When will there be an LED brighter than the Cree Q5?

[ultimaonliner]

If the Cree Q5 is currently the brightest white LED for flashlights, when should we expect another generation of brighter, more efficient LEDs?

How much brighter or more efficient have each new generation of LEDs been in the past?

 

[divine]

R2's are out and have been out for maybe a month...

I think it's only marginally better, cause R2 is basically the 100 lumen per watt milestone, while Q5 was about 90 lumen per watt.

I guess we'll see.

 

[precisionworks]

LEDs are an evolving technology, no where near maturity. Different substrates are continually being developed, better deposition methods are evolving. Emitter development is somewhat akin to personal computer development ... they get more powerful, smaller, faster, less expensive -- as do LEDs. Companies are starting to market LED streetlights & other high power applications, which will surely trickle down to single cell tac lights.

when should we expect another generation of brighter, more efficient LEDs?

When they become profitable.

 

[ultimaonliner]

R2's? So my 1 week old P1D-CE Q5 is already outdated :green:

I have a reasonable feel for how the PC industry cranks out faster CPUs, but what's the time interval like for LED flashlights to double their lux or lumens?

Or, hypothetically, how soon would one reasonably guess Fenix to make a CR123Ax1 light that will produce 360 lumens (since the current one produces 180 lumens)?

 

[KeyGrip]

Since the Cree and SSC emitters came out, the increases have been more incremental, and in the order of newer bin codes. Perhaps in the next two years we can expect another 100% increase in efficiency similar to the luxeon-cree jump.

 

[scottaw]

I understand the want for the latest and greatest, but when the Cree/Seoul hit a few months ago, i think that was the major step that gave us EDC's with more brightness than most people need day to day and a battery life that can go months. For day to day use, my 120P and ML-1 are plenty. Now for ridiculously bright....give me the next big thing!

 

[Robban]

I understand the want for the latest and greatest, but when the Cree/Seoul hit a few months ago, i think that was the major step that gave us EDC's with more brightness than most people need day to day and a battery life that can go months. For day to day use, my 120P and ML-1 are plenty. Now for ridiculously bright....give me the next big thing!

Indeed. I think a lot of people forget just how recent the CREE explosion is. The board was absolutely buzzzing at the time of release, people were going nuts for it. Some people didn't even believe the claims and said it was all hype. Fast forward a few months and people are already screaming for more. It's funny.

 

[Crenshaw]

R2's? So my 1 week old P1D-CE Q5 is already outdated :green:

I have a reasonable feel for how the PC industry cranks out faster CPUs, but what's the time interval like for LED flashlights to double their lux or lumens?

Or, hypothetically, how soon would one reasonably guess Fenix to make a CR123Ax1 light that will produce 360 lumens (since the current one produces 180 lumens)?

Its not out of date, simply because the increase in actual light amount is very small...negligable, you will hardly be able to tell it, because the eye doesnt see tiny changes, a light would have to be 4 times as bright to be seen as twice as bright, kinda thing. Like the difference between a P1DQ5 and T1 is barely noticable.

You would go crazy trying to keep up with each bin that comes out, better to wait for about a letter worth of change, like q5 to r4, might be worth it. P4 to R2 is very very worth it.

i would have to say 300+ lumens, maybe, next year?

Crenshaw

 

[txgp17]

Eventually more light will just that, more. There is a point at which it will hurt your eyes to turn the light on at close range.

Perhaps then the manufacturer's will drive them at lower amps, causing our batteries to last longer.

But were a few years away from that I guess.

 

[L.E.D.]

The R2 isn't even that much brighter than the Q5, in fact someone said it was the same output as the Q5 but with a nasty tint. I would either stick with silver-core R2's or good ol Q5's. I think the next big step will be in non-phosphor LED's, no more phosphor covering to slightly reduce output, and much fuller color rendering.

 

[crocodilo]

Eventually more light will just that, more. There is a point at which it will hurt your eyes to turn the light on at close range.

Perhaps then the manufacturer's will drive them at lower amps, causing our batteries to last longer.

But were a few years away from that I guess.

That's exactly what I think. I had a P4 drop-in in my 6P, and was looking for something with longer runtime. Got a Q5 drop-in, quite a jump in brightness (enough to make it unconfortable to use indoors), and a slightly shorter runtime... I too wish the Q5's higher efficiency would be used for lower currents, same brightness, longer runtime.

But now... I've found a "light device" that does use the Q5 and has ridiculously long runtime: the Zebralight! A headlamp, go figure! Flashlight manufacturers, shame on you!

 

[MikeSalt]

I wouldn't worry too much. Cree's biggest competition was Lumileds with their Rebels. However, the good Rebels were a fluke few batches, and they have been unable to keep up with demand, lessening the competition. Also, Cree supplies the EZ1000 dies to their other major player, SSC. If SSC became a threat, Cree could just pull the plug and stop them dead in their tracks.

So, with no serious competition, Cree has no real urgency to roll out the R-bins too quickly.

It is very much like the grinding halt that has hit the GPU market in computers. NVidia have dominated, and ATi have failed to make anything to threaten. As a result, nVidia has been milking the GeForce 8 for well over a year now, because they can.

 

[L.E.D.]

Some Osram LED's are actually quite a bit brighter than a Q5, although not as efficient..

 

[Nake]

Perhaps then the manufacturer's will drive them at lower amps, causing our batteries to last longer.

Aren't there multi-mode lights that do that? Brightness for those that want it and longer runtimes for the stingy folks.

 

[max52]

I think on the the Dereelight site they are offering "Pay extra $5 upgrade Q5 to WH R2(Limited)" on the DBS V2 Black HAIII.

 

[Ryanrpm]

We've all seen the little article from Cree: "Cree achieves 1000 lumen's from a single LED!".


Why isn't that LED in a flashlight yet?

 

[kgull85]

We've all seen the little article from Cree: "Cree achieves 1000 lumen's from a single LED!".


Why isn't that LED in a flashlight yet?

From that article.

"Historically, Cree's R&D demonstrations generally have been commercialized within 12 to 24 months."

 

[defloyd77]

Isn't the R2 basically a warmer tint and lower vf than the Q5, being more efficient but same brightness?