The New King of Throw: Reflector Types Only; Tested and Confirmed!

[wbp]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

Is it just me or does it look like he's testing an OP DBS vs an A10?

Doesn't really say much.

Who is this "he"? We tested a DBS with the R2 pill and SMO reflector.

Which, by the way, I measured at 265 lumens output the last time I checked this particular pill.

William

 

[evenchaos]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

So now it puts out blue light? You got the emitter hot enough to burn off the phosphor! :eeksign:😳
Amazing that it even works at all now...

Yes, it still works now, tint is slightly blue (could even be just a preconception now). It put out blue light the moment I powered it on with the 2x18650 cells - no gradual transition, but wasn't kept on for more than a second. It may be possible that my emitter isn't glued on quite right so it wasn't able to stand up to the high current unlike lightforce2's copy.

 

[saabluster]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

Absolutely! Throw and lumens, both. PM to discuss details...

PM to ya. Thanks

 

[saabluster]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

To tell the truth, this thread hasn't really told me much about this light. King of this, king of that, light meter this, light meter that. King is in the eye of the holder of the light. Only way I'm really going to know about this light is to take it out and test it in the night next to another light. This light (from limited beamshots I've seen) is a little too focused for me (too small of a spot at distance). I think I'd be much more interested in the Ace version. I'd like to test the Ace to compare it to my T1.

What do you want this thread to tell you? Its obvious by the title of the thread what the point is. The king of throw. Thats it. If you want more on this light go find a different thread. Guess what? If you want to find the "King of Throw" you need a light meter. :shakehead

 

[MrGman]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

I just tested my A10 R2 with 2 primary batteries and it drew 1.19A of current off of fresh ones. With one freshly charged 18650 it draw 1.25 amps from that battery. Not going through the switch, just the ammeter on the back end.

Its interesting because I tested the 2 batteries that were in it and one read 100 percent and the other only 20 percent and those were the ones I measured the lux at 5 meters with. Can't help but wonder if they were totally fresh how much better it would have been. So those got dumped for the fresh ones to measure the current draw.

Its amazing to me how some people want to know the truth until it goes against the light they already have or made their favorite. If you think lighting up a fairly large swatch of tree branches at some distance is meaningful and have no gauge for the size of that beam and call that important and another beam as "too small" when you don't even know what it is, you are clueless. This is all about throw at long distances. I have no vested interest in Tiablo, This is my first light from them. If the Dereelight or Raidfire Spear were better I would have simply ordered up one of those this morning to be my "keeper". The Tiablo A10 puts out a rock solid beam of light that is well defined. It also has a very good amount of spill.

The photos I have seen thus far don't do this light or the other 2 for that matter any justice at all. Sorry to say it and no offense to the hard work those guys put in trying to get those pics, but they just don't measure up to what the eyes see with these lights. They don't show the true difference. This beam would be great for lighting up various animals in the field at 100 yards or a man size perp sneaking out behind that tree.

When I have the time and better night time weather I fully plan to take some beamshots of color poster targets of people that I have used before leaning against those trees, hopefully at 100 yards to show that this beam is more than adequate to light them up compared to those other lights. If it was a mediocre beam I would have no problem saying it. WBP owns the Dereelight with various accessories and the Raidfire Spear and he saw and acknowledged immediately the Tiablo was far and away the better thrower type light. It is what it is and truth is truth.

I have been one of the few who have said from the very beginning of all the beam shots I have taken that they just don't do the lights justice and this is very much more the truth with thrower lights like these. Either they are overexposed and the beam looks too good or they are too dim and without sufficient depth of the contrast to show the variations in spill patterns next to the hot spot which make up part of what these lights are and what they can do.

Now on another note I saw my friend who did in fact get his brandy spankin new Tiablo A10 ACE. His batteries didn't come in so I dropped in 2 of my 18650's and then four of his new SureFire CR123's (it says it takes up to 12 volts). Worked fine on either. It was very bright and strong and steady with my 2X18650's. We lit up the creek behind his house like nobody's business. I also saw the "+" sign on his wall and could not dial it out. If I turned the front end enough to get rid of it I had a donut hole instead. So I found a combination of soft blur of the + sign and no real donut. Looking out in the yard at the trees along the creekbed of course there was no + sign to see in the beam pattern. It is very bright. Even with the big reflector (OP of course), it is not nearly as tightly focused as that of the R2 unit. Its very nice to have. I am sure it is over 600 lumens easily. I had my Eagletac T10C2 and Fenix T1 together making a single beam pattern to the left of it in the grass below and that is well over 450 lumens. I could easily see they were not as bright as this ACE off to the right. Its a nice light, but I am confident it won't have the peak lux of the A10 R2. But it will get tested, probably in a week with WBP and his very accurate equipment.

Now I am not a big fan of thrower type lights in general. My Fenix T1/EagleTac T10C2 and Malkoff M60 have been my favorite style lights which I have said in numerous threads. But I recognize a great thrower when I see it, and what it can be used for. The Tiablo A10 is a great tactical thrower type light. Its a keeper.

To me the MCE and P7 style lights are semi disappointing in that all they are only flood lights. Big soft beam with no real well defined hotspot. If they do get focused you see the actual gap between die which drives me crazy but evem still, a wide soft beam pattern. Great if you need that much light but not really impressive beam pattern.

More to come.

 

[evenchaos]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

At 64 meters in Ernie's beamshots, the DBS puts out much more useful light.

And everyone else who is saying the beam is too narrow on the A10. Yes, that is what a better "real" thrower is going to put out. You will get that "useful beam" distribution at a further distance. The thing is that it will be dimmer because of the distance - you need more lumens emitted. Given the same led, hotspot MUST be smaller to get more throw.

 

[PhantomPhoton]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

To me the MCE and P7 style lights are semi disappointing in that all they are only flood lights. Big soft beam with no real well defined hotspot. If they do get focused you see the actual gap between die which drives me crazy but evem still, a wide soft beam pattern. Great if you need that much light but not really impressive beam pattern.

More to come.

Have you seen a Wolf Eyes P7 or MC-E yet? My P7 has a very decent hotspot; a bit larger than a single emitter light, but definitely a nice hotspot; no doughnut, no crosshairs.

Anyway thanks for reporting your findings. 'Bout time something (non custom, and in the same class (18650) beat out the DBS.
I'd love to see what the DEFT gets for both OTF lumens and lux. I absolutely love mine, especially on foggy nights. I'll soon buy an MC-E for it too. :naughty:

 

[alohaluau]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

To MrGman and wbp,

Thanks for the hard work and testing you have put into this thread, I'm glad I've got my Tiablo A10 R2, just playing the waiting game for my ACE to arrive...

Cheers,
Luau

 

[jirik_cz]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

Looking at some of the beamshots it looks like the ACE has around the same central hotspot intensity as the R2, but a bigger hotspot (and higher power drain) because of the multi die led. If I do buy one I'll be happy to send it to you for testing.

Don't think so. I've meausured around 20k lux with Tiablo ACE and 30k lux with DBS R2. Both measured from 4 meters and converted to 1m.

The important thing is, that in the real world the difference between 20k, 30k or even 50k lux is not as big as it seems on the paper 😉

 

[lightforce2]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

Did you test it with just the switch or the meter inline? I only held the button for a second so hopefully it didn't do any permanent damage.

With the DMM in series at the back end. I forget the amperage now but I remember it was scary at the time

 

[Megalops]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

To me the MCE and P7 style lights are semi disappointing in that all they are only flood lights. Big soft beam with no real well defined hotspot. If they do get focused you see the actual gap between die which drives me crazy but evem still, a wide soft beam pattern. Great if you need that much light but not really impressive beam pattern.

I'm pretty much a newbie as far as flashlights, but I have an MCE Jetbeam M1X which has a very well defined hotspot. It will also light up reflectors along the end of a dead end road at 0.7 miles away. You may want to check one out if you get a chance. The cross pattern is noticeable against a flat surface at distances less than 50', but not an issue for most real life situations. Needless to say, it has a very well defined beam.

 

[ergotelis]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

I should have mentioned, how old is your 3SD? I think the early 3SD's were 1A to the emitter. The current 3SD's should be 1.2A, and draw more around 1.4A from the 18650.

I think i am having the oldest ones.I bought a 3sd circuit at the very first launch. I am not using them anymore in DbS only in other flashlights!

 

[supergravy]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

To me the MCE and P7 style lights are semi disappointing in that all they are only flood lights. Big soft beam with no real well defined hotspot. If they do get focused you see the actual gap between die which drives me crazy but evem still, a wide soft beam pattern. Great if you need that much light but not really impressive beam pattern.

I felt the same way until I bought a Solarforce L900M. Sure it has a wide spill area but it also has a beautiful beam with a tight hot spot. The X in the hot spot is almost non-existant and can only be seen on a wall from less then a foot. Outside it is like a D26 drop-in on steroids. For reference with my light meter I am getting 17,000 lux at one meter with the L900M compared to under 10,000 lux with my DBS MC-E. This is short of the 26,000 or so lux I get with a R2 DBS but still the most impressive quad die light I have tried.

As for your test for the king of the throw - thank you! Even though I am a DBS owner I really appreciate your test and the methodology used. I would be tempted by the A10 if I weren't having so many quirky problems with Tiablos' other new light the TL-1.

 

[Glenn7]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

is this thread only for lights with reflectors?? - if not - then I have the LED king of throw its the DEFT :nana: and thats 5 x as brighter than the DBS in lux so what are these puny lights you are all talking about 😀 - just stirring 😗 but if you want to see my DEFT then just look up into the night sky :ironic:

PS: Saabluster could chime in and give the lux @ 1 meter as i have forgotern it just now - but i know its real scary high :wave:

 

[MrGman]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

is this thread only for lights with reflectors?? - if not - then I have the LED king of throw its the DEFT :nana: and thats 5 x as brighter than the DBS in lux so what are these puny lights you are all talking about 😀 - just stirring 😗 but if you want to see my DEFT then just look up into the night sky :ironic:

PS: Saabluster could chime in and give the lux @ 1 meter as i have forgotern it just now - but i know its real scary high :wave:

Is the DEFT a production light or a one of a kind custom build? If its one of a kind that not everyone can simply order off a website and buy it doesn't really count. I understand WBP is going to test it for you and I am probably going to be right there to help him and would love to check it out. So if this is something we can all run out and buy tell us where we can get one. I have seen some photos of it you have posted in the past and I already know its awesome, but doesn't do me any good if I can't get one for myself.

I have not seen the Solarforce L900 or the Wolf Eyes MC-E units personally to see if they have a good hot spot or not. I haven't seen any test results saying that they have hot spot lux readings higher than the Tiablo A10 posted anywhere (separate issue). I will say that I have my Malkoff Triple Drop which already has over 700 lumens out the front, its a wonderful light. It has somewhat of a mid range hot spot, its in a convenient form factor, so when I say I am not all that impressed with the P7/MC-E's not having a good hot spot, its because I want something a step above what I already have in that department, but not something I have to custom build myself. A single diode with a big reflector should have a tighter beam than a triple unit with 3 smaller reflectors to my way of thinking. A screw on front aspheric lense to replace the bezel crown would be nice.

 

[saabluster]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

Is the DEFT a production light or a one of a kind custom build? If its one of a kind that not everyone can simply order off a website and buy it doesn't really count. I understand WBP is going to test it for you and I am probably going to be right there to help him and would love to check it out. So if this is something we can all run out and buy tell us where we can get one. I have seen some photos of it you have posted in the past and I already know its awesome, but doesn't do me any good if I can't get one for myself.

Well MrG the DEFT certainly is one-of-a-kind. I think there is an argument that could be made either way as to whether or not it is a custom or a production unit. Personally I consider it a production piece albeit production is small right now. I do plan on expanding in the coming year to have stock so that anyone who wants one can have it shipped immediately. As is there is no plan to have it be a limited run custom kind of thing. Production will continue for the forseeable future. There is a waiting line for a lot of high-end cars like Ferrari but I don't think that the fact that someone can't go and immediately buy some of these cars makes them non production pieces. Yes but the DEFT uses a host you say. Well a lot of production cars are built on the platforms and use the parts of other cars. Maserati comes to mind. Limited production built using Ferrari parts. Probably about as close an analogy as I can think of. I'd say its fair to say the DEFT is the Maserati of the flashlight world.

Regardless of how you view it it is the king of throw. Debating size class is another issue however as the DEFT is clearly in a different size class than the A9, DBS and so forth. Seems to me that one logical divider to decide what class one of these lights would fall into is whether or not it fits easily in a pocket. Even there it would be hard to define but the new Tiablo does seem to be in a different size class than even the DBS. I think the DBS was already pushing it.

 

[Glenn7]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

well then for this Maserati the DEFT - I seem to remember a lux reading of 156.000 lux @ 1meter - but correct me if I'm wrong :naughty:

 

[MrGman]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

well then for this Maserati the DEFT - I seem to remember a lux reading of 156.000 lux @ 1meter - but correct me if I'm wrong :naughty:

I am guessing you meant 156,000 or 156K lux and not a paultry 156 lux with 3 meaningless zeroes behind the decimal point. That would be a good number, 156 lux would be a total joke.

But I still would consider it a custom mod light and not a production unit but that's just my vote.

 

[Glenn7]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

yes 156000 not 156

 

[saabluster]

Re: The New King of Throw Tested and Confirmed!

well then for this Maserati the DEFT - I seem to remember a lux reading of 156.000 lux @ 1meter - but correct me if I'm wrong :naughty:

Its somewhere in that range. Someone did a calculation based on my measurements from about 500' where I found the DEFT to have 8X the throw of a Tiablo A9. But it would be nice to have even more accurate testing results.