That`s what they claim www.rayovac.com Wonder if this is where the Surefire batts are coming from??? Scroll down a tad and click on "special offer" on the right.
Rayovac 123`s outperform Ultra`s & E-2`s
- Thread starter Badbeams3
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dano
Flashlight Enthusiast
I've been looking into this whole battery thing, and some specs. are hard to fcome by. What I have found (posted previously) is the following:
Duracell 123's rate at 3.3volts, at 1400MAH
Sanyo 123's rate at 3.0v, at 1400MAH
Energizer e2 rate at 3volts, at 1300MAH.
I emailed rayovac ragrading capacity, etc, but they havent responded, yet.
What's more interesting is who exactly is making the cells for other company's...Energizer's are made in Japan, probably by Sanyo. Rayovac's are made in the U.S., possibly by them, as Duracell, the only other U.S. maker, doesn't out source unless the Duracell name is on it. As for the SF123's that are coming out, I'd bet they are being made by Sanyo...
--dan
Duracell 123's rate at 3.3volts, at 1400MAH
Sanyo 123's rate at 3.0v, at 1400MAH
Energizer e2 rate at 3volts, at 1300MAH.
I emailed rayovac ragrading capacity, etc, but they havent responded, yet.
What's more interesting is who exactly is making the cells for other company's...Energizer's are made in Japan, probably by Sanyo. Rayovac's are made in the U.S., possibly by them, as Duracell, the only other U.S. maker, doesn't out source unless the Duracell name is on it. As for the SF123's that are coming out, I'd bet they are being made by Sanyo...
--dan
Size15's
Flashaholic
SureFire SF123A batteries are made in the USA.
I see no reason why these can't be custom-made for SureFire to give them the best possible battery for High powered Flashlights. I assume that DL123As have to compromise to suit a wide range of applications.
The SF213As are designed for SureFires, and according to PK at SureFire, they are the best battery they've ever tested.
Al
I see no reason why these can't be custom-made for SureFire to give them the best possible battery for High powered Flashlights. I assume that DL123As have to compromise to suit a wide range of applications.
The SF213As are designed for SureFires, and according to PK at SureFire, they are the best battery they've ever tested.
Al
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by dano:
Energizer's are made in Japan, probably by Sanyo.
--dan<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
What make you think Energizer is OEMed from Sanyo? Energizer has their production facilities all over the world.
Many corporates build production facilities overseas is to save tariffs, shipping (for product with low price but bulky or heavy) and relations with the particular country.
I didn't realize Energizer sold in the States are made in Japan.
Alan
Energizer's are made in Japan, probably by Sanyo.
--dan<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
What make you think Energizer is OEMed from Sanyo? Energizer has their production facilities all over the world.
Many corporates build production facilities overseas is to save tariffs, shipping (for product with low price but bulky or heavy) and relations with the particular country.
I didn't realize Energizer sold in the States are made in Japan.
Alan
Deuce
Newly Enlightened
The Energizer 123's I have are marked "MADE IN U.S.A." on the batteries. The Rayovac's I have (NOT Ultra's) are marked "Made in Japan".
dano
Flashlight Enthusiast
Holy moly...i've started a small controversy...Anyways, looking at my Energizer E2, 2/3A a.k.a.123-type cell, it says, "sold by Energizer" and then "made in Japan" on the labeling..I dont have any Ray-O-Vac's...
--dan
--dan
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
OK, I'll weigh in with another question....
How can the Duracell batteries be rated at 3.3 volts when they are (arguably) using the same electrochemical recation to generate electricity. The voltage of a battery is dependent on a specific oxidation/reduction (redox) chemical reaction. Hence the old carbon-zinc batteries put out a slightly different voltage than NiCads (2.5 volts vs. 2.75, I think). Any ideas about the 3.3 volt Duracells, or is it just hype? I don't have a voltmeter handy or I would test a DL123 and a Sanyo to see if actual output is as claimed. Let me know if any of you can solve this odd chemical "problem"!
Thanks, Alan
How can the Duracell batteries be rated at 3.3 volts when they are (arguably) using the same electrochemical recation to generate electricity. The voltage of a battery is dependent on a specific oxidation/reduction (redox) chemical reaction. Hence the old carbon-zinc batteries put out a slightly different voltage than NiCads (2.5 volts vs. 2.75, I think). Any ideas about the 3.3 volt Duracells, or is it just hype? I don't have a voltmeter handy or I would test a DL123 and a Sanyo to see if actual output is as claimed. Let me know if any of you can solve this odd chemical "problem"!
Thanks, Alan
Brock
Flashaholic
Along those same lines I don't understand how they could have changes the lithium AA cells from 1.7v to 1.5v I mean aren't the cells 1.7v per cell? If they did actually change them to get the 1.5 what did they do to them? My guess is they just relabeled them as 1.5v cells, but are the made the same.
Hi Brock, ask Craig about this. Several of our members including him reported the one`s labeled 2011 were 1.5 not 1.7...but Gransee reported 1.7 volts off some labeled 2011, leaving me completely confused.
We had thought they had dropped the voltage as a result of complaints involving ruined electronics...those that don`t do well when voltage requirments are exceded.
If this was true, could they have simply placed a resister in them to cut the volts down a tad?
More testing of those labeled 2011 needs to be done to get to the bottom...it is possible they changed the voltage in the middle of the year...so some 2011`s might show 1.5~1.59 and others might show 1.65~1.7.
All of them, including the older one`s are labeled 1.5 volt.
Flashaholics through out the world want to know...what`s up wabbit?
We had thought they had dropped the voltage as a result of complaints involving ruined electronics...those that don`t do well when voltage requirments are exceded.
If this was true, could they have simply placed a resister in them to cut the volts down a tad?
More testing of those labeled 2011 needs to be done to get to the bottom...it is possible they changed the voltage in the middle of the year...so some 2011`s might show 1.5~1.59 and others might show 1.65~1.7.
All of them, including the older one`s are labeled 1.5 volt.
Flashaholics through out the world want to know...what`s up wabbit?
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by dano:
Holy moly...i've started a small controversy...Anyways, looking at my Energizer E2, 2/3A a.k.a.123-type cell, it says, "sold by Energizer" and then "made in Japan" on the labeling..I dont have any Ray-O-Vac's...
--dan<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
No, this is not controversial at all unless you have concrete evidence that they're OEMed by Sanyo.
According to your later post, that's your wild guess. I thought you've read something about Sanyo.
Dano, this is VERY common business practice. It's quite often that when an international corporation setup production facilities overseas, they might create a joint-venture with local manufacturing giant (politically, financially, risk sharing ... etc). Those joint-ventures might be manufacturing more than one brand depending on their agreement. Energizer USA, in this case, might be an importer from this joint venture (different business entity) even if Energizer is the major share holder.
I couldn't recall very well that if Hitachi Maxell or Panasonic's battery production plan was joint venture with Union Carbide (Eveready/Engerizer's parent company).
I still don't understand why they imported it from Japan. May be shipping by vessel from Japan to California is cheaper than local in-land delivery? May be those cells you got are grey market products and those cells are supposed to be shipping to other Asia countries? Where do you get your cells, from on-line shop or major retailers like wal-mart?
Alan
Holy moly...i've started a small controversy...Anyways, looking at my Energizer E2, 2/3A a.k.a.123-type cell, it says, "sold by Energizer" and then "made in Japan" on the labeling..I dont have any Ray-O-Vac's...
--dan<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
No, this is not controversial at all unless you have concrete evidence that they're OEMed by Sanyo.
According to your later post, that's your wild guess. I thought you've read something about Sanyo.
Dano, this is VERY common business practice. It's quite often that when an international corporation setup production facilities overseas, they might create a joint-venture with local manufacturing giant (politically, financially, risk sharing ... etc). Those joint-ventures might be manufacturing more than one brand depending on their agreement. Energizer USA, in this case, might be an importer from this joint venture (different business entity) even if Energizer is the major share holder.
I couldn't recall very well that if Hitachi Maxell or Panasonic's battery production plan was joint venture with Union Carbide (Eveready/Engerizer's parent company).
I still don't understand why they imported it from Japan. May be shipping by vessel from Japan to California is cheaper than local in-land delivery? May be those cells you got are grey market products and those cells are supposed to be shipping to other Asia countries? Where do you get your cells, from on-line shop or major retailers like wal-mart?
Alan
Brock
Flashaholic
I will have to measure mine when I get home. I think I have at least 2 different batches. I can't imagine they would put a resistor in there, otherwise they would loose power to that, and how could they know the load it would be under. A resistor would really be bad in high drain devices, like camera flashes or high output 4 AA lights. Hopefully someone will get to the bottom of what happened or if it is all marketing.
D
**DONOTDELETE**
Guest
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Alan:
I couldn't recall very well that if Hitachi Maxell or Panasonic's battery production plan was joint venture with Union Carbide (Eveready/Engerizer's parent company).
Alan<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Eveready hasn't been "Union Carbide" in years...(like sometime after they tried to blow up india). They were PURINA but I think broke off from them last year.
Just an FYI Duracell isn't with Mallory anymore either.....(in case there are people who remember that)
I couldn't recall very well that if Hitachi Maxell or Panasonic's battery production plan was joint venture with Union Carbide (Eveready/Engerizer's parent company).
Alan<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Eveready hasn't been "Union Carbide" in years...(like sometime after they tried to blow up india). They were PURINA but I think broke off from them last year.
Just an FYI Duracell isn't with Mallory anymore either.....(in case there are people who remember that)
dano
Flashlight Enthusiast
The "made in Japan" Energizer E2 2/3A's were purchased at Target...
--dan
--dan
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by horn:
Eveready hasn't been "Union Carbide" in years...(like sometime after they tried to blow up india). They were PURINA but I think broke off from them last year.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes, I was talking about long time ago when they built production facilities in Japan, a few decades ago. They cut their tie after the disaster in India.
The first time I dealt with Union Carbide was around 20 years ago when I purchased millions of silver oxide batteries from them.
Alan
Eveready hasn't been "Union Carbide" in years...(like sometime after they tried to blow up india). They were PURINA but I think broke off from them last year.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes, I was talking about long time ago when they built production facilities in Japan, a few decades ago. They cut their tie after the disaster in India.
The first time I dealt with Union Carbide was around 20 years ago when I purchased millions of silver oxide batteries from them.
Alan
JoeyL
Enlightened
Hi Folks!
In response to ahargus: the question of voltages on new lithium cells.
I checked a dozen new sanyo 123's and half a dozen duracell ultras that came with a hurricane 12B, with a digital voltmeter which gives readings to 3 digits.
The sanyos ranged from 3.24 to 3.28v.
The duracells from 3.18 to 3.25v.
I had a single new panasonic @ 3.26v.
The meter claims an accuracy of 1%. Still, the cells should rate accurately in comparison to each other. So, the sanyos were consistently higher than duracells. Unless I have a bad bunch...
In response to ahargus: the question of voltages on new lithium cells.
I checked a dozen new sanyo 123's and half a dozen duracell ultras that came with a hurricane 12B, with a digital voltmeter which gives readings to 3 digits.
The sanyos ranged from 3.24 to 3.28v.
The duracells from 3.18 to 3.25v.
I had a single new panasonic @ 3.26v.
The meter claims an accuracy of 1%. Still, the cells should rate accurately in comparison to each other. So, the sanyos were consistently higher than duracells. Unless I have a bad bunch...
Size15's
Flashaholic
What are they like under load?
Can you simulate two batteries powering a 5W lamp and measure them again?
Do you think that the results under loads will be different?
Thanks
Al
Can you simulate two batteries powering a 5W lamp and measure them again?
Do you think that the results under loads will be different?
Thanks
Al
JoeyL
Enlightened
Hello!
That is a good question.
So here are the results:
(I only have sanyos and duracells)
Using a 6P as the load lamp, I connected each pair. But I had to wait about 30 seconds on each to equilibrate, as each pair dropped continuously by about 0.01v per second.
The sanyos ended up at 5.05v.
The duracells at 5.00v on one pair,
and I repeated with another pair, 5.05v.
The performance seems very close. Brock's original runtime data suggested that the duracells were better for overall runtime.
More disturbing to me was that after I checked the cells without load an hour later, they were all under 3 volts.
(2.96v to be exact) So these new cells dropped down from 3.25 or so to 2.96 in just 30 seconds!
That new battery "high" is short lived indeed...
That is a good question.
So here are the results:
(I only have sanyos and duracells)
Using a 6P as the load lamp, I connected each pair. But I had to wait about 30 seconds on each to equilibrate, as each pair dropped continuously by about 0.01v per second.
The sanyos ended up at 5.05v.
The duracells at 5.00v on one pair,
and I repeated with another pair, 5.05v.
The performance seems very close. Brock's original runtime data suggested that the duracells were better for overall runtime.
More disturbing to me was that after I checked the cells without load an hour later, they were all under 3 volts.
(2.96v to be exact) So these new cells dropped down from 3.25 or so to 2.96 in just 30 seconds!
That new battery "high" is short lived indeed...
