Surefire E1B/E2DL UI differences

[mspeterson]

I have been playing with my new E2DL a lot lately, awesome light!, and noticed that the E2DL resets to high mode much faster than the E1B. By my very unscientific measure (counting one one thousand...), and starting with the light on in momentary high level, the backup requires a count of four one thousand before it will reset to high (skipping low mode all together), while the E2DL only needs a count of one one thousand to reset to high.

Kudos to Surefire for the thoughtful design!!! I tend to use both modes on my E1B alot and have really come to appreciate the intuitive UI. With the E2DL, I tend to use the high mode almost exculsively, and the quicker reset makes it function more like a single mode light with a "hidden" low if you need it.:thumbsup:

Anybody else notice this?:shrug:

 

[SureAddicted]

The E2DL is a light I'd like to get soon as well. With the E1B's UI, mine takes the advertised time to reset...approx 2 seconds, and it also states that in the manual. 4 seconds is a bit to long, if mine took that long I'd send it back to surefire. Could it be possible that your battery is low?

The light does continue to astonish me...so small yet throws so far. One thing I don't like about the E1B is that my other lights don't get much use, but thats a good problem.

I agree, kudos to SureFire for the little gem.

Steve

 

[Blindasabat]

I don't have an E1B to compare to, but my E2DL takes just over 1 full second to go back to high.
One thing I did notice though, is that if I tap it quickly a few times, I can get it to go "High, Low, Low, High" as long as the two low taps are fast enough to be within the default time to go back to High. It does not always immediately go back to high as described bt SF. In real use I don't see this as an issue, since I am never trying to flash it three times in 1.2 seconds...

 

[mspeterson]

My E1B functions flawlessly, and has been my EDC since they came out. The reset is a "4 one thousand count", on a fresh battery, and I wouldn't change that even if I could! Mine is from the first batch, I wonder if the recent batches are programmed differently? My E2DL has a very noticeably faster reset (by that I mean the time it takes to get consecutive high's). Surefire states on their website:

"Two-stage tailcap switch: press for momentary-on at high setting, release and press again (within two seconds) for momentary-on at low setting; click for constant-on at high-setting, click off and on again (within two seconds) for constant-on at low setting"

IMO, this means that "within two seconds" is the time you have to get the next level, and it would then take longer than two seconds for a reset?:shrug:

Oh, and if you like the throw of the E1B (which is impressive!!!), you will love the E2DL, it's a freakin' monster!

The E2DL is a light I'd like to get soon as well. With the E1B's UI, mine takes the advertised time to reset...approx 2 seconds, and it also states that in the manual. 4 seconds is a bit to long, if mine took that long I'd send it back to surefire. Could it be possible that your battery is low?

The light does continue to astonish me...so small yet throws so far. One thing I don't like about the E1B is that my other lights don't get much use, but thats a good problem.

I agree, kudos to SureFire for the little gem.

Steve

 

[mspeterson]

I've noticed the "consecutive lows" as well, and would guess that it is more a function of "user error" than a flaw in the UI. Here's a quote, by me, from a previous thread on the same subject...

"IMHO, the new E1B interface is the best that I've found for my personal needs, previously the PD and L1/L2/A2 held the top spot, to me. It took about a day or two to become fluent in the use of this new interface; like Steve I'm more used to the HDS "speed tap".

Once operation became second nature, I noticed that occasionally I would get low on consecutive presses. I tried every variety of Surefire tailcap as well as a McTC, same result, occasional consecutive lows.

Then I tried again, using a Z52, making a firm press and removing my thumb each time AND leaving the light on for a count of "one" each flash. No double lows in 150 presses...thats where I stopped. It would seem to me, based solely on my single unit, that the electronics in the head function flawlessly. Based upon my unscientific "experiment", I might conclude that a "fast tap" at low isn't being registered in the head, due to operator error."


It sounds like your E2DL works the same as mine, cool! I really like the faster reset on this light!

I don't have an E1B to compare to, but my E2DL takes just over 1 full second to go back to high.
One thing I did notice though, is that if I tap it quickly a few times, I can get it to go "High, Low, Low, High" as long as the two low taps are fast enough to be within the default time to go back to High. It does not always immediately go back to high as described bt SF. In real use I don't see this as an issue, since I am never trying to flash it three times in 1.2 seconds...

 

[SureAddicted]

Oh, and if you like the throw of the E1B (which is impressive!!!), you will love the E2DL, it's a freakin' monster!

Lol, thats the general consensus among E2DL users. If your happy with the way it operates, then thats all that matters. The first batch could of been programmed differently, who knows. Im not sure if SF will divulge that info, maybe the guru's here could shed more light on it. (no pun intended)

Steve

 

[JNewell]

I'm probably impaired in some fashion, but I find it very easy to "over-run" the E1B UI. In other words, to try to change from high to low and wind up getting high on the second tap. I'm just tapping the tailcap switch too fast.

For the specific designed uses for the E1B, the UI is perfect. For general purposes, where you might not want to start on high, I think a low -> high sequence is better, and I prefer the L1 system. I do own an E1B, though, and it's in one of my bags right now - and I don't plan on getting rid of the E1B. It's a great light, but not my personal idea of a general purpose light.

 

[Justin Case]

IMO, a UI such as the one implemented by the electromechanical McE2S 2-stage switch is far superior to the SF E1B's UI.

The McE2S allows you to access Low mode first, if you want. Or, you can press harder to drive straight through to access High mode directly. You can get back to Low by easing up the pressure on the button. Or release completely to turn off.

You can manually strobe the light in High by simply pressing hard (relatively speaking -- the required force isn't that much) repeatedly as fast as you can.

You can get in constant-on Low mode by turning the tailcap. Further turning gets you to constant-on High mode.

A 60 ohm resistor in the McE2S combined with a KL4 head, gives a Low mode comparable to the lowest setting on a Gladius (~1 lumen), which works great for close-in work at night. If that Low level is too low, you can use other resistances such as 22 ohm or 30 ohm.

I've noticed on a Kaidomain 2363 multimode P60 drop-in that the reset delay is about 2 sec if you drive the lamp with two CR123A cells. If you drive the lamp with a single 3.7V Li-ion, then the reset delay is about 10 sec. Perhaps, as someone else suggested, your batteries are running low.

IMO, if you can't access High mode immediately, the light is not useful as a so-called "tactical" light. IMO, if the electronics are not robust and result in scrambled mode sequences, that is bad design and again unsuitable for "tactical" use.

 

[SureAddicted]

The people who buy the E1B DONT want the light to come on low first.

steve

 

[Justin Case]

If you are referring to the McE2S switch wrt to getting High mode first, the McE2S gives you the option of accessing either Low or High mode first. A softer press gives you Low mode immediately. A harder press straight through the button's travel stroke gives you High mode immediately without going through Low mode. The stroke length is short so effectively you access High mode as fast as you can press the button.

I would also think that the people who buy the E1B would want High mode to always be immediately accessible. Blasting some offender with only a couple of lumens when you expected a lot more is most likely not a good thing. Unfortunately, that can happen with the E1B UI design.

Regardless, the point is that IMO the SF UI is poor because it doesn't work even as-claimed (in addition to the flaws I perceive with the UI as-designed). Time delay is variable, mode cycling gets messed up. Unpredictable operation is unacceptable IMO for a so-called tactical light. YMMV.

 

[SureAddicted]

You have a point, I don't expect anything I buy to be perfect. If i had paid 3 x as much for the E1B then I'd expect it to be perfect. How much is the McE2S switch and where can it be purchased?

Steve

 

[270winchester]

you know, there are several SFs that also do that. The L1, L2, U2, A2, and Kroma all do that already.

I can't recall who made the true 2-stage tailcap first, but in the case of most of the Surefires, both levels are regulated rather than the low being resistor-controlled. There are merit to both but some may prefer one to the other base on simplicity or regulation-oriented.

of course the issue behind the McE2s versus SF 2-stage switches is a whole other can of worms that any third party shouldn't get too involved in discussing.

IMO, a UI such as the one implemented by the electromechanical McE2S 2-stage switch is far superior to the SF E1B's UI.

The McE2S allows you to access Low mode first, if you want. Or, you can press harder to drive straight through to access High mode directly. You can get back to Low by easing up the pressure on the button. Or release completely to turn off.
...

 

[Justin Case]

you know, there are several SFs that also do that. The L1, L2, U2, A2, and Kroma all do that already.

I can't recall who made the true 2-stage tailcap first, but in the case of most of the Surefires, both levels are regulated rather than the low being resistor-controlled. There are merit to both but some may prefer one to the other base on simplicity or regulation-oriented.

of course the issue behind the McE2s versus SF 2-stage switches is a whole other can of worms that any third party shouldn't get too involved in discussing.

Please don't confuse a user interface with electromechanical switch vs electronic regulation/driver design. My point was to highlight some perceived shortcomings in how the E1B operates in terms of accessing Low and High modes (i.e., the user interface). As you say, a discussion of using resistors vs an electronic circuit is a different matter entirely.

 

[Justin Case]

You have a point, I don't expect anything I buy to be perfect. If i had paid 3 x as much for the E1B then I'd expect it to be perfect. How much is the McE2S switch and where can it be purchased?

Steve

The Sandwich Shoppe carries the necessary parts. I got a McE2S flat switch (you can get it in a kit and assemble it yourself, or get it assembled for a few dollars extra -- it's easy to assemble, so I would get the kit), the associated rubber boot, and a flat Aleph tailcap.

IIRC, the McE2S flat switch kit is about $30, the boot is $4, and the Aleph flat tailcap is $20.

Note that this switch is meant for LED heads only, not incandescent lamps. With an incandescent, the Low mode will probably not light up the lamp at all, or maybe give a weak output. But even if the lamp doesn't light up, battery power is being dissipated through the resistor, and your batteries will be dead without your knowing it if you screw down the tailcap and unknowingly access the Low mode but don't screw down the tailcap enough to reach the High mode.

Also, if you have an OpticsHQ E2 replacement head, the 60 ohm resistor is still not enough to provide for a dim Low mode. My guess is that you need something like 200 ohms if you want a single digit lumen Low mode. The 60 ohm resistor does give a nice low Low mode when using a KL4 head, though.

 

[270winchester]

And I was trying to point out that if you were looking for a instant-on high option, the lights I listed already do that, and the end UI is the same. If you don't like the E1B, there is always the L1 Cree.

of course I'm assuming you are aware of how the L1 works.

Please don't confuse a user interface with electromechanical switch vs electronic regulation/driver design. My point was to highlight some perceived shortcomings in how the E1B operates in terms of accessing Low and High modes (i.e., the user interface). As you say, a discussion of using resistors vs an electronic circuit is a different matter entirely.