What's this? Another KL1 mod

Chop

Flashlight Enthusiast
Joined
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What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Hey guys,

I tried to mod a 4th generation KL1 tonight and I made a few observations.

First, the 4th gen KL1 doesn't like to be undressed. It's a really tough first date.

Second, inductors get really hot when they fry. Yes, I fried the inductor trying to overdrive this thing. I think I went too low on the inductor sense resistance. At least that's what I think it was that I was cutting resistance to a third on.

Third, Lux III's don't like having 6v driven through them direct drive.

Fourth, it's really good to have spare parts laying around.

So, during the course of this mod, I fried an inductor, a cap (I think), and a luxeon.

Anyway, it's late and I'm just going to post a few pics right now.

We can discuss it more later on.

picture.JPG


picture.JPG


picture.JPG


As you can see, the 4th gen KL1 is now sporting a McR20 reflector in full profile. No turning necessary.

It is now running at about 700mA on 2X123 with a TWOJ Lux III. I still have a few kinks to work out of the overdriving, but it's getting there.

Any comments?
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

AWESOME WORK! Many people who hate that new optic have something to cheer about (especially me)! Here's a couple of questions.

1. What kind of board are you regulating the current with?
2. Will it run on 1xR123 or 2xR123?
3. Is this the best reflector/optic for this setup providing max throw with some sidespill?
4. Whats the lux reading at 1m?
5. Is there a lens in that picture?
6. Is the light easy to open and mod now that it has already been opened?
7. What type of runtime does it have now?
8. What new technique did you use to open it intead of the strap wrench method?
9. Was the original LED a star or an emmiter?

OK, maybe it was more than a few questions.

Jeff
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Bravechop /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif

Klaus
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

OK, here goes...

1. It's the stock board.
2. It will run on anything that it would run on before the mod.
3. Do you know of something better than a McR20?
4. Don't have a lux meter and don't want one. I know when a light is bright. Splitting hairs is counter productive.
5. Yes, the stock lens is in place.
6. The internals are fit very tightly. Some of the repairs were necessary after trying to put it back together.
7. Roughly a third less that it had before.
8. The original lux was an emitter that was epoxied in place.

The KL1 is actually very well thought out and built. The sink provides for the luxeon to be self centering.

The insides of this one are a little beat up. Getting it open wasn't any fun at all. I initially tried using a safety collet that I made. This one was so tight and glued together than the head actually turned inside the collet.

I finally managed to get it open by cooking it for an hour at 250 degrees in a toaster oven. It was still hard to turn, but it came loose.

I used a rather unorthodox method of getting into it. After I removed the bottom section, I de-soldered the leads from the converter and removed the converter. This have me a clear shot at the sink. I used needle nose pliers to to get the top half clear of the sink. I'm going to have to make a tool to do this in the future.

I've also found that overdriving the current to 700mA made no practical difference in brightness and I don't think that the increase justifies the sacrifice of runtime. I think I'm going to put it back to 500mA.
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Groovy mods Tony, As far as the construction goes and how things are out together for the factory. Do you think the KL1 is worth the cash as it comes in the package? Ive got one and thing it's great. i may never use my MN01 on my E1e again, lol.

Shane
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

[ QUOTE ]
Chop said:
I've also found that overdriving the current to 700mA made no practical difference in brightness and I don't think that the increase justifies the sacrifice of runtime. I think I'm going to put it back to 500mA.

[/ QUOTE ]

What was the stock current?
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Chop.. just one question.

How much $$$$$$$$? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

I'll bet you do. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Hey guys,

I've done a bit more messing with this KL1. The driver in it is remarkably similar to the one used in the older KL1, but the newer one is larger in diameter.

Well, first things first. As I said, I heated this thing up to about 250 degrees to get things to loosen up. I still had to wrestle with it to get it open, but I did.

What came loose easily was the lower portion of the light which exposed the anode contact housing and circuit board.
picture.JPG


These are a tight fit in there. I tried several times to remove the heat sink from the upper portion of the head with the circuit board still attached, but I became afraid of damaging the converter.

Here's what it looked like...
picture.JPG


There was just enough room in there for me to desolder the leads from the converter, so I did that to give me a better shot at the heat sink.

Here's what I saw after removing the converter...
picture.JPG


As you can see, this sink suffered a few minor battle wounds. I tried the collet method, as mentioned above, but it seems that each of the newer KL1s, like the older ones, has its own personality and difficulty of disassembly. When I tried the collet method on this one, the threads actually turned in the collet. What I wound up doing with this one is the old fashions needle nosed pliers improvisation. It finally came out. Once I got it apart, I found the culprit.

There's a rather TIGHT fitting o-ring used in the upper section of the sink that screws into the upper portion of the head. I hope you can see it.
picture.JPG


This o-ring makes re-assembly rather difficult as well.

Here's the top of the sink after disassembly.
picture.JPG


And the lens, optic, and its retaining ring.
picture.JPG


Now for the converter. The older KL1 converter is on the left. Note the similarities. Of course the one on the left is missing a couple of parts, like the inductor that was used to revive the newer unit.
picture.JPG


Now, the larger resistor on the newer KL1's board is a .68 ohm. I'm assuming that this is the current sense resistor. The smaller resistor (1206 size) is labeled 75M. I'm assuming that this is the inductor sense resistor. Does anyone know what 75M means? I hit it with my DMM and it read 0 ohms, but my DMM won't measure less than .1. Now I'm saying 0 ohms, but it actually read .2, which is what it reads when just touching the probes together.

When I overdrove the KL1, I used a .47 ohm resistor in parallel with the .68 ohm resistor. On a 2X123 battery configuration, I got around 700mA, but it wasn't steady. It kept declining in current level settling down around 600mA. I suspect that this has something to do with the inductor sense resistor, but I'm an electronics idiot so I don't know.

When I initially modded the KL1, I also ran a .1 ohm resistor in parallel with what I believed to be the inductor sense resistor, but this resulted in the inductor cooking itself. I don't know if it was due to too much current going through the inductor or what. It may very well have been due to a short occurring when I put it back together. This thing isn't as idiot proof as the older KL1s. Since I didn't have anymore replacment parts, I didn't want to risk it with Pitbull's light.

Another observation that I made was that I couldn't get more than 500mA out of the circuit when running on a single 123.

All I can say right now is that I'm going to have to get a couple of my own KL1s for experimentation purposes.

In any case, after all was said and done, I do have to say that the only really worthwhile thing that this KL1 NEEDED was a reflector. Other than that, this is a nice piece of equipment.

I'm going to need to make a tool for the heatsink out of steel or something. It's goint to need to be strong.

Does anyone know how hot I can go with heating this thing before I melt the dome on the luxeon and the optic. I wanted to go to 350 degrees, but wasn't sure. I know that 350 will soften red loctite. I used to have to do that to remove compensators from 1911 barrels back in my shooting days, but I don't want to cook anything on the light. At 350 I'd be getting dangerously close the melting solder joints too.

If anyone has any suggestions, let's have it. I want to get rolling on doing more of these. At this point, I do want to get rolling on more of these, but I just don't know that it would be worth it to spend $60 just to add a reflector to the KL1. It really doesn't need anything else and when you get to that price point, you could have just gotten an Aleph II head and pretty much had it built to order.
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

How will that optic from the 4th gen KL1 perform if placed on a Lux-V?
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Nail polish removal works very well to open
my L1 without any heat ...

Cheers
Ralf
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Ralf,

That was the second thing that I tried. The acetone can't get past the o-ring.
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

[ QUOTE ]
Chop said:
but I'm an electronics idiot so I don't know.

[/ QUOTE ]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif Tony calls himself an Electronics idiot after messing with converters, emitters, wires, resistors, and writing over a couple of paragraphs of information on what and how he did it! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crackup.gif

Anyways, this is quite an interesting mod. I used to think that when the KL1 was made, it was pretty much glued, welded, soldered, and melted together to make it impossible for anyone to get inside it. (SF sure doesnt like people altering their products. Just look at their other LED products, lamp assemblies, and such...) That optic look interesting too. Sort of resembles a miniature 30 mm optic with some kind of bump on top...
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Hey Mags,

How are ya?

Believe me, I am an electronics idiot. There are some guys here that eat, drink, and dream the stuff. I'm just kind of like a mechanic. I can replace parts and stuff, but only the most basic stuff.

I don't know that the Surefire heads are built with keeping modders out in mind. I think that they are just seeking to seal the parts as well as possible.

The latest generation KL1 is very well built, and after seeing the inside of one, I have a new found respect for them.
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

290 degrees is as high as you want to heat a Luxeon before damage begins to occur to the LED - probably best to not exceed 280 to be on the safe side - toaste oven's aren't the most accurate things (nor are dial ovens in general).

Looks like a neat mod Chop. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

OK, so if I keep it to 275, I should be alright. I'm going to have to give it a try.

BTW, does this mean that the luxeon will melt before the optic?
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Chop I too dig the new KL-1. Since I often hear the big boy's speak of reflector's being superior to a optic, could you give me some examples of why, and does throw increase
with a reflector, particularly over this TIROS type thing or just general beam quality.
I guess in short, the +'s and -'s of each. VDG
 
Re: What\'s this? Another KL1 mod

Reflectors offer a more conventional beam pattern, consisting of a hot spot surrounded by sidespill.

Although you do loose some throw by going with a 20mm reflector, you will gain a more useful general purpose light.

As far as I'm concerned, if you are willing to sacrifice general useability for the sake of throw, as you do with optics that throw beams like the TIROS, you might be better off with a laser. Those REALLY throw.

Personally, since reflectors hit the scene with the PM6 mods and the L4s, I haven't had much use for optics, but if I did HAVE to choose and optic, my vote would go to the NX05 for general useability.
 
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