Pennsylvania Vehicle Lighting Codes

toledoUPSguy

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Why is the inside of your garage, in front of your truck, all lit up in yellow? What lights are doing that? And what's the list of lights on the truck that are switched on in this pic? parking/tail/side marker/license plate, obviously. Rear fog, obviously. What's on up front?
Yellow light is DD SAE max yellow SS3 fogs. This was 1st go around wiring with the front fogs as the switched 12v power source for the rear fog. So headlights and front fogs are on in the picture.
 

toledoUPSguy

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As bright as the OEM halo parking lights are the headlights may not have been on.
 

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-Virgil-

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Yellow light is DD SAE max yellow SS3 fogs.
OK, then why is there so much uplight? Your walls are washed with light all the way up to the ceiling, which is very brightly lit…is it just bounce-lit off the floor, or is all this uplight coming directly from the lamps?
 

toledoUPSguy

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OK, then why is there so much uplight? Your walls are washed with light all the way up to the ceiling, which is very brightly lit…is it just bounce-lit off the floor, or is all this uplight coming directly from the lamps?

Probably has something to do with the fact of how close front of the truck is to the wall. These are SAE fogs, aimed appropriately and with a very distinct cutoff. But now I'm scratching my head thinking about your question.
 

-Virgil-

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Try an experiment: fashion a visor/shade type of arrangement out of stiff paper (file folder or something like that. Make it three sides of a square, then make another one so you have a pair. Push one onto each fog lamp so it blocks light from travelling up, left or right directly from the lens face. Try adjusting your visors so they protrude forward about 3 inches from the lens face. With the truck in the same position, turn the lights on again and see what changes in terms of wall/ceiling illumination. Maybe take another pic.

EDIT: I just saw the frontal pic of the truck. We usually talk about upward stray light, but there's a striking amount of downward stray light in this pic. Those streaks and splashes on the ground directly in front of the truck? That's stray light. No way can it possibly help you see anything -- if you want to put a good scare on yourself, speaking of experiments, try this one with your own truck -- all that light can do is bounce off the ground and make trouble of itself. It's not going to cause as much backscatter/veiling glare as you might think, because light travelling at 60°-90° upward angles won't refract back to your eyes very strongly. But it will cause some backscatter, because the uneven surface of any pavement will send light rays headed in a large variety of angular directions, and with all that unusable light flying around, a proportion of it is going to wind up going bad places.
 
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toledoUPSguy

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Try an experiment: fashion a visor/shade type of arrangement out of stiff paper (file folder or something like that. Make it three sides of a square, then make another one so you have a pair. Push one onto each fog lamp so it blocks light from travelling up, left or right directly from the lens face. Try adjusting your visors so they protrude forward about 3 inches from the lens face. With the truck in the same position, turn the lights on again and see what changes in terms of wall/ceiling illumination. Maybe take another pic.

EDIT: I just saw the frontal pic of the truck. We usually talk about upward stray light, but there's a striking amount of downward stray light in this pic. Those streaks and splashes on the ground directly in front of the truck? That's stray light. No way can it possibly help you see anything -- if you want to put a good scare on yourself, speaking of experiments, try this one with your own truck -- all that light can do is bounce off the ground and make trouble of itself. It's not going to cause as much backscatter/veiling glare as you might think, because light travelling at 60°-90° upward angles won't refract back to your eyes very strongly. But it will cause some backscatter, because the uneven surface of any pavement will send light rays headed in a large variety of angular directions, and with all that unusable light flying around, a proportion of it is going to wind up going bad places.
First I want to make sure you know that I am not arguing at all. I will try your suggestion this weekend if I can get through the troubles our son is causing. I snapped 2 pictures in the front camera. I never really noticed before the garage door being lit up so much with just the fogs because they're never on by themselves. Fog only, yellow garage door but not too noticeable with the headlights on. Am going to reach out to Diode Dynamics for they're thoughts. I have been in some serious downpours and white out snow falls without noticing any backsplatter BUT I had noticed some yellow hitting the speed limit signs.
 

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bykfixer

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Unless you place snoots over fog lights, beam scatter is a given, right? Flashlight junkies call it spill.
My old Honda Prelude had honeycomb lenses over the fog lights. I never really saw much benefit in those. They helped close up, yeah but to pierce fog like a pencil beam would……nope. I doubt they were bright enough to break any laws.

In stock platform it sat low to the ground and the foglights were at the bottom area of the bumper.
All the cool cats wanted foglights for their car so I sold the "system" for $300 and used the foglight slots to place air ducts to my front brakes.

My 4wd truck has factory slots at the base of the bumper but I chose not to install any. Another coworker has factory type on his truck like my truck and he says they help see road stripes better.
 

Alaric Darconville

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They helped close up, yeah but to pierce fog like a pencil beam would……nope. I doubt they were bright enough to break any laws.
Fog lamps aren't supposed to "pierce fog", nor have anything approaching a pencil beam. Nothing about their beam pattern (or their color!) is meant for them to "pierce fog" or provide additional forward seeing distance.

Another coworker has factory type on his truck like my truck and he says they help see road stripes better.
That's what they're for. Not, of course, in dry, clear weather nor at speeds over 20-25mph. They're for creeping along at low speed in torrential rain, heavy fog, or falling snow, so the driver can see the lane markings and stay in their lane and not end up going off into the shoulder or into oncoming traffic.

A rear fog lamp is to protect against the people behind you driving too fast for conditions, thinking their front fog lamps afford better distance vision/permitting greater speeds. Rear fog lamps may also be used in the daytime (but in the same rain/snow/fog conditions) since they are a presence indicator for others, not to enhance the driver's own seeing.
 

bykfixer

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Thank you Alaric.

Where I live we don't get a lot of really thick fog. So in many cases they are misunderstood and end up being used as extra headlights or decorations on modified vehicles.
Me? I just slow way down and turn on flashers at times they would actually help like heavy snow, rain, or the occasional fog. And more times than not end up in a "train" formation with like-minded folks.

I suppose if I lived at a place with a lot of fog I'd probably have them on my vehicle. And in my view the folks who design vehicles I drive tend to know how to build them within the law I leave things generally stock. If not stock, factory upgrades.
 

Alaric Darconville

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Where I live we don't get a lot of really thick fog. So in many cases they are misunderstood and end up being used as extra headlights or decorations on modified vehicles.
Or people turn them on accidentally (easy on Toyota and Honda based on the combination switch) and have no idea.

The ones that purposefully use them claim (quite incorrectly) that they "see better" with them. Or they think it "looks cool" (as if demonstrating you don't know how to select appropriate lighting is cool).

I suppose if I lived at a place with a lot of fog I'd probably have them on my vehicle.
It'd be nice if we *required* rear fog lamps and *regulated* front ones. And if we had decent driver education so people don't misuse either one.
 

John_Galt

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Links to state codes/regs should go in a new post in this sticky thread. Discussion of state codes and regs should be in its own thread(s), like this present one.

That thread is locked to further responses, so I suppose I could summarize the links here and you would be able to post them there.
 

bykfixer

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Or people turn them on accidentally (easy on Toyota and Honda based on the combination switch) and have no idea.

The ones that purposefully use them claim (quite incorrectly) that they "see better" with them. Or they think it "looks cool" (as if demonstrating you don't know how to select appropriate lighting is cool).


It'd be nice if we *required* rear fog lamps and *regulated* front ones. And if we had decent driver education so people don't misuse either one.
I have never owned a Honda that had foglights tied to the combo switch, as the Preludes I owned had an independent switch. But I understand your point as both Mrs Fixer and I activate the rear wiper on the Escape without meaning to.

Heck I can see better with my brights on but know it blinds others so……and people who don't have enough sense to wear a ball cap straight will never know how um err uh ridiculous they look while trying to look cool.

Driver education is an oximoron these days. lol. We taught our kids to drive starting at a young age so that when they were of age we could teach them rules of the road. Coast down hills, turn off your brights when you see another car etc.

My wife's car turns brights off all by itself so there's that. We opted not to buy one with foglights. My Lexus car has foglights on the bottom area of the bumper but to turn them on requires a twist to a different part of the light switch combo stick.

I'll stop veering off topic now. I just saw other comments that caused me to think "hmmm" about the matter.
 
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-Virgil-

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That thread is locked to further responses, so I suppose I could summarize the links here and you would be able to post them there.
Could either post here or just send a DM to a moderator and they'll add it to the regs & laws post.
 
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