Opinions on Radbot 1000 daylight-visible rear light?

[Offroad'Bent]

I just saw a review of the Radbot 1000 rear light.
It looks like a pretty decent rear light for daylight visibility.

Compared with the benchmark Planet Bike Superflash it looks like 1W vs 1/2W for the PBSF , a reflector and perhaps a better switch.

Does anyone know how it compares to the Superflash in visibility?
Any brighter than the 1W Mars 4.0?

 

[LEDAdd1ct]

Wow, that looks really nice! Here is Amazon's lone review:

http://tinyurl.com/2bdg4ld

*puts on trusty gloves, and starts digging*

Here is a thread with more information:

http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-607810.html

And sourced from that thread, to save you digging through it, here is an awesome video...so much for going through the weekend without spending any money...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxnYHRINovU

Earlier versions had contact issues, but they seem to have been fixed:

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showpost.php?p=2650849&postcount=29

http://www.cyclingforums.com/cycling-equipment/473968-seat-stay-rear-lights.html#post3932876

And a great video here:

http://www.vimeo.com/7730667

This guy compiled a list of a ton of great lights, with the Radbot on the list:

http://www3.telus.net/9/manualmobility.html

 

[BrianMc]

In the designing a commuter daytime rear light thread the consensus was 2-3 1 watt LED lights or 1 3 watt LED light. So 2-3 of these should do it. Or two of these with 2-3 PBSF's.

I wish the video of the daytime cyclist, would have allowed a greater and greater distance especially with a PBSF as a reference.

I was about to order $65 of driver and 4 red 1 watt LED's to build my own.

These are less work.
They need no cord to the main battery.
They are easily scaled up.
They are 1/7 the cost of the Dinottte 400L with side output.
They are likely about 1/4 of the 400L output.
They have an obnoxious and severely obnoxious mode as well as on.
They have about 1/2 or less the very long run time of the PBSF

So I've just ordered two. I will work out a best arrangement of the three PBSF's and Xenon and make another video after the bike is overhauled with the other parts in that order.

 

[JustRidingAlong]

I ordered a Radbot 500 by mistake (meant to order the 1000), and figured I'd send it back or sell it on eBay. It turned out to be brighter than I expected, so I kept it... until the contacts flaked out on me. I e-mailed PDW and they said to send it back for replacement.

Anyway, while not as bright as my Dinotte 140L, it's brighter than a PBSF. The rack mount fits my Tubus Cosmo rack, and the reflector is quite good. Since I haven't received my replacement 500, I can't comment on battery life.

 

[LEDAdd1ct]

When did you purchase your 500? The manufacturer stated that early models had switch issues.

 

[JustRidingAlong]

When did you purchase your 500? The manufacturer stated that early models had switch issues.

Bought it on eBay a couple of weeks ago. Probably old stock, as it also didn't have the press-and-hold switch that the newer ones have.

 

[LEDAdd1ct]

Ahh, I think we have the answer then. That definitely sounds like someone on e-Bay unloading older stock. I'm glad the company did the right thing in exchanging it. That can make all the difference after the sale!

As regards battery life:

I'll leave the electrical calculations to someone more qualified in that department than myself; however, it is hard (for me) to believe that three AAA cells can deliver enough current to power the light that brightly for a significant length of time. What we need is a brave and willing CPF'er to measure the current draw...

 

[BrianMc]

it is hard (for me) to believe that three AAA cells can deliver enough current to power the light that brightly for a significant length of time. What we need is a brave and willing CPF'er to measure the current draw...

I have the meter, but no light to test until maybe next weekend.

Assuming they are driving the Nichia LED at the voltage where it consumes 1 watt on full time, and the SBSF on full time is driven at the current equal to 1/2 watt, and given the improved lumens/watt output of power LEDs since the SBSF was introduced (in what 2006?), I would not be surprised to find almost 3 X the light output at twice the power consumption.

The battery increase to 3 AAA's is a 50% increase in supply and a doubling of demand, so a crude guesstimate would be about 75% of the run time on full power. Since the pulse widths may be longer, and there are two modes, the flash modes may consume more power, and I'd guess half the run time, about 50 hours. BUT you may not like the output a lot in the last few hours and cahnge out early.

Having dealt with a Xenon strobe with a 3-4 hour run time, I'd be happy if they run on NiMH's and give me 10 hours.

 

[znomit]

Assuming they are driving the Nichia LED at the voltage where it consumes 1 watt on full time, and the SBSF on full time is driven at the current equal to 1/2 watt, and given the improved lumens/watt output of power LEDs since the SBSF was introduced (in what 2006?), I would not be surprised to find almost 3 X the light output at twice the power consumption.

It says 15hrs on steady.
Red LED is about the same V as 2 AA NiMH.
Being generous assuming 1000mAhr AAA batteries.
Thats 66mA
66mA x 2.5V = 0.16W :sick2:
Yes I'm ignoring driver efficiencies.

The "1W" is pure marketing BS.
Heres 1W

 

[BrianMc]

The "1W" is pure marketing BS.

So we have a nominal '1 W' red LED driven at 1/6 of that power. Hmmmm.

So the same is likely true of the nominal "1/2" watt of the PBSF given their extreme run times. No one has come forward to say they tried and either succeeded or failed to mod one. With two Radbots coming, I can afford to sacrifice a PBSF.

Two side by side or end to end PBSF's are not too far from enough light for some daylight help to visibility. They are small points of light, though.

Anyone destroyed a PBSF modding it? Where did you go wrong?

I may have to place an order with Cutter, after all.

 

[Offroad'Bent]

Thought you might like it. I'd be interested in your comparison.
I'll post how my 3W flashlight compares once it arrives.

In the designing a commuter daytime rear light thread the consensus was 2-3 1 watt LED lights or 1 3 watt LED light. So 2-3 of these should do it. Or two of these with 2-3 PBSF's.


I was about to order $65 of driver and 4 red 1 watt LED's to build my own.

These are less work.
They need no cord to the main battery.
They are easily scaled up.
They are 1/7 the cost of the Dinottte 400L with side output.
They are likely about 1/4 of the 400L output.
They have an obnoxious and severely obnoxious mode as well as on.
They have about 1/2 or less the very long run time of the PBSF

So I've just ordered two. I will work out a best arrangement of the three PBSF's and Xenon and make another video after the bike is overhauled with the other parts in that order.

 

[BrianMc]

Yes, thanks. I found a Jaunuary posting in the commuting light thread referencing it, but his vido did not show it. At taht time, a 'brighter' SBSF was of little concern or interest to me. I had a bike part order in to my no so local LBS, so I addded 2.
lovecpf

I am also considering this:

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5325

Pe2er has the star removed and in this light. :thumbsup:

The MR16 is as inexpensive as one 10 mm MCPCB with an XP-R orange red from Cutter and I'd need driver, case, optics and at least another two MCPCB's.

If Erwin's answers to my questions are what I hope, I'll order but knowing DX, the show down of the bike lights will be in two phases: a shoot out of AAA blinkies then deploying blinkies with '1 watt' MR16 modules to best effect.


This is getting very interesting. Drivers just aren't expecting bikes so I need to hit them over the head (in a caring way, of course) to stay alive out there. :devil: :kiss: :twothumbs

 

[JustRidingAlong]

Here's a quick & dirty video that I threw together that shows a Radbot 500 next to Dinotte's 200L (amber/front) and 120L (red/rear).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRMZNZZLWyE

120L/red is on the left, Radbot is in the middle, and 200L/amber is on the right.

 

[Ziemas]

Does anyone have any idea of the approximate lumens the Radbot 1000 puts out? L&M is coming out with a new 35 lumen taillight, and I'm wondering how they compare.

 

[BrianMc]

If we take the CREE XP-E Orange red at 67.2 lumens at 350 mA as an upper guess of efficacy, it is almost 100 lumens per watt. Znomit showed that the power through the light driver and all is 0.16 watt , say a 10% driver for .145 watt, than the lumens at most would be about 15 watt (there will be a slight increase in efficacy at lower currents). It is unlikely to be that good, so likely 8-12 lumens.

Znomit: do you concur?

 

[znomit]

If we take the CREE XP-E Orange red at 67.2 lumens at 350 mA as an upper guess of efficacy, it is almost 100 lumens per watt. Znomit showed that the power through the light driver and all is 0.16 watt , say a 10% driver for .145 watt, than the lumens at most would be about 15 watt (there will be a slight increase in efficacy at lower currents). It is unlikely to be that good, so likely 8-12 lumens.

Znomit: do you concur?

Yeah cree quote 12-17 at 125mA on a red XPE. So I guess 5-10 for the nichia at 66mA. 10lm is reasonable for a "be seen" light.
http://www.cree.com/products/pdf/XLampXP_B&L.pdf

 

[Ziemas]

Thanks for the replies, folks.

The new L&M light looks interesting, but at USD100, an eight hour runtime (claimed), and perhaps a proprietary battery I think it's going to be a hard sell, even for a bike light geek like me. I think I'm going to stick with my Radbots for awhile.

Oh, and to answer the OP, I've noticed cars giving me more room when passing when using my Radbot (only two days now) as compared to using the Mars 4. Of course this is during daylight hours.


Here's a promo video of the L&M.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcAx4v5UQOE

 

[BrianMc]

Thanks for the replies, folks. The new L&M light looks interesting, but at USD100, ... I think it's going to be a hard sell, ... I think I'm going to stick with my Radbots for awhile.

Same here. The MR16 red 1 watt spot from DX at less that $7 when I have a 12 volt battery system, looks better to me.

Oh, and to answer the OP, I've noticed cars giving me more room when passing when using my Radbot (only two days now) as compared to using the Mars 4. Of course this is during daylight hours.

Yeah. That's what clued me in that the drivers weren't being inconsiderate, but were not seeing the SPSF's or maybe seeing but not recognizing a bike at a distance. The ANSI vest got a huge change in behavior. It is a night versus day level of change in average behavior. So at least in your area, the Radbot is above the threshold of awareness in daylight use.:thumbsup:

 

[Offroad'Bent]

Same here. The MR16 red 1 watt spot from DX at less that $7 when I have a 12 volt battery system, looks better to me.

Yeah. That's what clued me in that the drivers weren't being inconsiderate, but were not seeing the SPSF's or maybe seeing but not recognizing a bike at a distance. The ANSI vest got a huge change in behavior. It is a night versus day level of change in average behavior. So at least in your area, the Radbot is above the threshold of awareness in daylight use.:thumbsup:

Has anyone looked at the Zebralight red? 33 lumens of red light x 5 hours on 1 AA. It's a floody light, not a tight beam.

 

[pe2er]

I am also considering this:

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5325

Pe2er has the star removed and in this light. :thumbsup:

I Have a simple IS for light output measurements. I Just went out into the rain to measure output of the 1 Watt light. It produced a reading of 7000.

If we take the CREE XP-E Orange red at 67.2 lumens at 350 mA as an upper guess of efficacy, it is almost 100 lumens per watt. Znomit showed that the power through the light driver and all is 0.16 watt , say a 10% driver for .145 watt, than the lumens at most would be about 15 ..., so likely 8-12 lumens.

The PBSF Initially produced a reading of 400, reducing to 300. I Thought that low reading might be due to the batteries, for I have used it for some time and for the video's in another thread (Designing good daytime rear commuter lights). Voltage for the combined AAA batteries was down to 2.2 Volt. Put in a fresh pair of AAAs. Now the reading was 1400 to 1300. This is the light from the main LED only.

So the PBSF produces ~ 20% of the light of a 1 Watt LED.

Would love to measure the Radbot, but am not planning on buying one 😉

The factor for my IS is ~100. So a CREE XR-E R2 produces a reading of just above 20000 Lux ~ 200 Lumens.

I Realize that my IS is not perfect, and my Dx lux meter is not up to CPF standards, but it does allow me to quantify thing for my own pleasure and observe thing like reducing light output when emitters heat up 😀