SunDrop XR-U

[AlecGold]

I mentioned the Nichia 365nm LE above and this particular LE fits in the Haiku Head with a really intense hot spot and the typical narrow spill beam is also intense. For checking currency and credit cards for their hidden marks, the spot on low (3S driver) is adequate. You have more power for other applications. The XR-U head gives you a really cool UV ball of quite uniform intensity and I would think it would lend itself to some applications better than the McR-17XR reflector. This is a real small niche but I am real impressed with the results. So much so that I thought I had a done deal arrangement with a fellow CPF'er for spliting a run of MCPCB's and I bought 25 of the Nichia LED's in anticipation of having the LE's assembled by now. The MCPCB deal fell through since it was not a priority for the other party and now I still have to go about getting a viable gerber file created and find a source for the MCPCB's.

Which specific type is the Nichia? NCSU034A? In that case the with differs only from 6,5mm to 6,8mm, which could be enough, I guess?
Just want to help make this happen
Are MCPCB difficult to make? I've made pcb's in a former life, so in theory I could do it, just never made MCPCB

 

[McGizmo]

Which specific type is the Nichia? NCSU034A? ......

I am using the 033A but I think the package is the same as that of the 034A. The foot print for these is different than the 083 unfortunately and the MCPCB's I designed for the 083 were tweaked to also serve as a board for the Dragon. Unfortunately they won't work on the UV LED.

 

[AlecGold]

darn, that's a pity.
033 and 034 are indeed the same, so that doesn't work out then.
I'll just sit and wait then

 

[nfetterly]

In the past I always wanted throw - I recently picked up a triple LED P60 drop-in and was surprised how much I liked alot of light with reasonable throw with no hotspot.

I can see how this XR-U would be very nice....

 

[scout24]

After much reading, love the new light, Don. Slightly tighter, slightly throwier version of the Sundrop, with what sounds like great interchangeability of LE's down the road. Smooth beam from edge to edge and the wonderful CRI. Sign me up! I am assuming that the three levels are the same as the sundrop 3S? Can't wait to try to catch the wave!

 

[Illumination]

Awesome. This may just be the "compromise" (1) I've been looking for.

-----------
(1) Compromise between spot and flood - nothing else. I'm sure this light is top notch like all of Dons others.

 

[fyrstormer]

It would be interesting to see what size head you come up with as host to these 4 LED's and what the difference would be between your low and high in terms of flux. I dare say I don't follow your design or how it relates to the SunDrop XR-U as it is.

It doesn't relate to the SunDrop as it is, rather to the general concept of a high-powered pocket floodlight. The idea is to retain the usable low flood that the LunaSol provides, but with better color rendition, while adding (and this is a technical term) a "stupid-bright" high setting for when all you care about is lighting up as large an area as possible. I know the MC-E pulls a lot of current, on account of the 4 dies, so maybe it would be better to have the high mode shut off the hi-CRI LEDs instead of keeping them on -- but in any case, it appears that you've already figured out how to run an MC-E on a single RCR123. You might want to try using the new LiMn cells, as they have lower internal resistance than LiCO cells have, and can output higher amperage as a result.

Depending on the size of the LEDs (I've never managed to get my hands on them), it would either be a 20 or 27mm head. My guess is 20mm is doable, but probably painful to work with.

I got these 083B LED's as samples from Nichia. Painfully, they prety much obsolete the hundreds of 083A LED's that I have already purchased and had mounted on expensive custom MCPCB's. In order to get more from Nichia, I would have to pop for a reel of 1400 LED's and although the unit price is very reasonable, 1400 of them is well beyond my needs and expectations. As an alternative, a friend in Japan has placed an order on my behalf with Nichia Japan for 100 of these LED's. The premium on the unit price is near double but it is still much more viable than the alternative. :green: I didn't get many samples but what I did get will be used in a small introductory wave of these SunDrop XR-U's that I will be launching soon.

Any way I can buy 5 of the 083B's from you?

Also, what is a gerber file?

 

[RocketTomato]

I am not too familiar with building Light engines and I am wondering what is the purpose of the MCPCB? I think it is too provide good thermal contact between the LED and the escrew of the light engine? Or is it to make sure the LED is situated at the proper height for the reflector? Or both?

Out of curiosity, what did you end up using for your proto-Nichia UV?

 

[ptolemy]

I am not sure if I understand the issues with using the Nichia NCSU033A
led, but if there be any plans to make some, it would be extremeley interesting

If Don, were to consider making them, would a count on interested parties help?

 

[McGizmo]

The Metal Core Printed Circuit Board (MCPCB) serves as the mounting board and heat sink for the LED. The LED is bonded to the MCPCB by solder flow of its sink slug as well as anode and cathode. The solder pads provide for centering and orientation of the LED on the board as well as lead wire pads. The thickness of the board and means of securing it to the converter can are also issues to consider in its design as well as its impact on the overall height and geometry of the LE. I have designed these new LE's in such a manner that the MCPCB itself gets jammed between a shoulder in the head as well as against the nickel plated aluminum converter can of the LE. This aids in thermal connectivity and in use, you can feel that the heat takes little time getting to the surface of the light.

It is my understanding that the Gerber file is some form or conventional file used by EE's to communicate the PCB and MCPCB layouts to the board shops. Although the trace design and layout for a LED board is quite simple compared to a typical circuit board, you still need to provide the geometry and other specs in a proper fashion to the board house. I was fortunate in some MCPCB's that I have designed that the houses that made them for me could take some SolidWorks drawings exported as dfx files and convert or render the critical info into a Gerber file. Any EE among us is welcome to correct any mistakes or ignorance on my part here!

I underplayed the significance or at least what I consider to be significant regarding the 083B LED's but I should comment on how cool I think they are!! These are High CRI LED's that also have a relatively high color temperature and look to be "white" and not warm or cold. Their flux and efficiency is also really good compared to what has been available in the past. The Seoul sample is impressive in its own right as well. It slightly out performs the Nichia in output but you need to consider that it is being driven at almost double the current to do so.

 

[Stillphoto]

Wow, the 083B's sound like exactly what I've been looking for, a high cri led closer to daylight. So these are still scarce Don?

 

[AlecGold]

They are not as common as some of Don's lights, but I've been able to find a Sundrop for a really nice price, that way you'll have the light and the led at the same time
Nichia doesn't sell their leds to little modders like us, but Don has bought a reel (1400 IIRC) of these 083A's. I haven't been able to find them in sold single but Don is selling the 083A's per 10, if he has any left that is.

 

[Stillphoto]

Yeah, I passed on the 083A's, though I love it in the Sundrop Don graciously offered me right around the time of the first wave.

I was inquiring about the 083B's...

 

[AlecGold]

But the flux in the 083B's isn't that much higher, around 70 IIRC?
and the Sundrops could swap in time when a 083B or 183 for that matter come available?!
NS6W183 could get 225, now we're talking flux
But i can't find if they have good quality of light, CCI etc.

 

[McGizmo]

.....
Nichia doesn't sell their leds to little modders like us, but Don has bought a reel (1400 IIRC) of these 083A's. I haven't been able to find them in sold single but Don is selling the 083A's per 10, if he has any left that is.

A slight financial problem for me is that I do have hundreds of these left!! :green:

After building a sample LE with a sample of the 083B LED and viewing the results, I realized I was viewing a LED that made all of my present einventory obsolete at least in terms of use in expensive, niche, flashlights. I checked with Nichia America and I could in deed purchase another reel of these new LED's in the same color temp bin and flux as the samples. As I believe I have already mentioned, I have not opted to again make a purchase of 1400 LED's! Instead, I am paying a premium but getting a smaller and more realistic quantity to work with.

The flux of the 083B is typically 70 lumens VS say 40 for the 083A That shounds like more than it visually is but it is noticeable. For me the other and perhaps more significant difference is the higher color temp available in this particular binning of the 083B. I won't know if the LED's I now have on order compare with these samples I am using in the first, small wave of SunDrop XR-U until I get them. :shrug:

I would also point out that I suspect the higher color temp of these Nichias as well as the impressive high color temp of the Seoul sample is likely due to the spikes both have in the blue spectrum. In terms of color rendering, both LED's have excellent CRIa numbers and in fact all of the constituent CRI numbers are excellent with one blaring exception, CRI12 if you review the IS data I measured and posted above. I would guess that if I huunted up a color value chart on the 083A's I used which were lower in color temp, the spike would be lower and probably the CRI12 would be higher. :shrug:

At any rate, since CRI is based on incandescent sources and there are not many readily available that can reach the sunlight's ability to provide good spectrum at or above 5000k, these LED's are offering something new to us, IMHO.

Moving forward, the XR-U heads non specific modularity and ease of hosting new LE's yet to exist will likely be a boon to some of us.

 

[AlecGold]

The flux of the 083B is typically 70 lumens VS say 40 for the 083A That shounds like more than it visually is but it is noticeable. For me the other and perhaps more significant difference is the higher color temp available in this particular binning of the 083B. I won't know if the LED's I now have on order compare with these samples I am using in the first, small wave of SunDrop XR-U until I get them. :shrug:

Just to check, my lack of knowledge is sometimes irritating enormous, but higher color temp in these, says that it is "whiter" light, without the related problems in the past?
Cause in the past the whither light always was due to a blue color spike in the light, which I disliked just a little bit less than the infamous "yellow-green cat-urine" tint of the first batch of LuxeonV's that I got to see. That is why these 083A's are now my favorite!

Would it be possible to buy a few of these 083B's when they come available to you? The dimensions are on paper the same, so I could try to replace them on my MCPCB

 

[Stillphoto]

Ah, Alec beat me to the punch...The 083B seems like exactly what I've been looking for for a little light i want to build for use in the film / photo industry.

 

[McGizmo]

Hi guys,
I really don't want to get side tracked buying and selling LED's but let's wait until I get them and see how they perform. Perhaps I can sell a small "lot" of them to one of you and you can then divvy them up if there is enough interest. :shrug:

 

[fyrstormer]

All I know is I'm in for 5 of them, whoever ends up selling them. I'd be in for a SunDrop too, but I've already spent waaay more than a high-class date on you and all I have to show for it is a couple of lame flashlights. :devil:

 

[maxspeeds]

I'd be in for 2 of the 083B Nichias :devil: