Pila/Copia 150s/150a,168s/168a discharge graphs pl

udaman

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Pila/Copia Li-ion, I haven’t seen any discharge graphs yet, are there any threads with these?

Re: how well do these handle the higher current draws? 1C should be find, but what about 2C or 3C? Thinking of mods I haven’t seen yet?

150s(50+mm length) is the CR123A dia cell of only 1000ma (16.5mm), while the higher cap 150a is 18mm and 1200ma. Do these handle higher current draws and maintain voltages to keep the light bright?

How about the longer 168(68mm length) cells of 1400ma & 1800ma, I’l like to see discharge graphs of all of these.

If the 150s can handle 3C discharge; then we have a potential 20 min. runtime, much cheaper competitor for the Surefire 10X, 500-600+lumen 'flashbulb'; “mini-Aurora lite” in the making. Can anyone guess which host/bulb $70+(sans cost of Pila/charger combo) combination I’m thinking of?/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin07.gif

From perusing kakster’s M4 comments on this thread, it maybe be possible?
kakster's notes on Pila 168's/M4 currents-outputs

There is this infamous Simon guy, who works for a company that designed the Li-phosphate battery for the new Megaray 175w, that claimed on RC forums, a similar cell chemistry 18650 cylindrical cell was weeks away from announcement. Hopefully this is not vaporware, and we’ll see this kind of Li-Phos or Li-Sulfur cell technology later this year w/higher capacities/good discharge graphs, to make fiendishly high output mods possible…before the 10w-16w HID’s of the near future takeover.
 
Udaman,

Nice to hear you are still spreading the good word on my behalf.

Infamy, wow didnt think that would happen at 34.

Yes, still waiting on sign off on the new cells, frustrating I know, but better to have it 100% correct.

Watch this space, or more to the point...watch the manufacturers.

Cheers for now.

Simon.
 
Re: Pila/Copia 150s/150a,168s/168a discharge graph

I don't have much faith in these cells running at 3C. Not in terms of life. I was contemplating driving the WA01185 at 3.25A using 2Ah 18650 cells and was advised against this by an engineer at SureFire. He said to expect maybe 25 cycles at this drain, which is only 1.625C. He further stated that this type of cell suffers when the load goes above 5 or 6 watts per cell. That's only 1.82A at 3.3V. He did allude to a different class of cells which could take more abuse.

Simon, please feel free to post when the new cells become available.

If I were building the pack for the MegaRay and didn't have to worry about maintaining a cylindrical form factor, I'd go with the 9C or 10C lipolys. That chemistry exists right now and is not some mysterious vapor product.

Wilkey
 
Re: Pila/Copia 150s/150a,168s/168a discharge graph

The 9 to 10C lith-polys wont give full capacity at these drain rates.

Lithium-Cobalt Dioxide cells just aren't capable of doing it regardless of any claims made.

You might suck 10C out of them on drain rate, but you will only get 40% capacity.

The Megaray packs are using cylindrical Saphion cells, been changed over from Saphion I polymer format. Cylindricals are much more robust mechanically, easier to put together. When built with Saphion cathode material they are extremely safe also. Will easily give 2C discharge rates too, this works out at 3.2 volts nominal and 2.9amps.

And they are available right now in 18650 format, not vaporware at all.

The next gen Saphion cylindrical is out later this year, this is when it will start to get very interesting as we will be talking about performance characteristics never heard of before, with existing Saphion safety benefits.

Hope that helps.

Simon.
 
Udaman,

We arent talking lithium-sulfur, just not safe enough (pipe bomb springs to mind, just like the old Litium-Nickel-Cobalt mixed cathode cells of just a few years ago)

We are making lithium-phosphate cells, gen 1 for the mo, gen 2 just around the corner, gen 'X' sometime farther out.

Simon.
 
I am point of contact for sampling/sales for flashlight manuf, amongst a number of others.
 
Re: Pila/Copia 150s/150a,168s/168a discharge graph

Simon,
That sounds very promising. As always, sources or vendors are appreciated.
Wilkey
 
Re: Pila/Copia 150s/150a,168s/168a discharge graph *DELETED*

Post deleted by simon33
 
Re: Pila/Copia 150s/150a,168s/168a discharge graph

Neat video simon /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif
I'll certainly think twice before playing around with multiple bare li-ions now.
Just out of curiosity, how do the Saphions behave when reverse charged, like what happens when you have a single bad cell in a battery?
 
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