Question About NiMH Batteries

Boris_yo

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Hello. I have these Sanyo Eneloops AA and Amazon Basics AAs:
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When I use them in coffee whisker I notice that with Amazon ones it turns slower than with using Sanyo batteries. Why is that?

After fully charged, Sanyo (1900mAh) give out 1.33v and 1.35v while Amazon (2000mAh) give out 1.2v and 1.25v but both have 1.2v NiMH on their label. Both were bought about 8 years ago.

If you know of a forum dedicated to discussing batteries let me know. Thanks.
 

Boris_yo

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I would say your Amazon batteries most likely have not aged well. Their ability to produce current is not as good under a load. The Eneloops have held up better with time.
I used them rarely so might have to do with not aging well too? The Amazon ones are made in China. Sanyo is made in Japan. Looks like it says all.

I thought to buy battery charger like LaCrosse or Powerex because they recondition batteries and can even bring back dying batteries to working state. Have been putting off amd using Camelion charger. Someone told me these typical chargers use simple algorithm which is not optimally adaptive to each battery and wears them out with time.
 

Lynx_Arc

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The made in china ones (Rayovac Hybrids) tend to charge to a lower voltage and be more fragile even though they have slightly more mah (2100 vs 1900 for eneloops) You need to be more careful with the chinese LSD cells as in series they are more easily damaged when overdischarging them causing sometimes a reversing of the voltage that can give you a loss of about half capacity sometimes.
 

Boris_yo

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The made in china ones (Rayovac Hybrids) tend to charge to a lower voltage and be more fragile even though they have slightly more mah (2100 vs 1900 for eneloops) You need to be more careful with the chinese LSD cells as in series they are more easily damaged when overdischarging them causing sometimes a reversing of the voltage that can give you a loss of about half capacity sometimes.

I don't know if Amazon ones that I have are Rayovac Hybrids. I thought my charger is sub-par and worn them out. When you say overdischarging, you mean like in lithium batteries? When you day in series, you mean when there is more than 1 battery used in device?
 

Lynx_Arc

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I don't know if Amazon ones that I have are Rayovac Hybrids. I thought my charger is sub-par and worn them out. When you say overdischarging, you mean like in lithium batteries? When you day in series, you mean when there is more than 1 battery used in device?
often you use more than 1 in series and as they are drained one can be discharged completely leaving the other driving it reverse voltage thus damaging it. You can also discharge single sells way too low in some devices too (0v)
 

Lynx_Arc

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@Lynx_Arc and @Lou Minescence Do you know if Amazon ones in question can be reconditioned back to their normal working state with chargers like Lacrosse or MAHA?
I have a lacross and the chinese (hybrids) ones typically don't recover fully when they get damaged, the duraloops (japan) tend to recover a lot better but still can be damaged. The AAAs are more fragile than AAs even in the eneloop (japan) variety. Now if it is just loss of capacity from lack of use then it can often be recovered totally or at least mostly.

From all the problems I've had using nimh in series in devices I've pretty much invested in 18650 based devices and lighting when possible as devices that use more than 1 cell in series tend to have balancing circuitry and protect a lot better from damage not allowing excessive discharge. If an 18650 goes bad you just replace it.... while a cell in a group goes weak/bad you have to have an analyzer/refresher type charger and go through hours even days of waiting for the results and test all cells in the group to closely match capacity to reduce issues.

I use single cell lights mostly a 1AAA for keychain size and a single 18650 trumps 2-3 AAs in both performance and size plus if needed you can get USB versions.

Finding eneloops is just as much of a task as 18650s unless you don't mind used cells then 18650s can be harvested from other packs. You can also get single cell 18650 USB chargers but finding a 3 cell USB AA/AAA charger may be difficult, I have a 2 cell AA/AAA USB charger that I've never used.
 

Boris_yo

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Finding eneloops is just as much of a task as 18650s unless you don't mind used cells then 18650s can be harvested from other packs.

18650s, 26650, 16650 lithiums I avoided because I heard stories them catching fire in chargers. It was a decade ago though. I also didn't see these batteries available from major brands which added more hesitation.

I have seen precharged white eneloops 2100mAh and precharged eneloops Pro 2550mAh available on Amazon. Both are made in Japan.
 

Lynx_Arc

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18650s, 26650, 16650 lithiums I avoided because I heard stories them catching fire in chargers. It was a decade ago though. I also didn't see these batteries available from major brands which added more hesitation.

I have seen precharged white eneloops 2100mAh and precharged eneloops Pro 2550mAh available on Amazon. Both are made in Japan.
If you are fine with a smart device then you can opt for protected cells from a trusted vendor. There was a lot of people on CF that have made the switch to lithium ion...... many still use some nimh in some devices, I still use a 1AAA keychain light and cells in some other devices that I haven't found 18650 replacements yet. You just cannot get the run time nor power output from 3AA eneloops that you can get from a 3000-3500mah 18650 battery.

I've never had a fire with lithium ion, and likewise I believe very few people have had one on CF. When I get a new device and new batteries regardless of type I always babysit them and their charger till I know there is no issues.
 

Monocrom

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Eneloops just age better than the competition.
Long-term use, go with quality Eneloops.
 

Beckler

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It's pretty simple: "Amazon Basics" is code for "Junk Quality". Like much of the trash sold on Amazon, avoid it unless from a reputable brand.

(I got a cheap Basics tripod once that had good rating (which also means nothing) and it was unbelievable garbage. Reviews are either fake or people completely clueless - likely both.)
 

Boris_yo

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@Beckler Amazon turned itself into Aliexpress US. I can probably find there stuff on par with Amazon Basics. I remember Amazon had a presence of dfferent US companies that sold various stuff I could not find elsewhere. Too bad chinese takeover caused them to flee.
 

Boris_yo

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Finding eneloops is just as much of a task as 18650s unless you don't mind used cells then 18650s can be harvested from other packs. You can also get single cell 18650 USB chargers but finding a 3 cell USB AA/AAA charger may be difficult, I have a 2 cell AA/AAA USB charger that I've never used.

Why would eneloops be as hard to find as 18650? They are widely available on Amazon. At least in my country the task is finding 18650 cells which are sold in specialist stores 2200mAh cell costing $15. Eneloops are sold too in specialist stores but are more expensive than on Amazon.
 

Lynx_Arc

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Why would eneloops be as hard to find as 18650? They are widely available on Amazon. At least in my country the task is finding 18650 cells which are sold in specialist stores 2200mAh cell costing $15. Eneloops are sold too in specialist stores but are more expensive than on Amazon.
I can find 18650s at vape shops I'm sure but not sure of the price and likely they won't be high capacity ones. You can buy a cheap $10 power bank with a pair of 2200-2600 18650s in it but no place around here has eneloops and I'm not sure they make duraloop pros any more now. We finally have a costco but it is over 10 miles or a gallon and a half of gas round trip about $5 to go there and back plus membership fees. Unless you have a prime account or buy $25 Amazon charges shipping fees and not everyone wants to pay $10 or more a month for prime or wants more than $25 worth of stuff either. I try and buy local unless I can get it for a lot cheaper online.
 
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