What to expect from SF "Mini-Beast," other HIDs?..

mega_lumens

Enlightened
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Since the talk is that SF is considering R&D shift to HID lights, what can we expect with current HID technology? Does anyone know what the Mini-Beast is capable of? I wish SF focuses on long run times not just lumens, and some rechargeable options not like 12 123s..
 
SF will definitely utilize their SF123. Rechargeable will be least on their design unless they opt for their own rechargeable battery.
 
Since the talk is that SF is considering R&D shift to HID lights, what can we expect with current HID technology? Does anyone know what the Mini-Beast is capable of? I wish SF focuses on long run times not just lumens, and some rechargeable options not like 12 123s..
Erm... SureFire have been resourcing R&D on HID technology for quite a few years. Since they stopped resourcing incandescent R&D they have been concentrating on LED and HID.

SureFire's LED products are designed for long runtime rather than highest possible output. Just look at the E1L (KX1), E2L (KX2) and L1 not to mention the L2, U2 and K2 - all with long runtimes or long runtime output modes.

The BeastII comes with both a LiIon body and a body for 20-SF123A batteries.

The "Mini-Beast" proto-type was LiIon powered. It featured a three-stage switch giving "low", "high" and "insane" output modes. I forget the lumen values but I seem to recall PK saying the 'insane' mode was higher output than the BeastII... I'm sure the threads covering PK's CPF Party at SHOT Show 2007 have better details.

I'm moving this thread to the HID forum...

Al
 
It seems a Mini-Beast is still a few years out.

"If" one were introduced at SHOT 2008, we would'nt see production units start
shipping until spring/summer of 2009 at earliest.

The Beast II was in the 2006 SF catalog but SF didn't start filling dealer orders
(for civilian units) until about a month ago. I had one on order with Steven at
TacticalSupply.com since October/November of 2006. Unfortunately he began
closing shop before SF started shipping them.

A Mini-Beast sounds VERY attractive, but next week I'll be ordering my Beast II.
Life is short and can't be spent waiting for the "next" best thing.

When SF bring a "Mini-Beast" to market, I'll be front in line with $$$ in hand!

One thing is for absolute certain, Surefire is not resting on past accomplishments.
Every year we'll continue to enjoy new and exciting products from Surefire.
 
Erm... SureFire have been resourcing R&D on HID technology for quite a few years. Since they stopped resourcing incandescent R&D they have been concentrating on LED and HID.

SureFire's LED products are designed for long runtime rather than highest possible output. Just look at the E1L (KX1), E2L (KX2) and L1 not to mention the L2, U2 and K2 - all with long runtimes or long runtime output modes.

The BeastII comes with both a LiIon body and a body for 20-SF123A batteries.

The "Mini-Beast" proto-type was LiIon powered. It featured a three-stage switch giving "low", "high" and "insane" output modes. I forget the lumen values but I seem to recall PK saying the 'insane' mode was higher output than the BeastII... I'm sure the threads covering PK's CPF Party at SHOT Show 2007 have better details.

I'm moving this thread to the HID forum...

Al

I *theenk* pk said the "insane" level was 50W, and good for ~8 minutes. (Same SHOT Party.) The thing wasn't much bigger than an M6 as I recall!

Larry
 
PK also showed it off at Shot Show 2006 so it has been almost three years now. The problem is that it's probably going to cost as much (if not more) than the Beast II. I'd like to see a more "affordable" version. If people can build HID Maglites for a few hundred then I think $1000 is within their capabilities. Of course at the rate things are going we could see an M6L powered by multiple LEDs with 500+ lumens.

Yeah, it's a good rule of thumb to add 6 to 12 months to whatever Surefire tells you.
 
I think the thing to remember is that, as far as I know, they haven't told us much at all. I think it may be unwise to make assumptions and conclusions in an information vacuum.

Surefire has come under a lot of fire here for being "slow" to adapt to the Cree/Seoul revolution, but in actuality they were quite fast. How long have Crees been out? Not that long. Pushing a year or two at most...? In everything except the computer industry, that's a blink of eye... And even then, it might've already bitten them in the butt with the release of high-output Rebel emitters with almost equal output, smaller footprint, lower price and better tint than the Crees and Seouls. I think we can rest assured that yes, we may wait a little while for new Surefire releases, but consider this: how many dud lights have they released? With the notable exception (which has now been corrected, or so I remember hearing) of the clickies, have you ever heard of any common Surefire problems? Me neither. The lights all work, and tend to work BETTER than advertised. They're durable. They're guaranteed. And they're tested as well as an airliner is before it's put into service. One thing I'm looking forward to from a Surefire HID is a 4200K or 5000K bulb instead of the 6000K in my Boxer24. If I can't get a replacement bulb for my Boxer to bring the color-temp down, I'll sell it and buy a Surefire HID to replace it, even if it's more expensive - and I would think that with their dedication to military/law enforcement that Surefire would take color rendition and spectral distribution into account before releasing a light for sale. I'd like to see a li-ion battery solution too, and dislike the dinosaur system which they currently offer. Don't you think they know it's out of date? Surely they can make better - there must be a reason why. Have faith, it's not like they're a government agency with no reason to excel, they're a private enterprise with a large stake in the portable lighting market - but that stake will be easily lost if they rest on their laurels.

I know that there's some bad blood between SF and the CPF community that came before my time, but I think we should put that aside and 1: Be Patient, 2: Understand their business model and priorities are different from other manufacturers that cater to us, and 3: Be Supportive! If we have a constructive/supportive mentality instead of the group-mind of a 6-year-old with the "gimmees" we might get more communication from SF - and at least cool some burns which are still felt on both sides, either voiced or unvoiced.
 
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I think the thing to remember is that, as far as I know, they haven't told us much at all.

Totally agree. Remember though that 1/2 the fun in this hobby is the speculating,
experimenting, the meeting new friends, and wishing.

I attended PK's SHOT 2007 party and it was an absolute honor and blast for
the enthusiast. PK has a heart bigger than my house!:twothumbs

So next week I'll order my Beast II and then continue to speculate and dream
of the Mini-Beast. :naughty:
 
The MiniBeast is one dream of a light. Unfortunately I don't think I will be able to afford it though :green:
bernie
 
oh Bernie...always worrying.... before the product even makes it to the market.:candle:
you got your hands on the lunasol already, what do you think the rest of us feels ;):grin2:

I'm sure IF IT DOES come out there will be some sort of a passaround:rolleyes:

before the boxer HIDs came out I never took pocket sized HIDs seriously, I've always thought of them as lights for output enthusiasts over runtime and have always thought the AE powerlights to be more of a practical battery/Lamp combination, but after comparing reviews, I must say this in incredible

Hopefully if the miniHID does come out, it would be with our expectations
 
I *theenk* pk said the "insane" level was 50W, and good for ~8 minutes. (Same SHOT Party.) The thing wasn't much bigger than an M6 as I recall!

Larry

50W !! That's seriously amazing out of a light that size. I wonder what batteries it used? I'm really interested to see where HID goes over the next couple of years. No doubt Surefire will bring much innovation to the table.
 
I *theenk* pk said the "insane" level was 50W, and good for ~8 minutes. (Same SHOT Party.) The thing wasn't much bigger than an M6 as I recall!

Larry

8 minutes....:thinking:
I hope theres a power cord that comes with it to plug into an external battery pack if necessary
 
Well ... what is to expect of a light of that size pushing 50W into a HID? There are limits of current technology that can't be beaten.

However ... I don't think the MiniBeast was made with runtime in mind. And, unfortunately, neither with primary CR123 I guess :D

bernie
 
8 minutes....:thinking:
I hope theres a power cord that comes with it to plug into an external battery pack if necessary
How about if the Surefire MEPS (Millennium External Power Source) powers AND charges the M-Beast simutaneously.

OK pinch me...I'm dreaming again! :ohgeez:
 
If the Li-Ion battery pack will only power it for 8 mins on the "insane" setting, then that setting is indeed quite appropriately named - it would imply a discharge rate of 7.5C.
 
The "Mini-Beast" proto-type was LiIon powered.
Li-Ion or Li-Po? I think the Beast II's rechargeable handle is Li-Po.

The biggest problem with using CR123 primaries is that you just can't get that many watts out of them to start the lamp. The Boxer 10w/123 may only use 3x123, but it's 10w max and has a slow and "ugly" HID startup. I assume that the fast and clean starts take a lot more power.

Personally I'd love to see them do something in the Boxer 24w form-factor, only rated for immersion in water, a 6 foot (6 ft = 1.83 m) drop on concrete while operating, etc. I'd definitely pay 3-4 times a Boxer price, but I'm not sure it can be done at that price. And I think it's important to retain 123 primary capability, even if that means slower and uglier starts in those cases.

(but only if it doesn't have the Beast II's ridiculous charger setup - that's got to be far and away the largest and heaviest charger in the world for a hand-held flashlight)
 
Seery...are your really going to order the BeastII??...if you do so..can you post some pics plz(when u get the light)?^^ always been drolling over that light..LoLs..
 
Well ... what is to expect of a light of that size pushing 50W into a HID? There are limits of current technology that can't be beaten.

However ... I don't think the MiniBeast was made with runtime in mind. And, unfortunately, neither with primary CR123 I guess :D

bernie

eww, if the minibeast runs on cr123as I'll be waiting until they come out with a rechargeable [If I can buy it without selling kidneys I will]
I'll go bankrupt feeding it if it was cr123A...8 minutes, who are you kiddin :grin2:
 
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