SureFire P60 and P61 Beam Quality Question

[NCBirdHunter]

I am a relative newbie to "real" flashlights and recently purchased five SF G2 Nitrolons. I also purchased an extra P60 LA and a P61 LA.

After having read all of the praises on this board regarding the quality of SureFire beams, I was expecting a flawless overall beam. Anxious to check out my new lights, I fired up each one and shined them on a flat wall approx. 1-2 meters away. While I must admit that the quality of the "hotspots" in each of these seven LA's is perfect, I was a little surprised to see quite a few artifacts, shadows and partial rings in the "spill" area of each (see graphic below -- the area I refer to as the "spill" area is shaded in gray and is all of the area outside of the hotspot).

Since all seven LA's exhibit these "blemishes" in the spill area, I presume that they are normal. Yes/No?

Your comments would be appreciated...

OzMan

 

[yclo]

Blemishes located in the spill area could be caused by artifacts on the lens.

Being in a G2, the lexan lens will easily suffer more imperfections than pyrex lens.

 

[NCBirdHunter]

Thanks, yclo.

I thought the same thing when I first noticed it -- but I only found one very shallow surface scratch (about 3/16" long) on one of the lenses. All the other lenses do not appear to have any imperfections; perhaps the naked eye is incapable of seeing the type of imperfections that a 65/120 lumen lamp brings to light (no pun intended).

 

[Size15's]

Where the reflector edge meets the bezel there are a number of things going on (like the ridge up against the reflector sits, the o-ring, the lens and the retaining ring etc)
These can cause a narrow group of rings that you can obsure if you place something about 2mm out over the lens from the top of the retaining ring which on a white wall will stick out into the beam to about where your yellow arrow sticks out to. The A2 has these too. I think it's light reflecting off the edges of the flashlight.

Do you notice them in use or only on a white wall test?

Al

 

[NCBirdHunter]

[ QUOTE ]
Size15s said:
Do you notice them in use or only on a white wall test?

[/ QUOTE ]
Only on a white wall test.

 

[tsg68]

My C2 has them too and it has pyrex so I think it must be the reflector junction like Al said or the reflector isn't perfectly centered in the bezel and is catching the edge of the retainer ring or lens and casting it into the spill. As a comparison my Pelican M6 doesn't do it.

Later,
TSG /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Size15's]

Not all SureFires do it. Not even all of the same type. I have two G2-YL right here that I picked off the shelf. The cleaner one has them but not the dirty one (which happened to need it's SF123As replaced based on the comparison - unregs suck)

E Series don't do it.

Of the 17 P60 Lamps I tried; 3 do it. I also notice that beam colour varies loads as some pairs of SF123As are fresher than others (unregs suck)

I'm not sure what it is that causes it.

Al

 

[tsg68]

Hey Al,

Have you tried switching out lamp assemblies to see if it could be problematic to the reflectors? I am curious to see if it might be the reflectors on the assemblies themselves.

Is there a difference in the bezel assemblies of the smaller E series?

Later,
TSG /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Size15's]

All SureFires differ

I did not have time to swap things around. You're most welcome to send me an email to remind me to try this when I get home tonight!

Al /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[McGizmo]

Hi guys,

I would like to propose a possibility to the seen artifacts. The perimeter section of the beam on a wall isn't necessarily from light coming from the perimeter of the light source. One thing that does vary on the P60's and P61's is the tip of the lamp envelope. Is it possible that these artifacts are coming from direct light (non reflected) that has originated from the lamp and effected by the envelope tip?

You could test this by covering the tip with something. Just a wild guess.

- Don

 

[chamenos]

don: i think you've hit the nail on the head /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif take a normal maglite, remove the head and turn it on and the same rings described in the spill of the P60/P61 can be observed in the light cast by the maglite bulb. some of the light from the tip of the bulb in a P60/P61 would never hit the reflector, and this produces the spill of light around the hotspot. since the light was never smoothed out by the reflector, the artifacts would be inevitable. the difference in maglites is that since the reflector is smooth, the artifacts are magnified or accentuated in the hotspot as well.

 

[Size15's]

What I'm seeing is in line with the filament regardless of the style of bulb tip. The P60 has no frosted tip and a few of my P60's show what you are seeing I believe. The A2 does also and it has a frosted tip.

It's not the bezel though because the bare Lamp Assembly still does it. Back to my two yellow G2's - the "PH-4" does it whereas the "PE-2" doesn't.

Al

 

[McGizmo]

I did some look see as well and I agree with Al that it isn't the tip of the envelope with a direct flow of photons out the front end. It now appears to me that it may be an internal reflection of light in the envelope that exits out side of the focal point of the reflectors parabolic surface? Interesting, but hardly a call to question the beam quality, IMHO. At any rate, I do see some rings in the perimeter of the corona on a G2/P61 but in my case you have to get the light close to target for these to have any effect.

- Don