What's with all the "sell at this price only" from manufacturers?

[jzmtl]

So surefire started it, fenix seems to be doing it, and now nitecore is doing the same thing. Okay maybe surefire has the brand name and image to back it up, but nitecore? Come on, it's not like there isn't any other manufacturer making more or less the same damn thing with the same hi-lo switch mechanism.

I dunno, I just find this trend annoying, not just in flashlights, but cars as well.

 

[kramer5150]

Fixed pricing... I think is the general idea. It prevents retailers from gouging each other with price wars. It avoids/alleviates the situation where the biggest, most financially stable retailer squashes the smaller retailers by buying in bulk at lower piece part rates and offering larger discounts.

It also prevents consumers from buying factory direct at significant discount and abandoning the manufacturer retail partners.

 

[mdocod]

If I were a business owner selling SureFires. I would personally be HAPPY that the manufacture is forcing everyone to sell at the same price. Wouldn't have to worry about being undersold by another online warehouse.

 

[LED_Thrift]

If the manufacturers don't want the 'big' retailers to undercut the smaller sellers, they could just refuse to sell to them at a discount from their normal wholesale. Price fixing should be illegal in all forms.

 

[65535]

This is probably why a lot of CPF related businesses are willing to give high discounts to CPFers, Everyone knows these lights aren't costing distributors near $70.

 

[Stillphoto]

Oakley has been doing it forever. When I worked at the Headquarters, people would come into the shop expecting lower prices. They'd say "Well I can get these at xyz store for the same price!" and we'd say exactly, what sense does it make to compete with the retailers that made us who we are?

That, and the fact that its nice to go into a store knowing exactly what you'll be paying for a product (price fixing does work in both directions).

 

[Kiessling]

This is very complicated and has been discussed in depth by people knowing that stuff a few years ago. Basically it has something to do with keeping a good, reliable and performant distribution chain and being able to reach the market, being able to recover R+D costs and stabilize the "worth" of a product to be able to stay in business at all.
Unfortunately I cannot really explain, it, but I understood (years ago ) that the internet-age made this necessary in order to protect healthy businesses and progress.
I was rather angry, too, but now I am able to accept it.

bernie

 

[alfablue]

In the UK and EU price fixing such as this is against competition laws, some big names (such as Volvo - see http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/the_company_file/389962.stm ) have fallen foul of these laws by requiring dealers to restrict discounts.

Although it is illegal, I received an email from Glowgadgets (a fantastic Fenix dealer based in Bristol, UK) staing that Fenix had asked that they stop all discounts above 10% (they had been giving 25% discounts to emergency services buyers). It is not the dealer's fault, and although I am incensed by this I have not coplained to the Office of Fair Trading as I don't want to bring any trouble to this great dealer.

Nevertheless, Fenix and all other manufacturers should observe the relevant legislation applicable to the countries they sell in.

 

[Ironhog81]

It is also against the law in Louisiana.
Used to be called "fair trade"
Now the only thing that can be done is require that no lower price be advertised. Nothing to prevent a dealer from selling at any price.
In actual practice dealers know if they don't go along they may not get products. Various problems you know, credit, shipping out of stock.
RIGHT

 

[alfablue]

It is also against the law in Louisiana.
Used to be called "fair trade"
Now the only thing that can be done is require that no lower price be advertised. Nothing to prevent a dealer from selling at any price.
In actual practice dealers know if they don't go along they may not get products. Various problems you know, credit, shipping out of stock.
RIGHT

Yes, the same tricks as used by major brands in the UK; one shop keeper told me Oakley don't allow discounts and our supplies will dry up if we do discount. The Office of Fair Trading will take such underhand and "off the record" ploys as evidence of price fixing, so in theory it is actionable even without any explicit written policy.

 

[Kiessling]

IIRC that is what SF does ... no advertising below retail. But I could be wrong.

 

[powernoodle]

Price fixing should be illegal in all forms.

This flavor of price fixing still falls within the broader theory of free market capitalism, as we are availed of the ability not to buy a SF light or any other light that is sold at a fixed price. We can still buy other lights sold by sellers who can fix whatever price they want.

This is juxtaposed to the flavor of price fixing where you have no choice but to buy the item at the fixed price. For example, every gas station in town cannot agree to sell at a fixed price, nor can every supermarket agree to sell a gallon of milk at a certain price. This is because if one is to buy gas or milk, there is no alternative, and thats why its illegal.

I do understand why one doesn't like nitecore or SF (or Chris Reeves, when it comes to high end knives) fixing prices. But we are free to say no thanks to their pricing scheme. JMO.

 

[bhds]

What am I missing? If a manufacturer sells 1,000 units of a product to 2 separate retailers, why would they care what the retailers sell the product for? Hasn't the manufacturer already made their profit?
I truly don't understand

 

[jzmtl]

For example, every gas station in town cannot agree to sell at a fixed price, nor can every supermarket agree to sell a gallon of milk at a certain price.

You mean that's not already the case?

Around here the GOUVERMENT set the minimal price of milk, ha, try to beat that!

Can't forget the gouverment operated alcohol board that has monopoly over sale, and openly admits to price fixing...

 

[powernoodle]

why would they care what the retailers sell the product for?

One retailer could drive the other 9 retailers out of business by lowballing the retail price. Then you are left with one retailer, which limits market saturation and distribution and all of that good stuff. That hurts the manufacturer.

 

[bhds]

One retailer could drive the other 9 retailers out of business by lowballing the retail price. Then you are left with one retailer, which limits market saturation and distribution and all of that good stuff. That hurts the manufacturer.

I kinda sorta understand:thinking:
Still though, I can't see how lower prices will result in less product being sold overall. Whether its through one large retailer such as W--mart, A--zon or a bunch of smaller retailers.

 

[PhantomPhoton]

Well I guess I'll start the new year off with a

And this is why I don't buy Surefire.
Other companies that do this as well won't get my business. And therefore when I'm asked to recommend products, which I seem to be asked more and more recently from friends to whole businesses, I tell them to avoid certain companies.

I don't play BS price fixing games. Business is business, and if you can't keep your customers you're not fit for business. Welcome to the other side of Capitalism. Capitalism doesn't work if it only benefits the businesses. It has to benefit the consumer as well. If we're going to make everything the same then we may as while just bring in the rest of communism's flaws with it.

Some of us are smart enough to see through the fecal matter. To put the whole picture together. To be able to pick out greed from good business practices.

If someone could find that old discussion, I'd love to read it.

 

[Rzr800]

"..Okay maybe surefire has the brand name and image to back it up, but nitecore? Come on, it's not like there isn't any other manufacturer making more or less the same damn thing with the same hi-lo switch mechanism...I dunno, I just find this trend annoying..."

If there are other manufacturers out there making Defenders at the same quality level or better...who really cares what Nitecore sets their price at? I would also argue that a company's brand name or image has absolutely nothing to do with the price set in the above 'competitive' market situation.

 

[Gio]

I thought MAP is Minimum Advertised Price.
I'm in the motorcycle accessories business and we had to adhere to MAP policy all the time.
But what we actually sell it for in our store or online is up to us.
You just can't advertise the lower prices.

That's why you see all those "add to cart" to see lower price on places like amazon and such.

Isn't this subject the same thing with all these high end flashlight dealers?

 

[jzmtl]

I thought MAP is Minimum Advertised Price.
I'm in the motorcycle accessories business and we had to adhere to MAP policy all the time.
But what we actually sell it for in our store or online is up to us.
You just can't advertise the lower prices.

That's why you see all those "add to cart" to see lower price on places like amazon and such.

Isn't this subject the same thing with all these high end flashlight dealers?

In case of nitecore (still think it's a stupid name) they flat out say: all NiteCore products should be sold at MAP. No underselling of their products will be tolerated. If that's not price fixing, I don't know what is.