Surefire boring service

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precisionworks

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Received this from Mattaus by email & thought it may be of general interest to V10R owners:

To summarize:


- I'd like the handle section smoothed flat so that it has a Mac's EDC look about it.



- Is there anyway to create some grooving to make it less plain? Again Mac's EDC-ish...such a simple and clean design those lights! Nothing substantial - just something to break it up a bit, or is that really too difficult to do on this light?



- On the V10r Ti you have used as your experiment you've beveled the edge of the battery tube that connects to the head of the light so it's not just a sudden right angle from handle to head. Can this be done on both ends of the tube (so the start of the tail cap as well)? Or is it only feasible on the head end? Obviously the angle of the bevel needs to match on both ends otherwise it would look a bit 'off'.

A look at Mac's EDC shows the design Mattaus is looking for:

Image-9853934-151709214-2-Web_0_058dc7e35184b7dcd7773c12e679597f_1


Shallow grooves like those can be cut but a "form tool" will have to be ground so that each groove has a 45° shoulder where the groove meets the raised section. Not too big a deal.

The grooves need to stay shallow & I'll have to measure the V10R tube to see how deep they can go. Even though the tube is almost 2.5mm thick a groove depth of 0.5mm on the radius leaves the tube at just 1.5mm thick. Probably thick enough but Mattaus will have to decide this.

The bevels on both ends of the battery tube are easy enough to do. This reminds me of the American fast food chain Burger King:

Image-9853934-151709701-2-WebSmall_0_b90143e0d68da9e5f035392597a72fb2_1


:nana::crackup:
 

Mattaus

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The bevels on both ends of the battery tube are easy enough to do. This reminds me of the American fast food chain Burger King:
Image-9853934-151709701-2-WebSmall_0_b90143e0d68da9e5f035392597a72fb2_1
:nana::crackup:

We had Burger King here but a local chain called "Hungry Jacks" (which are basically the Aussie version of BK) sued the pants off them and BK haven't been seen since.

On to the light...

I'm trusting your judgment Barry! I'm not a materials expert, I have no experience with machining, and my engineering expertise is in air nav - certainly nothing structural. I'm the kind of guy that will kick a wheel and tell someone the car is fine, even if the steering wheel is missing! OK, so maybe I'm exaggerating a little, but I'm sure you get the point. Honestly I'm happy for you to go to town on this light. If it was the Ti version then I'd be a bit more apprehensive, but as it stands I'm willing to watch you work your magic.

If you think 1.5mm will be strong enough then so do I. Keep in mind I'm not a heavy user - I have other lights I take camping, so these sorts of lights will rarely leave the house or the glove box in my car.

So long as I get something working back!

- Matt

EDIT: For the record I like MACs EDC look so if that's what you end up trying that would be perfect. I'm not a massive fan of knurling, but if you think of something interesting or different you would like to try, let me know!
 
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grayhighh

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Go through some of your post about milling trit slot on the haiku. Man, you did awesome job. At some point i'll have to sent my pak to you to do some trit slot work.
 

precisionworks

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Go through some of your post about milling trit slot on the haiku. Man, you did awesome job. At some point i'll have to sent my pak to you to do some trit slot work.
Thanks Cary :)

The Twin Trit Tail has generated quite a bit of interest & one member is scheduled to send his in for the double trits. If anyone thinks up something else that's new or different I'd like to hear about it & explore the idea. There are lots of trit locations that have yet to be discovered.
 

stoli67

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DSC_0023.jpg



DSC_0021.jpg



My new V10R battery tube.... Thanks Barry.... I love it... the trits and the grooves... not to mention the bezel!

IMG_0038-1.jpg


IMG_0037-1.jpg
 
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Mattaus

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OK,

I semi rushed this first pic but hopefully it gets the image I have in my head across. It's missing the beveled edge leading to the tail and the head of the light, but the idea is the raised grooves. Thanks Stoli for the picture ;-):



I think it's technically possible but I have never owned nor held a V10 so I can only go by the pictures I've seen. It's sort of what you showed us back in post #429(!), but the thicker area at the end of each tube is machined on the inside edges instead of the outside....if that makes sense. It just looks more symmetrical (is this even the right context for that word?) and cleaner in my honest opinion. Each to his own at least haha!

Let me know what you think. I'm working on a second 'design' now but I probably won't get that done before bed time :(

Cheers!

- Matt

EDIT: I've sort of given up on the second idea because try as I might I can't get it drawn properly. Basically it was to machine the cell tube totally flat as originally intended, and the re-instate the 8 original small grooves to the tube. The grooves would differ this time however in that they would be unbroken for the entire circumference of the battery tube (so no flat spot every 90 degrees) and there would be 10 (add one more each end of the original set of 8). The grooves would all retain the original grooves width, depth and spacing. If the depth proves to be an issue given the tight tolerances already present, then they can be shallower and still achieve the same effect I'd imagine. Pretty simple to explain I guess.

I told you it neither idea was exactly ground breaking!
 
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precisionworks

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OK,

I semi rushed this first pic but hopefully it gets the image I have in my head across. It's missing the beveled edge leading to the tail and the head of the light, but the idea is the raised grooves. Thanks Stoli for the picture ;-):



I think it's technically possible but I have never owned nor held a V10 so I can only go by the pictures I've seen. It's sort of what you showed us back in post #429(!), but the thicker area at the end of each tube is machined on the inside edges instead of the outside....

With apologizies to Stoli ... something like this, where the orange rectangles cover the metal to be machined away?

Image-9853934-152000153-2-WebSmall_0_85cd79af0c790bfa612c5c6182a6edcf_1
 

Mattaus

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With apologizies to Stoli ... something like this, where the orange rectangles cover the metal to be machined away?

Image-9853934-152000153-2-WebSmall_0_85cd79af0c790bfa612c5c6182a6edcf_1

Yup that's pretty much it. Looking at the rounded ends of that central flat spot it looks as if they have just a large enough amount of flat before they curve to be machined to look identical to the 3 'grips' in the middle.

As for the edge beveling on the ends of the tube (to the tail cap and to the head) the best look would be to match the angle used to bevel the top edge on each of the grips. As I understand it the grip edges look beveled on the tail side (roughly a 70 degree angle?) and perpendicular to the tube on the head side. Is this correct?
 

precisionworks

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Yup that's pretty much it. Looking at the rounded ends of that central flat spot it looks as if they have just a large enough amount of flat before they curve to be machined to look identical to the 3 'grips' in the middle.

As for the edge beveling on the ends of the tube (to the tail cap and to the head) the best look would be to match the angle used to bevel the top edge on each of the grips.

I'd never thought to make 5 equally spaced grooves ... DUH :twak: Great idea & it should look really good ... I may have to license that from you :)

As I understand it the grip edges look beveled on the tail side (roughly a 70 degree angle?) and perpendicular to the tube on the head side. Is this correct?
The insert is a 55° diamond & (check my math) the angle from the tube to the bevel is 90°+35°=125°. The other side is perpendicular to the tube.
 

Mattaus

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The insert is a 55° diamond & (check my math) the angle from the tube to the bevel is 90°+35°=125°. The other side is perpendicular to the tube.

Where does the 35° come from? I'm no machinist so I'm not sure how a 55° insert actually cuts...125° does look right at least. When I guessed 70° I was 'measuring' my angle counter-clockwise. 5° off on a visual guess is not bad!!!

I may have to license that from you :)

**Hands over license free of charge**
 

precisionworks

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Where does the 35° come from? I'm no machinist so I'm not sure how a 55° insert actually cuts...125° does look right at least...

Disclaimer - It's 0540 here & only two cups of java have been consumed.

The included angle can either be read as 55° measured on the head side of the bevel or 35° measured on the tail side. The 35° angle is 90 <55> = 35. Set a bevel protractor on the tube & the "back" or angled face is 35° past perpendicular, so 90° + 35° = 125°

The reason for my excellent math skills is that I had to take each math class twice in order to pass :thinking: :nana:

YMMV
 

Mattaus

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Disclaimer - It's 0540 here & only two cups of java have been consumed.

At that time tomorrow morning I'll be....fast asleep :nana:

The included angle can either be read as 55° measured on the head side of the bevel or 35° measured on the tail side. The 35° angle is 90 <55> = 35. Set a bevel protractor on the tube & the "back" or angled face is 35° past perpendicular, so 90° + 35° = 125°

Seems straight forward enough. I just wasn't sure how the cutting insert is actually shaped, nor am I aware of how they are 'applied' to the surface they cut. Hence why I couldn't understand how a 55° insert cuts a 35° angle, though I of course realised 90° - 55° clearly had something to do with it!!!

I never failed maths and I even did Astro Physics at university. That doesn't mean I have to like it :sick2:
 

precisionworks

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... wasn't sure how the cutting insert is actually shaped, nor am I aware of how they are 'applied' to the surface ...

Image-9853934-152063171-2-Web_0_a92d92e0acb6ba81df3a295add3cd228_1


Not sure that the image is easy to interpret ... the tail end of the body is held in the split collet chuck & the head end is supported by the white Delrin rod. The tool is moved toward the chuck & the "front" face of the insert machines a 90° angle when it meets the groove/ridge location. Then the tool is moved in the reverse direction & the "back" face of the insert produces the bevel angle.

FWIW inserts aren't designed to cut on the back face but that looked like the best option considering the tooling available. One insert is ready for the trash can after profiling one tube :mecry:
 
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Mattaus

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Ah! Makes perfect sense...I should become a machinist now. Not! I'll leave it to the experts I think ;-)

My tube shouldn't waste one of your inserts, being plain old boring Aluminum after all.
 

precisionworks

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... My tube shouldn't waste one of your inserts, being plain old boring Aluminum after all.
+1

Carbide inserts can have a long life in aluminum alloys. Aluminum generates almost as much heat as titanium at the cutting point but aluminum rapidly conducts the heat away from the point. Ti has limited thermal conductivity, is many times tougher to shear away, and eats inserts like a kid eating candy.

A lathe or mill is run at a speed determined primarily by the type material being machined. Cemented carbides soften when they reach a very high temperature & the goal is to run the machine as fast as possible without softening (actually plasticizing) the insert. Most reference material suggests about 1000 surface feet per minute (393 M/min) in aluminum. Titanium runs around 100 sfpm (39 M/min). Even though the aluminum part is turning ten times faster than the Ti part the cutting tool has longer life.
 

Mattaus

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I really should get my hands on a Ti light one day. The result must be worth far more than the effort and cost to produce them.

+1

Carbide inserts can have a long life in aluminum alloys. Aluminum generates almost as much heat as titanium at the cutting point but aluminum rapidly conducts the heat away from the point. Ti has limited thermal conductivity, is many times tougher to shear away, and eats inserts like a kid eating candy.

A lathe or mill is run at a speed determined primarily by the type material being machined. Cemented carbides soften when they reach a very high temperature & the goal is to run the machine as fast as possible without softening (actually plasticizing) the insert. Most reference material suggests about 1000 surface feet per minute (393 M/min) in aluminum. Titanium runs around 100 sfpm (39 M/min). Even though the aluminum part is turning ten times faster than the Ti part the cutting tool has longer life.
 

precisionworks

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I really should get my hands on a Ti light one day. The result must be worth far more than the effort and cost to produce them.
Cannot explain the appeal except that it looks good, is awfully tough, nearly impossible to corrode, and very light for the strength it has. Not many other metals combine all those attributes. Once you hold or use a McGizmo, Mac's Custom, Mirage Man, etc. you may find it hard to put down. No matter what you do, don't even look at anything from Cool Fall or PhotonFanatic - their lights would look at home in the Museum of Modern Art :)
 
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precisionworks

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Too late :-(
Don't worry, there's a 12-Step Program for flashaholics :nana:

Finally some great news about my dismal broadband - the DSL line gets severed today & is replaced with a cable modem guaranteed to run at 15 mbs download (+/- 10%). That will be an asset for photo upload/download to the hosting site I use.

Because of the ISP switchover my email address is changed. To send an email please click on PrecisionWorks in my sig line & go to the website. Some of my email is disappearing before I can reply & there was an email this morning that asked IIRC about what rechargeable cells can be run in a SF LX2.

The LX2 is built with essentially E-Series dimensions & that means a factory bore size that just allows a CR123 to easily slide in. To use a 17mm cell (17670) the tube is bored/reamed/honed to just a few thousandths (about .08mm) over battery size. Bore ends up at 0.692" (17.6mm), O-ring groove outside diameter is 0.752" (19.1mm) & battery tube retains great strength.

A number of E-series tubes have been bored for 18mm (mostly 18650) but the O-ring wall is left somewhat thin. Those tubes are reamed to 0.728" (18.5mm) & final honed to 0.728+. O-ring wall thickness is 0.012" (.3mm). No one has yet had a failure on one of these tubes but it is possible that impacting the head at just the right angle with extreme force would cause a separation.
 
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