I know there is a seemingly endless amount of flashlight companies out there. How many people here still would consider surefire to be at the top of the list in terms of performance and quality. I know there are cheaper lights out there, but the ones I seem to buy (dorcy, river rock, ect) seem to be of a lower quality than SF. (Of course there is a big cost difference)Is there other major companies that you guys feel are better? I am a knife/gun person with lights comming in third, so I am not too up to date with my info, although if you have any high quality (500.00 and up knife questions,) I can answer them for you. BTW: I have a surefire M6, Surefire L5 and a Surefire L1 CREE that should be here any day, can't wait for it. Thanks..
Votes for surefire
- Thread starter INFI
- Start date
Help Support Candle Power Flashlight Forum
Outdoors Fanatic
Flashlight Enthusiast
There isn't any other manufacturer of high-end mass produced flashlights as good and respected as SureFire.
Although there are a few companies out there that are more innovative than Surefire of late, such as Fenix & WolfEyes, the quality of their finished product isnt in the same class in terms of overall quality, durability etc. They are certainly giving it a good effort though.
boosterboy
Enlightened
Without SF, people would have no one to copy off.
I buy SF for one reason, warranty.
Their interface is idiot proof.
They have good output and runtime combos.
They don't exaggerate total output.
Some of their lights I can't justify, like their M6, I think it could be 150$ cheaper.
I buy SF for one reason, warranty.
Their interface is idiot proof.
They have good output and runtime combos.
They don't exaggerate total output.
Some of their lights I can't justify, like their M6, I think it could be 150$ cheaper.
jrv
Newly Enlightened
I don't consider lumens to be innovation. Any Chinese company that enters the market does so with a bright emitter. Bright LED lights require no talent, no innovation, just a tube, a battery and a couple of bits to enclose the front.
Surefire is easily the best at mass marketing with overall quality, both design and manufacturing quality.
You can get LEDs brighter elsewhere and cheaper elsewhere but once you move past these two priorities - which nearly every new Chinese vendor can do right from the get-go - to things such as waterproof, ruggedness & durability, etc - there's aren't many LED flashlight manufacturers in the same league in volume.
Surefire is easily the best at mass marketing with overall quality, both design and manufacturing quality.
You can get LEDs brighter elsewhere and cheaper elsewhere but once you move past these two priorities - which nearly every new Chinese vendor can do right from the get-go - to things such as waterproof, ruggedness & durability, etc - there's aren't many LED flashlight manufacturers in the same league in volume.
Relojero
Newly Enlightened
I recently bought my first Surefire, a 6p to which I added a Malkoff dropin. Surefire is in a whole different class of flashlight, IMO
Now that NovaTac is manufacturing lights for the public, albeit not on the same scale as SF (since they really only have one product that they just happen to sell 6 variations of), I would still consider them another manufacturer of high-end mass produced flashlights. Their product is definitely innovative, extremely durable, waterproof and just very well made using quality materials not to mention that they stand by their product with a Lifetime Warrantee. As far as output goes (which I personally like to evaluate aside from the build quality, UI, etc...), at 120 lumens it can definitely hold its own in the usability category and for those who have no use for 120 lumens just change the output via the UI (for 120P) or save a few bucks and pick up the 85/t/p.
John
John
who
Newly Enlightened
Some people tend to forget the breath and depth of Surefire products.
If you take one particular Surefire and compare it to another light of your choice, it could be rated inferior on certain criteria. You just have to look at the totality, and track record.
Surefire products are better and more consistent than most custom lights out there (I do have a few custom lights to compare).
I do buy many other brands, and currently carry a Novatac 120P, but in the end SF is it. For example, there is no one company that can offer you the G2, A2, L1, L2, L4, L5, U2, or Kroma under one roof.
As far as price, let me use an analogy in high-end audio. The first $1-2K will get you 90% high-fidelity. The next 5% will cost you several hundred thousand dollars, and I have listened to such systems. You can never reach 100%.
Surefire gives you that elusive 95% in flashlight for just ~ 2X price, with a real lifetime warranty. A real bargain in my book.
If you take one particular Surefire and compare it to another light of your choice, it could be rated inferior on certain criteria. You just have to look at the totality, and track record.
Surefire products are better and more consistent than most custom lights out there (I do have a few custom lights to compare).
I do buy many other brands, and currently carry a Novatac 120P, but in the end SF is it. For example, there is no one company that can offer you the G2, A2, L1, L2, L4, L5, U2, or Kroma under one roof.
As far as price, let me use an analogy in high-end audio. The first $1-2K will get you 90% high-fidelity. The next 5% will cost you several hundred thousand dollars, and I have listened to such systems. You can never reach 100%.
Surefire gives you that elusive 95% in flashlight for just ~ 2X price, with a real lifetime warranty. A real bargain in my book.
Illum
Flashaholic
my opinion: when i think of surefire I think of a basket of "____fires" where surefire is the egg made of solid gold while being surrounded by other ____fires that are likely foul eggs wrapped in gold foil
that being said, I suppose the "____fire" fans will attack me now :candle:
that being said, I suppose the "____fire" fans will attack me now :candle:
Dr.K
Enlightened
I like surefire just fine, but I like anything that lights up just fine also.
Sorry, guess this didn't help......I still enjoy striking matches in the dark:candle:
Sorry, guess this didn't help......I still enjoy striking matches in the dark:candle:
BSCOTT1504
Enlightened
Very well said.......:thumbsup:
HotWheels
Newly Enlightened
I recently moved into the country,with deer and a small bear making appearances in the backyard,and I take my SF 9P out everytime I go outside at night. I'm new to high-quality lights and I love it! So much light from such a small body.oo:
oo:
WadeF
Flashlight Enthusiast
My Dereelight CL1H 2.0 is the closest to Surefire quality that I own.
in incan times, there simply was nothing else than SF - their bulbs were the best.
Now You have to add a powerful led to normal sized SFs (read: 6P the one everyone starts with) to get them equal to better priced lights.
Thats why the package of Fenix is hard to beat in the moment.
PS: my 6P modded with Cree, Flupic and 18650 is my best light and gets used often and for everything - even night trail riding.
2+ hours of pure white light, every time till now under the 3 most powerful lights around. Cant be smaller and better
Now You have to add a powerful led to normal sized SFs (read: 6P the one everyone starts with) to get them equal to better priced lights.
Thats why the package of Fenix is hard to beat in the moment.
PS: my 6P modded with Cree, Flupic and 18650 is my best light and gets used often and for everything - even night trail riding.
2+ hours of pure white light, every time till now under the 3 most powerful lights around. Cant be smaller and better
LED61
Flashlight Enthusiast
Surefire flashlights are impressive to be sure. Their warranty service is second to none and it sure has been for me.
That been said, there is other very nice and dependable lights that can be had for a fraction of the cost. I own two high power excellent HID's, none of them Surefire, three incans--one of them being the M6, and three LED's--one being a Surefire Kroma, the other an HDS, and a McGizmo XR19C. I wouldn't trade any of my lights (I have already picked the best and sold off those I didn't want, including a U2).
So, I give my votes to Surefire but to other manufacturers as well.
That been said, there is other very nice and dependable lights that can be had for a fraction of the cost. I own two high power excellent HID's, none of them Surefire, three incans--one of them being the M6, and three LED's--one being a Surefire Kroma, the other an HDS, and a McGizmo XR19C. I wouldn't trade any of my lights (I have already picked the best and sold off those I didn't want, including a U2).
So, I give my votes to Surefire but to other manufacturers as well.
LightJaguar
Enlightened
- Joined
- Apr 2, 2007
- Messages
- 321
In my opinion Surefire is on top of the game when it comes to flashlights. Out of all the flashlights that I own a Surefire has been the only one that has failed so far though. To me that's unacceptable for a $100+ flashlight. I EDC a cheap $20 dollar Chinese light that has been used and abused a lot and it has yet to fail me.
Surefire does have the sex appeal, but I'm no Surefire fanatic either.
Surefire does have the sex appeal, but I'm no Surefire fanatic either.
I generally can't stand some of Surefire's business practices. (Too many to name). So yes, I did try to find a rival company that's just as good as Surefire; in terms of overall quality. Some came awfully close.... PentagonLights, Streamlight (certain models), Inova, etc.
Some could even compete with Surefire or did better, in one category or another. However, I must admit that in terms of overall quality; none could topple Surefire. The company also has no rival when it comes to clip-carried lights. Something that for some of us, especially me, is very important. (I have a Night-Ops Gladius that sits at home, for lack of a clip & a good holster to carry it in. Still, I'd probably grab my Surefire L5 most times).
I've had experience with clips that screw directly into the barrel. They seem strong, but are quite weak. Ironically, I've had better luck with wrap-around clips. Still, nothing beats the Surefire design for attaching a clip to a barrel. The only other company that comes close is PentagonLights. But Surefire's system is still better.
Some Surefire models could be replaced with equivalent lights from other companies..... Some cannot. You won't find the performance of an L4 in a similar sized or smaller package. You can find it. And it's going to be bigger, heavier, probably without a great pocket-carry clip. Show me a light from another company as good or versatile as a Kroma.
Most of Surefire's competitors don't support their lights with a good range of various holsters. (PentagonLights does a decent job of this. Wish I could say the same thing about Inova).
If Surefire was a person, she'd be a musical Diva.... Demanding, sometimes arrogent, sometimes hard to deal with.... But when it's showtime, when it's time for her to perform; you know it's going to be great. When it really matters, you'll be glad you bought a Surefire.
(And when the performance is less than great, like Surefire not recalling the U2 after it became clear a significant number of them failed to perform reliably out of the box; you get to give that diva a raised eye-brow. :ironic: .... And chances are, the problem will be fixed sooner, rather than later).
Overall quality = Surefire.
*But if anyone knows of a company that can beat it on that, please post!
Some could even compete with Surefire or did better, in one category or another. However, I must admit that in terms of overall quality; none could topple Surefire. The company also has no rival when it comes to clip-carried lights. Something that for some of us, especially me, is very important. (I have a Night-Ops Gladius that sits at home, for lack of a clip & a good holster to carry it in. Still, I'd probably grab my Surefire L5 most times).
I've had experience with clips that screw directly into the barrel. They seem strong, but are quite weak. Ironically, I've had better luck with wrap-around clips. Still, nothing beats the Surefire design for attaching a clip to a barrel. The only other company that comes close is PentagonLights. But Surefire's system is still better.
Some Surefire models could be replaced with equivalent lights from other companies..... Some cannot. You won't find the performance of an L4 in a similar sized or smaller package. You can find it. And it's going to be bigger, heavier, probably without a great pocket-carry clip. Show me a light from another company as good or versatile as a Kroma.
Most of Surefire's competitors don't support their lights with a good range of various holsters. (PentagonLights does a decent job of this. Wish I could say the same thing about Inova).
If Surefire was a person, she'd be a musical Diva.... Demanding, sometimes arrogent, sometimes hard to deal with.... But when it's showtime, when it's time for her to perform; you know it's going to be great. When it really matters, you'll be glad you bought a Surefire.
(And when the performance is less than great, like Surefire not recalling the U2 after it became clear a significant number of them failed to perform reliably out of the box; you get to give that diva a raised eye-brow. :ironic: .... And chances are, the problem will be fixed sooner, rather than later).
Overall quality = Surefire.
*But if anyone knows of a company that can beat it on that, please post!
tino_ale
Flashlight Enthusiast
One little question related to Surefire built quality : which alloy are they machined from? 6061-T6? 7075-T6?
Last edited:
PK has mentioned the alloy a couple times in the past but I can't remember if it is for public consumption or not and it's moot because I can't recall the specific alloy. It is an uncommon alloy that the mill makes specifically for SureFire. I am pretty sure it is a 6000 series of T6 hardness. I think the main point here is that SF goes the extra mile in obtaining an alloy that has advantages over the commonly available ones. I don't know if the advantage is in machining or physical property enhancements or some combination of both.
I believe SureFire was here and established well before any LED was used in portable illumination and I suspect they will be going strong with a full range of product after the solid state revolution has settled down if and when that might be the case.
With the depth and breadth of their offerings as well as the apparent market demand and often back logged condition of supply, there is still a multitude of niche markets and new developing markets which SureFire has not addressed or catered to, IMHO. By and large, I suspect that the markets SF has elected to cater to are served no better by any other manufacturer; if any other mfg is even close. If quality, stability and forward progress over the long haul are priority, I don't see how one could satisfy the interests of those primarily focused on the latest and greatest and cutting edge when there are others who have entered the market today and may well be gone tomorrow.
Lame analogy but a stable solar system can't be served by a super nova.
To respond to the OP, I for one consider SF at the top of the game in terms of quality and performance. If an expensive and performance oriented product is purchased, its value and success as a purchase likely needs to be evaluated in terms over its maturity and useful life. Many of us retire a light to the shelf within a few months of acquiring it. That's not what products like SF's are about. :shrug:
I believe SureFire was here and established well before any LED was used in portable illumination and I suspect they will be going strong with a full range of product after the solid state revolution has settled down if and when that might be the case.
With the depth and breadth of their offerings as well as the apparent market demand and often back logged condition of supply, there is still a multitude of niche markets and new developing markets which SureFire has not addressed or catered to, IMHO. By and large, I suspect that the markets SF has elected to cater to are served no better by any other manufacturer; if any other mfg is even close. If quality, stability and forward progress over the long haul are priority, I don't see how one could satisfy the interests of those primarily focused on the latest and greatest and cutting edge when there are others who have entered the market today and may well be gone tomorrow.
Lame analogy but a stable solar system can't be served by a super nova.
To respond to the OP, I for one consider SF at the top of the game in terms of quality and performance. If an expensive and performance oriented product is purchased, its value and success as a purchase likely needs to be evaluated in terms over its maturity and useful life. Many of us retire a light to the shelf within a few months of acquiring it. That's not what products like SF's are about. :shrug:
270winchester
Flashlight Enthusiast
the new L1 is by far the most useful non-custom light I have ever owned.
but all my SFs are user-lights, they take a beating a keep working. my L4 looks like it's been trapped in a suspension shock coil spring for 100 miles after two years of use and abuse, but it still works and still water proof.
different kinds of LEDs come and go. a dependable light is just that, what I can depend on.
but all my SFs are user-lights, they take a beating a keep working. my L4 looks like it's been trapped in a suspension shock coil spring for 100 miles after two years of use and abuse, but it still works and still water proof.
different kinds of LEDs come and go. a dependable light is just that, what I can depend on.
Last edited:
