surefire E2D LED Defender vrs Olight M20 Warrior PREMIUM

[nohcho]

I wonder if Sirefire can pitch in on this matter. I am not sure if surefire "underestimates" lumens across the board, E2DL might be an exception. For instance P60L module is rated at 80 lumens and it looks about right. That said E2DL is bright as hell, on par with M30, however M30 has i little more spill.

 

[MrGman]

I measured my new E2DL just a few minutes ago. and the big news is


😱😱😱 210 lumens at turn on and still 203 lumens after a full minute plus warm up, on high. 😱😱😱

8.1 lumens on low.

That's going to make a lot of SureFire Believers very happy I guess. I can't say that I blame them. It is what it is.

I was shocked to see it but since I own it I can't complain.

I lost a small gentlemanly wager over this one so its literally costing me to publish the truth (not that I wouldn't) Just goes further to the shock factor. Its far better than advertised at 120 lumens. I am guessing that E2DL sales are going to go up, since it is in the 200 lumen class. More power to them. Time for breakfast.

 

[Mike D]

Wow very impressive!

What I cant figure out is why they would underestimate the output so much??

 

[MattK]

Wow - that's a lot higher than the 160 we saw. I wonder if sphere size is playing a factor or if it's just batch/emitter/component variation.

 

[deranged_coder]

I measured my new E2DL just a few minutes ago. and the big news is


😱😱😱 210 lumens at turn on and still 203 lumens after a full minute plus warm up, on high. 😱😱😱

8.1 lumens on low.

😱 😱 😱

Thanks for doing the testing and publishing the results. Awesome work! :thumbsup:

 

[steveG]

Does anyone pocket carry the E2DL? Do they have problems with the bezel creating holes or damaging products in there pockets?

It depends on which pocket you carry it in. If you keep it in one of your back pockets and sit regularly it will absolutely tear a hole in your pocket (it did mine). If you carry it in your front pocket or cargo pants lower pocket then it's not likely.

I've been carrying my E1L or 6P in my back pocket for months with no issues. It only took a few days for my E2DL to poke through.

 

[Strauss]

I measured my new E2DL just a few minutes ago. and the big news is


😱😱😱 210 lumens at turn on and still 203 lumens after a full minute plus warm up, on high. 😱😱😱

8.1 lumens on low.

That's going to make a lot of SureFire Believers very happy I guess. I can't say that I blame them. It is what it is.

Nice work MrGman! I have used the same light-meter set-up for over 2 years now and have found a calculation that gives me appx lumens. I KNOW that it isn't 100%, but it works in giving me a ballpark estimate. I must say it always seems to end up at least 90% correct compared with others proper findings.

I am an experienced CPF'r and know how to distinguish brightness. When I posted on here saying that my E2DL was at least 200 lumens, I meant it. I am not upset in any way over this, just wanted to let you know that "sometimes" I know what I'm talkin about 😗

Once again, thanks for all your efforts with your IS. It puts to rest all these "claims" that people like me make. Your results give us 100% results, and I appreciate that very much. You da man....da Gman! :thumbsup:

 

[Strauss]

Wow - that's a lot higher than the 160 we saw. I wonder if sphere size is playing a factor or if it's just batch/emitter/component variation.

I'd be willing to bet it's just batch/emitter/component variation. When I bought my E2DL, I tested a few others the store had in stock. The one I went home with was noticably brighter than the others and also had the best tint. So if the brightness was enough for me to notice in a side-by-side comparo, I'd say there could be up to a 50 lumens variance....after all they are only rated for 120L 🙄

 

[N/Apower]

I measured my new E2DL just a few minutes ago. and the big news is


😱😱😱 210 lumens at turn on and still 203 lumens after a full minute plus warm up, on high. 😱😱😱

8.1 lumens on low.

That's going to make a lot of SureFire Believers very happy I guess. I can't say that I blame them. It is what it is.

I was shocked to see it but since I own it I can't complain.

I lost a small gentlemanly wager over this one so its literally costing me to publish the truth (not that I wouldn't) Just goes further to the shock factor. Its far better than advertised at 120 lumens. I am guessing that E2DL sales are going to go up, since it is in the 200 lumen class. More power to them. Time for breakfast.

Good stuff, but the victory is a hollow one as I knew this would happen. In that line of thought, I am offering that instead of sending me 12 Surefire CR123A's, I will send MrGman MY M600C so that he can test it as long as he return-ships it as per my PM to him. If he is willing to change the wager after the fact, we will have results from 2 of these "illumination tools". (This alteration to the wager will monetarily cost less for MrGman than the 12 Surefire's, should he choose to accept).

 

[MrGman]

Wow - that's a lot higher than the 160 we saw. I wonder if sphere size is playing a factor or if it's just batch/emitter/component variation.

We have two 6 inch spheres that we use. I have talked to my Optical Engineering friend about this several times including this morning. It normally comes down to the size of the reflector or optic head and output. Larger heads with light coming out from larger diameter source need to be integrated through a bigger sphere. That is why the 6 inch sphere onlycomes with a 1.5 inch opening and the 12 inch sphere has about a 3 inch opening and bigger spheres have bigger openings. And then each has to be calibrated. My friend is a PhD and has tested many light sources himself and believes that for what we are doing with LED's that this should be as accurate as its going to get.

What were your measurements taken on?

 

[MrGman]

Nice work MrGman! I have used the same light-meter set-up for over 2 years now and have found a calculation that gives me appx lumens. I KNOW that it isn't 100%, but it works in giving me a ballpark estimate. I must say it always seems to end up at least 90% correct compared with others proper findings.

I am an experienced CPF'r and know how to distinguish brightness. When I posted on here saying that my E2DL was at least 200 lumens, I meant it. I am not upset in any way over this, just wanted to let you know that "sometimes" I know what I'm talkin about 😗

Once again, thanks for all your efforts with your IS. It puts to rest all these "claims" that people like me make. Your results give us 100% results, and I appreciate that very much. You da man....da Gman! :thumbsup:

Well you made me a believer. I saw so little brightness in the spill that I thought that is where the difference is. That's why I love just having the sphere of truth. It even sets ME straight. G :thumbsup:

 

[N/Apower]

Well you made me a believer. I saw so little brightness in the spill that I thought that is where the difference is. That's why I love just having the sphere of truth. It even sets ME straight. G :thumbsup:

A lot of people thought how you did G.

THen again, my application is vastly different than most people and that allowed me to see the true output of this light. Many people use it up close. I use it to throw a (relatively) HUGE hot-spot down-range almost 100 yards. My Malkoff M60 wouldn't do it, neither would any other light this size that is weapon-mountable. The hotspot on this thing is massive, and has enough lumens in it to punch down range like a freight train. That is why I love it so much.

The F04 beam diffuser that fits the E2DL also fits the M600C, I guess that means 1.0" bezel size?

ETA: Within the week we should have info on the KX2C head to see if this E2DL was a freak or not. *In the mail*

 

[MattK]

We have two 6 inch spheres that we use. I have talked to my Optical Engineering friend about this several times including this morning. It normally comes down to the size of the reflector or optic head and output. Larger heads with light coming out from larger diameter source need to be integrated through a bigger sphere. That is why the 6 inch sphere onlycomes with a 1.5 inch opening and the 12 inch sphere has about a 3 inch opening and bigger spheres have bigger openings. And then each has to be calibrated. My friend is a PhD and has tested many light sources himself and believes that for what we are doing with LED's that this should be as accurate as its going to get.

What were your measurements taken on?

Interesting - guess circuit/emitter batch variation must account then for the large difference in results given that we saw ~160L.

We tested with:
10" Labsphere Flash Lamp Measurement System:
10" Flash Lamp Measurement Sphere
CDS 600, CCD based Spectrometer
External Forward Flux ???
LPS-100, Preset power supply

 

[neilki]

How does the 120L L4 compare with the E2Dl?

 

[MattK]

The 120L L4's just started shipping last week so I don't imagine anyone has had a chance to test one yet.

 

[deranged_coder]

AWESOME! Is there any way we can get an out-door comparison at 100' or something?

My best attempt at getting some outdoor beamshots. Same disclaimer applies; my camera is a basic point and shoot, all beamshots were taken with the camera automatically adjusting white balance, aperture setting, speed, etc.

I took these photos behind my office building earlier, just before I headed home. I did not have the smooth reflector for the Olight with me so the photos with the textured reflector are all I have.

 

[DHart]

deranged... it appears from the images that your SF has a comparable brightness overall and a bit broader beam than the M20... but unfortunately, the auto setting on the camera will compensate for brightness differences between the lights, making the comparison inaccurate for judging relative illumination levels.

 

[deranged_coder]

deranged... it appears from the images that your SF has a comparable brightness overall and a bit broader beam than the M20... but unfortunately, the auto setting on the camera will compensate for brightness differences between the lights, making the comparison inaccurate for judging relative illumination levels.

Quite true, which is why I posted that disclaimer. Sadly, that is all my simple point-and-shoot camera can manage. Maybe I can do some side-by-side outdoor shots sometime in the future so relative illumination levels can be compared. But, as you pointed out, at least you can still see the differences in the beam profiles.

 

[N/Apower]

Quite true, which is why I posted that disclaimer. Sadly, that is all my simple point-and-shoot camera can manage. Maybe I can do some side-by-side outdoor shots sometime in the future so relative illumination levels can be compared. But, as you pointed out, at least you can still see the differences in the beam profiles.

That is why I love my M600C so much. Tonnes of throw, but it doesn't have this pencil thin beam that most SMO reflectored lights have. IT is a useful weapon's light for shooting at something that might be moving (and would quickly be lost from illumination at 80 yards as it scurried out of the beam.) That is why I run this instead of my 6P with Dereelight 1.2A Q35A pill. Great color and throw on that one, the beam just to narrow.

 

[Forgoten214]

Oh ok. Yeah I was considering getting one of these if I can use 3.7 rechargeables such as the AWs. Also being able to carry it in my front right pocket. I was concerned with if it will damage my clothing or items. Does the E2DL also take 18650s?