to drive under a low bridge ... only the pump & motor struck the bridge, but it made an awful sound as it hit the tail gate 😱

Because of purchase protection from Mastercard, the purchase price was refunded in full & the next one went home in the horizontal position 😀

 

[StrikerDown]

... only the pump & motor struck the bridge, but it made an awful sound as it hit the tail gate 😱

One of those moments!

Something you can look back at and (maybe if you're sick in the head)

I think they shipped it to Kalifornia and I saw it at Home D the other day!

 

[wquiles]

Quick update for those following this thread ...

The compressor has been working flawlessly. Quiet and smooth, with very little vibration.

I have been checking the output filer (Motor Guard) and it is almost always dry.

The outlet max temperature is still cool enough to keep my hand on the tubing right after it stops running, and the output tube that comes from the inter-cooler to the tank is always at about room temperature.

The only way I have managed to get the output tubing to get really hot, it to manually force the compressor to run 3 times in a row (by venting the tank's air). At an ambient of about 80-85F, I managed to get the output tubing to reach 216F, but the output tube from the inter-cooler was a much cooler 92F - those inter-coolers DO work !!!

 

[tino_ale]

wquiles, I see you are using a motor guard. Are you also using a water trap ? an oil trap ?

Oil trap. Water trap. Filter. Motor guard. I am confused as to what does what (does a water trap filter oil and fine particles too ?) and what is needed for which application.

Anyone care enlighting me ?

Also, in which CFM rating should you get these filters/traps to make sure you are not slowing your air tools ?

Thanks

 

[wquiles]

Tino,

My Quincy came with an air cooled aftercooler which drops down significantly the air temperature, which helps a lot in getting the water in the air condensed quickly. After the aftercooler, the air goes into a moisture separator, which automatically releases water once it is "full" (I have this draining to outside the garage):

Then the air goes into the 60 gal tank where it further condenses the water, which then precipitates down to the bottom of the tank where every other day or so I then purge out via its own separate drainage hose:

The output of the tank goes into a 3/4" ball valve - this is my main ON/OFF into the "shop", and the compressor/tank is in great shape since it can keep 160 PSI for many, many days in a row. The output of this main valve varies between a high of about 160psi (compressor turns off) and a low of about 115 psi (compressor turns on). Since most tools have a max. of 120PSI, I have a regulator set to 110psi, which then feeds my Motor Guard Air Filter (this regulator also has a built-in water separator, that drains automatically every time pressure drops to near zero PSI). The air then goes to several "T"'s and additional ball valves to the various places in my shop:

So far since I got the compressor running earlier this year, I have never gotten the Motor Guard filter wet, not even moist to the touch, although I keep swapping it for another one every week or two. So at least for my particular "low" usage, the whole system of the aftercooler & moisture separator is doing a very good job in trapping most of the water inside the tank 😉

Will

 

[tino_ale]

wquiles,

Thanks for the very informative post. It's a pretty serious installation you have there.

The best bang for the buck I can get here is a 24 gallon 3HP running on standard 240V, rated to 9CFM at 100psi... goes up to 145 psi. I don't know if two cylinder necesseraly mean two stages but it's a twin cylinder anyway, running at 950rpm with a pulley. edit : it is actually the motor that runs at 950, apparently, I don't know what's the rpm of the pump.

It is 350 euros ($450 at this time). If I want bigger, it is much cheaper to get two of these and pipe them together because a 50 gallon 6HP is simply more than double this price.

Anyway, I am still wondering if a water trap is a good enough particles filter to forget about the motor guard. I am also wondering how a water trap element works to remove moisture from air ?? Unless the filter is cooled by an active mean I don't see why the moisture would condense on it after any significant amount of time. 😕

 

[65535]

Most moisture traps use a vortex/centrifuge action. The heavier water molecules collect on the walls of the moisture trap while the air flows through the trap. They don't remove all the moisture, but it helps to keep the motor guard filter dryer and is a marked improvement over nothing.

 

[wquiles]

wquiles,

Thanks for the very informative post. It's a pretty serious installation you have there.

The best bang for the buck I can get here is a 24 gallon 3HP running on standard 240V, rated to 9CFM at 100psi... goes up to 145 psi. I don't know if two cylinder necesseraly mean two stages but it's a twin cylinder anyway, running at 950rpm with a pulley. edit : it is actually the motor that runs at 950, apparently, I don't know what's the rpm of the pump.

It is 350 euros ($450 at this time). If I want bigger, it is much cheaper to get two of these and pipe them together because a 50 gallon 6HP is simply more than double this price.

Sounds like a good buy 😀

Anyway, I am still wondering if a water trap is a good enough particles filter to forget about the motor guard. I am also wondering how a water trap element works to remove moisture from air ?? Unless the filter is cooled by an active mean I don't see why the moisture would condense on it after any significant amount of time. 😕

In my humble opinion, No. You still want a good filter like the Motor Guard that I have.

Maybe Barry has additional advice/suggestions?

 

[tino_ale]

Thanks, any additional input appreciated.

I think I got the pump/motor rpm backwards. 950 for the motor sound too low, considering there is a significant rpm reducing factor with the pulley. It must be a 1750rpm motor and 950rpm pump.

It's the best bang for the buck I've found but it's guaranteed chinese made. Definetely mile away from your Quincy quality and finish...

Also I am not sure I can thrust the claimed CFM at 100psi.

Darn I should consider the motor guard. :green:

 

[wquiles]

Anyway, I am still wondering if a water trap is a good enough particles filter to forget about the motor guard. I am also wondering how a water trap element works to remove moisture from air ?? Unless the filter is cooled by an active mean I don't see why the moisture would condense on it after any significant amount of time. 😕

I have what I have by following Barry's advice and it is working extremely well. My 2 cents worth is that the water trap does help but that it is not good enough. You really should also have a filter similar to the Motor Guard as well. I am using the M-60 filter, which is the one Barry recommended, even though it is a little bit of an overkill in my setup (this filter can maintain 100 CFM at 80 PSI !!!). The M-30 is probably more than adequate (45 CFM) and should be more affordable as well.

 

[precisionworks]

I am also wondering how a water trap element works to remove moisture from air ??

There are quite a few ways to eliminate or reduce moisture in a compressed air system. The easiest plug-n-play system is a refrigerated dryer. It lowers the temp of the incoming air below the dew point, so that the air cannot carry that moisture down the line to the point of use. Once the dew point temp is reached, the water vapor can no longer remain in suspension - it condenses out as liquid water droplets which are collected & drained. New ones are pricey but used ones go cheap. http://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...cm_ite=1592072?ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=1592072

If you don't want to spend that much, there are a number of shop built solutions that will reduce air moisture. The first place to trap & drain water is the air receiver tank, and making an air-to-air intercooler lowers the temperature dramatically:

Nothing fancy, just copper tubing from the hardware store, inserted between the pump & the tank. The single best thing you can do to trap moisture at the source.

Next is an air-to-air aftercooler which can be built with a series of pipes & drains:

Next add a 5 micron filter-regulator, followed by a coalescing filter, followed by a desiccant bed filter.

Put a MotorGard on last & you're ready to roll 😀

 

[wquiles]

Although I don't have much oil in the air supply currently, since I am doing powder coating now (and hope to "play" with other coatings later) I installed an coalescent oil filter to my main air line coming out of my Quincy.

Per Barry's advice, the air from tank goes to regulator, then oil filter, and then the M-60 sub-micron air filter:

 

[tino_ale]

It is unclear to me why the water trap is not before the regulator instead of after ? My reasonning is that a regulator could suffer from a wet air.

Another thing that I've read is that you should pipe your water trap as far away from the compressor as possible, because the trap will more efficient with cold air. And the further away from the compressor, the coller the air...

So unless I got it wrong, I would pipe the systems as follow :

compressor > long pipe (for cooling down) > water trap > regulator > oil trap > Moror guard

A small air reserve of several liters piped after the regulator would also improve air regulation, acting as a buffer and dampering air demand.

Then you'd have :
compressor > long pipe (for cooling down) > water trap > regulator > small air tank > oil trap > Moror guard

What you think ?

 

[wquiles]

It is unclear to me why the water trap is not before the regulator instead of after ? My reasonning is that a regulator could suffer from a wet air.

Another thing that I've read is that you should pipe your water trap as far away from the compressor as possible, because the trap will more efficient with cold air. And the further away from the compressor, the coller the air...

So unless I got it wrong, I would pipe the systems as follow :

compressor > long pipe (for cooling down) > water trap > regulator > oil trap > Moror guard

A small air reserve of several liters piped after the regulator would also improve air regulation, acting as a buffer and dampering air demand.

Then you'd have :
compressor > long pipe (for cooling down) > water trap > regulator > small air tank > oil trap > Moror guard

What you think ?

I have seen air system setups that follow exactly what you show, but I was lucky that my Quincy came with the fan-cooled intercooler and water trap already built-in, which makes for a very efficient setup. The way Quincy did the intercooler, they put it right in front of the main flywheel, and gave the flywheel "fan" blades so as it rotates it creates a strong air flow right into the intercooler, accelerating the cooling of the air before it enters the water trap:

The air from the output of the intercooler then feeds this water trap, before entering the tank (the clear hose is for the automatic drain - it purges the water out automatically once it is full):

Without the intercooler and water trap, you would then need the long pipe what you mentioned (like what Barry has implemented in his shop) to give chance for the air to cool down so that moisture/water would no longer by suspended in the air. My system currently looks like this:

compressor - intercooler (cools air) - water trap - air tank - regulator - oil filter - final filter

I will be the first to admit that my setup is not be ideal, but it seems to be working extremely well for me as I found out already by checking the state of my M-60 filter for many months now, there is no water getting into my shop's air, and if there is some, the amount is very small and it is being trapped by the M-60 filter. Adding the oil filter is just additional insurance since I am now doing powder coating (and for future painting) to make sure I don't have any tiny amounts of oil still in the air supply.

EDIT: I forgot to add that at the end of each air output on my shop, I have an air regulator with those built-in small plastic vortex-based water traps. So far they are all dry.

Will

 

[tino_ale]

The fact that your vortex air trap at the very end of your air line remain dry sound like a good indicator that your air is very dry when it powers your tools.

Honestly I wonder if your motor guard would not already filter out tiny oil particles in your air but I see you are a better-safe-than-sorry kind of guy and it sure won't hurt :thumbsup:

I've seen under your blasting cabin that you do have a few spare motor guard filter :devil:

 

[65535]

The fact that your vortex air trap at the very end of your air line remain dry sound like a good indicator that your air is very dry when it powers your tools.

Honestly I wonder if your motor guard would not already filter out tiny oil particles in your air but I see you are a better-safe-than-sorry kind of guy and it sure won't hurt :thumbsup:

I've seen under your blasting cabin that you do have a few spare motor guard filter :devil:

Having a final stage filter that normally comes out clean when opened up is always good. That tells you there is absolutely NOTHING in your air that would harm your paint, media blasting, or tools.

 

[wquiles]

Thanks, I feel better. By the way, this is a photo of the regulator/filters at the end of the lines (one set to 45 PSI the other to about 60 PSI). The valve with the red cover can kill the access locally, which is great since the the orange air line comes from the other side of the garage and it is set to about 105-110 PSI: