Prices of Fenix spare bodies/tailcaps/access. - anyone else think it's a little nuts?

[zpaulg]

If I didn't see the same looking lights coming out of Kai and DX for $15 complete - I wouldn't say a thing. I expect a company like Surefire to sell expensive stuff, they are manufactured here in the U.S., prices are higher - it's expected from a top dollar product.

Has anyone checked similar Kai/DX lights to see if they fit? I'm going to order some that look really similar next week and then post my findings here.

These cheaper lights are all well and good, they really look the part.

However, I have found that they turn on/off and change modes when knocked or shaken. Not a redeeming feature and I for one will continue to buy the better quality brands in the future!

You do get what you pay for, sadly (I like a bargain as much as the next guy!)

Shine on..........

 

[wintermute]

I want a P2D body w/ tailcap for less then $24...ya know. I think a body should run $12-$14, a tailcap $6-$8 - and a body/tailcap combo no more then $16-$18...but that's just me.

 

[Dobbler]

First of all, I suspect 99% of all buyers (not just CPF members) never buy a single spare part. So the market for such spares is TINY compared to that for complete lights. I think it is nice that Fenix, Lumapower (my two experiences) and others even provide individual parts for sale. There's a significant cost to do this over providing complete lights when you consider how small the volume of sales is relative to complete products.

Second, I don't mind the pricing because if I decide later I want another head I'm not paying the same price for just the head as I would a whole new light. I bought an extra P2D body+tailcap a couple of months ago, and when the OP reflector models came out a couple weeks ago I was able to just buy the P2D head w/OP for a reasonable price. The cost of the body+tailcap and head was just slightly more than the cost of a whole new light.

 

[wintermute]

First of all, I suspect 99% of all buyers (not just CPF members) never buy a single spare part. So the market for such spares is TINY compared to that for complete lights. I think it is nice that Fenix, Lumapower (my two experiences) and others even provide individual parts for sale. There's a significant cost to do this over providing complete lights when you consider how small the volume of sales is relative to complete products.

Second, I don't mind the pricing because if I decide later I want another head I'm not paying the same price for just the head as I would a whole new light. I bought an extra P2D body+tailcap a couple of months ago, and when the OP reflector models came out a couple weeks ago I was able to just buy the P2D head w/OP for a reasonable price. The cost of the body+tailcap and head was just slightly more than the cost of a whole new light.

But the L1D/L2D/P2D is meant to be a lego set. It's hard to imagine that the number of spare parts sold is that small since they are made to be interchangeable. In addition, we're not talking about custom parts...or one-offs. These are the exact same parts used on the production lights, hence prices should be more reasonable due to volume. But hey - we can't have it all...right. My L1D (with spare L2D) body is one of the best $50 investments I have ever had. It kills a light I built with a VIP-750 and a SSC USX0H - so now I am re-building that host with a VIP-1000 and a SSC USW0H star to see if it can compete with the L2D CE (with Cree WC tint Q4).

I hope to make plenty of beamshots this weekend. :wave:

 

[Dobbler]

But the L1D/L2D/P2D is meant to be a lego set.

I respectfully disagree. It's a manufacturing efficiency meant to save production and design costs! Fenix can MARKET and SELL three different models with ONE head design. The amount of $ Fenix saves in engineering and production is a far greater savings than any profit gained from selling bodies and tail caps. That they happen to be interchangeable for us flashaholics is merely a convenient bonus.

 

[wintermute]

I respectfully disagree. It's a manufacturing efficiency meant to save production and design costs! Fenix can MARKET and SELL three different models with ONE head design. The amount of $ Fenix saves in engineering and production is a far greater savings than any profit gained from selling bodies and tail caps. That they happen to be interchangeable for us flashaholics is merely a convenient bonus.

I can respect your disagreement - and will get try to get numbers on spare bodies sold soon to help squash the argument. Thank you for your tact in this discussion thus far. :wave:

 

[Dobbler]

I can respect your disagreement - and will get try to get numbers on spare bodies sold soon to help squash the argument. Thank you for your tact in this discussion thus far. :wave:

:twothumbs

 

[wintermute]

I respectfully disagree...

You know, if more comments on CPF started like this we wouldn't have so many threads go to the crapper. :sigh:

I'm certainly not completely innocent - but wow, some people really love the personal attacks when you disagree with them on something.

It's a manufacturing efficiency meant to save production and design costs! Fenix can MARKET and SELL three different models with ONE head design. The amount of $ Fenix saves in engineering and production is a far greater savings than any profit gained from selling bodies and tail caps. That they happen to be interchangeable for us flashaholics is merely a convenient bonus.

But, shouldn't this make the accessories cheaper - since they're already producing the bodies in such high quantities. At the prices they charge, they must make more money on the bodies then the whole lights - so why not drop the price a bit to make it more in line with a respectable margin, and consequently sell more accessories.

 

[4sevens]

I can chime in on some statistics on the spare bodies.
We sell about 2% number bodies compared to the number
of lights by quantity.

The spare bodies are in fact an afterthought. They were brought into
my store by numberous customer requests. Originally Fenix did not want
to do it for two reasons. 1) Logistic reasons 2) the possibilty of accidental
damage by the user (i.e. P2D head on P3D body)

For me as a store owner, they have not been worth it simply because they
actually aren't as many orders for the bodies and I have too much stock of
them. However, I price them accordingly to account for orders that are
only bodies (most of them are just for the bodies). Costs include postage,
packaging and labor to process the order and pack them and take them
to the post office.

If it were my choice, I would not carry them. But I realized lots of people
want them and my take on it is that it's a service to my customers.
Also, keep in mind that I price these not only with shipping included
but also any discounts such as CPF8 has to be calculated into it.

 

[Dobbler]

You know, if more comments on CPF started like this we wouldn't have so many threads go to the crapper. :sigh:

I'm certainly not completely innocent - but wow, some people really love the personal attacks when you disagree with them on something.



But, shouldn't this make the accessories cheaper - since they're already producing the bodies in such high quantities. At the prices they charge, they must make more money on the bodies then the whole lights - so why not drop the price a bit to make it more in line with a respectable margin, and consequently sell more accessories.

4sevens has chimed in from the dealer standpoint so there's not much more to say...

In general, it's more expensive for a company to ship incomplete products (ie. parts) than it is a complete product. There are inventory, shipping, packaging (to protect each part) issues, etc, etc.

It's been a long time since I took a university-level economics class, but simply put, just lowering the price of an item doesn't increase profit due to more units moved. I suspect the parts are priced where the market will pay for them and yet the dealer and manufacturer aren't losing money at the same time. As 4sevens mentioned, if only 2% buy an extra body from him, just think how small the general non-CPF member numbers probably are. I'll bet if you took ALL the lights Fenix ships they sell less than 0.5% of that total in extra bodies/tail caps. It's just not economically viable for them to get into the parts business.

EDIT: I too would love to many manufacturers offer individual parts at inexpensive prices (esp. Lumapower) because I'm a geek too

 

[wintermute]

4sevens has chimed in from the dealer standpoint so there's not much more to say...

In general, it's more expensive for a company to ship incomplete products (ie. parts) than it is a complete product. There are inventory, shipping, packaging (to protect each part) issues, etc, etc.

It's been a long time since I took a university-level economics class, but simply put, just lowering the price of an item doesn't increase profit due to more units moved. I suspect the parts are priced where the market will pay for them and yet the dealer and manufacturer aren't losing money at the same time. As 4sevens mentioned, if only 2% buy an extra body from him, just think how small the general non-CPF member numbers probably are. I'll bet if you took ALL the lights Fenix ships they sell less than 0.5% of that total in extra bodies/tail caps. It's just not economically viable for them to get into the parts business.

EDIT: I too would love to many manufacturers offer individual parts at inexpensive prices (esp. Lumapower) because I'm a geek too

Yup - seems that way...just going from pilou response that he bought an extra body for $3, it seemed like prices have just gone up recently. Maybe Fenix should have a retail box LxD combo - which comes with both L1D and L2D bodies for $8 more then the L2D or something. Or a P/LxD combo with all three bodies, similar to the Lumapower M3. I'm not going to complain though - these lights and the service I have received from the dealer makes this light a 9.5/10 - if they would just fix that flash before the low setting, and maybe some way to figure out a forward clicky it would be a 10/10. Regardless, I really think these Fenix lights are excellent.

 

[Dobbler]

Yup - seems that way...just going from pilou response that he bought an extra body for $3, it seemed like prices have just gone up recently. Maybe Fenix should have a retail box LxD combo - which comes with both L1D and L2D bodies for $8 more then the L2D or something. Or a P/LxD combo with all three bodies, similar to the Lumapower M3. I'm not going to complain though - these lights and the service I have received from the dealer makes this light a 9.5/10 - if they would just fix that flash before the low setting, and maybe some way to figure out a forward clicky it would be a 10/10. Regardless, I really think these Fenix lights are excellent.

That's a good idea -- three bodies, one head. Fenix would need to re-engineer one or more of the bodies because the tailcaps on the L1D/L2D are different than the P2D. I have three P2D's, and one each of the L1D/L2D (oh, and some L0D's, a P3D............) :wave:

 

[bfg9000]

I take it you haven't seen any of those complaints about how assembling a car from parts ordered at the dealer would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Parts are expensive in every industry because they are considered dead inventory. That is, the spare parts are made and stored "just in case" they are needed without the expectation that they will move at all (unlike assembled products that are expected to sell quickly and at a profit), and the cost reflects this. They have the same inventory and handling costs as a finished product but do not move as quickly.

 

[wintermute]

That's a good idea -- three bodies, one head. Fenix would need to re-engineer one or more of the bodies because the tailcaps on the L1D/L2D are different than the P2D. I have three P2D's, and one each of the L1D/L2D (oh, and some L0D's, a P3D............) :wave:

ummmmm...why do you have 3 x P2D's?? :huh: