Quick Question on driving the XR-E

mds82

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I have Quick question on driving the Cree XR-e's
I want to drive 4 of them total, 2 at 700ma, 2 at 350ma.
Power source is 12v ( automotive), and i will be using a BuckPuck 3023-d-x-700.
For wiring, i would have 2 in series, then 2 in parallel

Is there any problem with driving them this way?

led.jpg
 
I could be wrong, but I thought you needed your input voltage to be about 2v greater then the sum of your Vf for the buckpuck to stay in regulation.
 
I could be wrong, but I thought you needed your input voltage to be about 2v greater then the sum of your Vf for the buckpuck to stay in regulation.

shouldnt the overall voltage be less then 12v because 2 are running in parallel. so the overall voltage should be 3x 3.5v ( or somewhere around there),
 
You're going to have problems with current balancing properly between the two parallel LEDs. You'll need to add a resistor to each of the parallel LEDs to ensure that an even amount of current flows through both.

You're not really gaining anything by putting them in parallel to gain a 4th LED.

For example:
Your set up - 2 are getting 700mA, and 2 are getting 350mA. If your XR-Es output 100lm at 350mA and 180lm at 700mA, then total output is:
180+180+100+100 = 560 lumens

But if you just go with 3 in series, output is:
180 + 180 + 180 = 540 lumens

You only gain 20 more lumens by using the 4th LED. That's not worth the effort of putting the last two in parallel.
 
I agree with evan9162. Putting 2 XREs in parallel makes absolutely no sense here. You're only reduce the total Vf by perhaps 0.2V if that's the reason you're doing it. The lumen gain is totally negligible. With 3 LEDs in series at 700 mA you'll still have plenty of voltage overhead to stay in regulation in a car. I've used 3 LEDs in series for many automotive projects with no problems.
 
The parallel connection part of your drawn circuit is not advisable. Also automotive voltage, unless your battery is serously depleted, is not 12V, but somewhere around 13.2V with the engine off and somewhere around 14.2-14.4V with the engine running.
 
Sorry i should have explained this a little better.
That picture was just to show how they were being run, its not how they will be used in production. The 4 led's will be placed around a rectangular piece of metal, with the 700ma on the sides, and the 350's on the top and bottom. I need 4 led's to cover the 4 sides of the rectangle and i need the sides to be brighter.

Hopefully that should make a little more sense. sorry i didnt explain that in the beginning, it all made sense in my head :)
 
I would definitely recommend against this method. The two LEDs in parallel could potentially vary in Vf by 1V, which unless you give yourself a huge voltage gap from total Vf to supply, resistors will not balance the current properly.

Also, it is important to remember that the battery voltage in a car can spike all the way up to 40V.

I would recommend using two linear regulators, one at 700mA and one at 350, and run two separate strings. You also need to make sure the regulators can take up to 40V.

Check out Arrow's lighting website. We have a PDF guide that compares all of the driver manufacturers we represent.
 
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Thank you all for the comments. Looks like i will need to look into another method for my design now :) No matter, i will be running these with a constant current driver ( a buckpuck)so power spikes arent really an issue.

Thanks again.
 
Thank you all for the comments. Looks like i will need to look into another method for my design now :) No matter, i will be running these with a constant current driver ( a buckpuck)so power spikes arent really an issue.

Thanks again.


I would recommend putting a zener/MOV in front of the buck-puck. While you may get lucky and not have any issues, you could be hit with a load-dump impulse that could take out your buck-puck.
 
One more quick thought. What if you ran 4 led's, 2 in parallel and then 2 in series. Would you have the same voltage issues going across them because you are running both sets in parallel ?
 
Just run all four at 500mA.

I cant do that however, the power source i am working with is 12v. I cant use this buckpuck if the input voltage is only 12v, i would need it to be greater if they were all in series.
 
Sorry i should have explained this a little better.
That picture was just to show how they were being run, its not how they will be used in production. The 4 led's will be placed around a rectangular piece of metal, with the 700ma on the sides, and the 350's on the top and bottom. I need 4 led's to cover the 4 sides of the rectangle and i need the sides to be brighter.

Hopefully that should make a little more sense. sorry i didnt explain that in the beginning, it all made sense in my head :)

it makes perfect sence to me if you want some sort of oblong output from a Quad cubed up. If you don't want purposfully offset output quantites, then it doesnt make sence.
I would do it in a second, but then again I will do anything Once.
the 16x9 light :)
might be a great way for a dome light, where you need less output on a couple of the sources, and more on the others.

you need 2V more for the buck puck, so your running alternator 14.4v leaves you with 12.4v (on modern new cars).
3x ~3.8v leds = ~11.4v buck drops about 1v.
When car alternator stops voltage drops to 13v then 12v then when battery is low 11v , so at about 12V the output will start dropping bad.
will the car be running during any intended use? at 11V or before the battery is dead, the leds will be barely squeaking out light, this should keep the battery from going dead as quick from the light being left on.

if its not on a car, then you will need more voltage to start out, than say a 12V gell cell or 10xnimhy,
for a 14.4V li-ion, it should cool out just right, or 13-14ni-mhy, ending at 1V per on the low end

the 2 Odd parellel items would be running "lower" so they would be less suceptable to offset problems than if they are full driven, so if they were slightly out of wack, they still would never overdrive.
 
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I would not recommend using Linear regulators to drive XR-e in anything other than a demo function. I would recommend using Luxdrive Bucktoots in the Auto version which offer 40v spike protection as a possibly solution, but best of these is only 420mA output, but I think the best solution is a boost driver like fatman tuned to 700ma and then drop current limiters in for the 350mA outputs
http://www.cutter.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=cut769

or better still the CCHIPO

http://www.cutter.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=cut764
 
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The maximum input for the Fatman is 12.0V :( ....from a smoking :poof:experience YMMV

I would not recommend using Linear regulators to drive XR-e in anything other than a demo function. I would recommend using Luxdrive Bucktoots in the Auto version which offer 40v spike protection as a possibly solution, but best of these is only 420mA output, but I think the best solution is a boost driver like fatman tuned to 700ma and then drop current limiters in for the 350mA outputs
http://www.cutter.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=cut747

or better still the CCHIPO

http://www.cutter.com.au/proddetail.php?prod=cut764
 
The maximum input for the Fatman is 12.0V :( ....from a smoking :poof:experience YMMV


Sorry I meant to say the Maxflex and infact the new Maxflex2(vin 20v)
The new maxFlex2 will be 0.9" in diameter (versus the old at 0.8") but will also use a larger and much more capable inductor. This will raise the input current capability from 2.2A to at least 3A. Of course you will need to heatsink the board appropriately.
 
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