What is a Mag85?

ciam

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powernoodle said:
There are cheaper plastic adapters, each of which are the size of a 3D battery and each which hold 3 AA batteries (so you have to use 3 of them), but dont use these unless you have to (IMO).

Would you please elaborate a little more on this part? Is it unsafe.... maybe because of its plastic construction? Or just inefficient.... maybe due to the more/poorer contact points in this setup? Or something else?

I figure that the most expensive components of a top Mag85 mod are the cells and their holder. So, I plan to power the light initially with my existing 2500mAh NiMH cells in 3 of those cheaper plastic adatpers. Then, upgrade to FiveMega's 9 x protected 14500s to 3D eventually. Just want to make sure I could live to make the upgrade.....
 

Delvance

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Basically, the plastic holders aren't very sturdy and won't last long as you have to keep taking them apart to get the batteries out for charging. Some people have also had contact issues with these holders and they also don't work well/at all with CBP 1650's until you mod them with solder etc.
 

davidra

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It's safe. I actually ran one of my Mag85's on 9 lithium AA's from BS before I got rechargeables. Output seemed pretty good to me and the holders held up well. You need to be careful taking the top off to avoid breaking the little tabs, but they worked fine for me.....
 

Brighteyez

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If these are the plastic holders from Litemania, a co-worker ordered some of those. I tried a couple last night and they would not make proper contact in a 2D Mag to illuminate the bulb. It was late and I haven't had an opportunity to determine if which pole was not making contact. I did take a couple of the adapters and stick them into an old Eveready 2D light (stamped steel reflector) with a Mag 6 cell Mag-num Star Xenon bulb and it lit up rather impressively; something in a magnitude exceeding the throw from a Stinger and that from the Mag LED lights. Will poke around a little more to see if I can get it to work reliably in a Mag.

Delvance said:
Basically, the plastic holders aren't very sturdy and won't last long as you have to keep taking them apart to get the batteries out for charging. Some people have also had contact issues with these holders and they also don't work well/at all with CBP 1650's until you mod them with solder etc.
 

PlayboyJoeShmoe

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The 3AA-D holders are not terrible by any stretch, but care must be used!

I clearly marked mine with a sharpie as to cap and battery orientation.

I have enough Jonathan and FM adapters now for my needs, but just barely!!!
 

Brighteyez

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The adapters are working fine in another flashlight. There just seems to be some break in the circuit when they're used in a Mag. Didn't have time to fool around with it much last night, but my guess is that either the positive button isn't touching the contact spring in the Mag, or the tailcap spring isn't making adequate contact with the negative pole.

BTW, the adapters do have + and - molded into them. A little Liquid Paper, or tire marker into the indentation would make it stand out much more without having to resort to other colors.

PlayboyJoeShmoe said:
Yep. M*g 2D, 3D, Rayovac 2 and 3D etc.

Carefully check battery orientation! It's terribly easy to make a mistake, hence my sharpie mod!
 

PlayboyJoeShmoe

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OH! Just thought of this! If your tailcap spring is stock, it probably has a big enough cehter hole to not create a negative connection. The mod is to close up the top coil with pliers or such. Or use a flat washer to help.

Sorry I forgot that!
 

Brighteyez

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Yeah, that was what I was going to do if it turned out to be the negative end that wasn't making adequate contact. Pretty much the same thing that Doug did at http://flashlightreviews.com/reviews/maglite_2c-123a_mod.htm

The Mag 6 cell Xenon seems to have a lot of latitude (I was able to power it with 2 D cells and get a beam that was bright enough to project across a room), so I figured I'd put a D cell in series with the battery holder (total of 4.8 or 6V) and jockey around to see which end doesn't work.

And this is indeed a variation of the 2c-123a mod, except that it uses 6AAs and a 2D body.

EDIT: Looks like the problem with the battery adapters from Litemania were with the positive pole. The button doesn't protrude far enough to reach the contact spring on the Mags. Guess I could try a dab of solder or soldering a thick washer to it to increase the height. Open to any other ideas as well.

PlayboyJoeShmoe said:
OH! Just thought of this! If your tailcap spring is stock, it probably has a big enough cehter hole to not create a negative connection. The mod is to close up the top coil with pliers or such. Or use a flat washer to help.

Sorry I forgot that!
 
Last edited:

NikolaTesla

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Kinda like this:


DSCN3770.JPG



9 NiMh cells without regulator powering Welch Allyn 1185 bulb. Above uses potted bulb. Below bipin version:

DSCN3768.JPG
 

bimemrboy318

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What about using 4xCR123s in a Mag 2D with the Mag85 setup?



Delvance said:
Graphicator, welcome to CPF :).


Both the 1650 and 2500 batteries you refer to are just rechargeable NiMH. The 1650 has less runtime but will make the light brighter (these batts. perform better under load than the 2500s) whilst the 2500s will give more runtime but less light output (the voltage of each cell sag more than the 1650 when the batt. is put under load ie. the lamp).

If you buy the light-edge turn key [email protected] would recommend getting a universal smart charger. These chargers allow you to charge ALL the batteries in the holder (so you don't have to remove them each time) and they also do it quite fast and auto cutoff when they sense the battery is fuly charged. Most of these chargers are capable of taking 110/240V in so all you have to worry about is a power adapter to fit the wall socket that your country uses.

A ceramic bipin holder from FM would make that light very nice :), yup no soldering etc with this method. I read that FM will be receiving stock of these little gems soon.

You can use alkaline batteries...it won't be bright and it won't run very long though... reason being alkaline batteries don't tolerate high amp draw very well. The WA1185 lamp will draw about 3.15amps i believe...way too much for alkalines to handle.
 

Delvance

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bimemrboy318,

I wouldn't try it imho. Given that most CR123s are rated around 1300mAh or so and the 1185 will draw at least 3.2A...will mean you're discharging those poor cells at over 2.4C. Alot of the exploding cells reported on CPF were in applications of 1C or so. I'm pretty sure the SF M6 draws a fair bit less current than what a 1185 would on CR123s and we still see some M6's running into thermal shutdown during an extended running.
 

fivemega

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Primary CR123 can't handle 3 Amps.
It is possible to use 2parallel, 4 series primary123s to power up WA1185 for less than an hour but still not bright as 9xNiMH AAs
 

bimemrboy318

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fivemega said:
Primary CR123 can't handle 3 Amps.
It is possible to use 2parallel, 4 series primary123s to power up WA1185 for less than an hour but still not bright as 9xNiMH AAs

Looks like my main roadblock is that I need to get away from primaries and invest in a couple sets of AA NiMHs.
 

dimbulb

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Agreed with PowerNoodle about Mag Charger.
As a newbie, I got the Mag Charger based on some good advices on this forum. This light kicks butt from here to Timbuktu (compared to my pathetic old Mag 3D).

Now you guys got me interested in Mag85 mod!
This is a bad site - a secret plot to part "fools" from their hard-earned money.
Wait till my wife see this month's credit card balance.
 

andrewwynn

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Wow what a bunch of nice info about mag85 in one place.

A few things not covered quite well enough:

1) the reason for not instaflashing much with any 'mag85' is almost always weak cells or lots of resistance in the circuit... or having quite a lot of patience after charging.. the trade off is lots longer bulb life for lot's less lumen.. they typical 'mag85' if using a bi-pin adapter can not be expected to have more than about 750 lumen of output... and i've gotten measurements of lower than 550.

2) The only solution i've come up with for primary-powered 1185 is 4S3P CR123.. that gets the draw down to just over an amp and should get you about an hour runtime (almost typo'd 'funtime'.. also applicable).. I use 9xAA Lithium for the 1331 and that will be about 70+min runtime it's fantastic. With a no-load voltage of 12V.. not 100% sure what the odds of instaflashing are, but the 1185 lamp can actually be pushed up to 11.5V without blowing, but i wouldn't do it w/o a regulator. Under load, 4S3P of CR123 (primary) should pull down to lamp voltage around 10V average, so actually should work ok direct-drive... i still recommend a regulator to eliminate power surge at startup (power surge on 1185 is probably about 100W at startup).

3) I will come out an officially say it.. if you use anything but high-drain cells.. don't expect more than 70-80% of the light output of using the proper cells... they don't have to be CBP1650s.. (which really are more like 1400mAH).. but use some AAs that the 'RC crowd' approve of for flying airplanes and RC car/boat etc...

4) extremely high-output batteries like a 3S3P of 17500 or 9S of GP2000 is a guarantee to insta-flash if you have a good bat. pack and low-resistance switch circuitry. A typical maglite will have 160-180 miliohms of resistance.. that means a loss of about 133 lumen for using a stock switch.. (with the advantage of a much longer bulb life of course). These packs work great if regulated.. i use 11.1V and get about 17% more light out of my http://M85.rouse.com compared to a typical mag85.

5) For bat. packs that don't quite reach the Pos spring inside the light.. modify the spring, not the bat. pack.. i solder copper discs onto the spring for use with flat-top batteries such as the D LiON. You can probably just use a solder-bump that is sanded down flat.. use a bit of wire to help fill the hole.. and i recommend silver-solder .. it's a lot harder and won't wear down.

6) I don't recommend at all use of the 3>D plastic adapters. I have a few here and have yet to test the resistance facts about them... it is not going to come out well.. I've measured on the order of a volt or more of drop at times with the likes of the modamag adapter before the springs are removed ... springs are the death of hotwire output.. the maglite tailcap spring alone costs over 30 lumen with a mag85. (shorting out the spring with a piece of 18ga or thicker wire fixes it basically 100%).. i measured a 96% drop in resistance by putting 16ga wire between the ends of the maglite tailcap spring.. (went from 35 miliohms to 1.3!).

7) The 1185 lamp is just a stunner... the efficiency at near 11V is almost off the charts, and it's the 'gold standard' of white light... it's a bit tricky to find a battery solution that can hold the voltage up there, even the cbp1650 doesn't hold full output very long... see #8

8) better bat. packs are just around the corner.. i recently figured out how to get a 3AH pack into a 3D stock light (with a bit of DIY).. this will double the runtime and hold output constant for most of the run. In addition.. the packs using LION cells will be able to have shelf-life!

9) A magcharger doesn't qualify as 'hotwire' unless modded with the 1160 lamp or better.. even with the 1160 lamp the output is just about 1/3 that of a properly made mag85.. so yes..... the mag85 puts out a lot more light than some might think, but the magcharger 1160 is a very useful amount of light.. a bit of frosting on the bulb and it's a very nice beam.. The stock lamp is i think about 8W.. it's not a bad bulb, just not very powerful, and the efficiency is not great because it's not being pushed very hard.

So there are my 9¢.

-awr
 

bimemrboy318

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I've just stumbled upon the Streamlight TL-3. It seems that it could play host to a 1185 bi-pin bulb without any mods using it's 4xCR123s. What's the "4S3P" you mention andrew?

Also, what's the max amp discharge of a CR123? And what nominal voltage can be expected from this cell during use ~2.3V? I want to get into these mods but just can't take the leap into buying a bunch of rechargeable batts.

One more thing, what's the amp draw from a stock 5-cell White Star bulb? Just curious how many watts my 3xCR123 in a Mag2C setup is producing.
 

ciam

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andrewwynn said:
8) better bat. packs are just around the corner.. i recently figured out how to get a 3AH pack into a 3D stock light (with a bit of DIY).. this will double the runtime and hold output constant for most of the run. In addition.. the packs using LION cells will be able to have shelf-life!

-awr

I'm *extremely* interested in knowing what that's.... eargerly waiting and looking forward to the day when (or if) you're ready to share it here.
 
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