Why aren't led's usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

[JollyRoger]

Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

I've been wondering this for a while...
Notice how some cameras use a smaller bulb for the red-eye reduction? Think how much more effective and battery-saving it would be if you used a single white luxeon...or even just two or three white nichias...

 

[papasan]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

the smaller bulb is for focus assist in dark environments...to illuminate the subject enough to get a good focus...red eye reduction is the series flashing, but i'm not sure how this stops the reflection off of the back of the eye...

 

[Alexis]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

It reduces the red reflex by making your pupil smaller, so the angle at which you would get the red reflex is reduced. So it is red eye reduction, not red eye elimination.

I think the Canon digicams use an led for this.

 

[Graham]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

My understanding of the red-eye effect, is that the the first flash initially goes straight though to the retina of the subjects eye before the iris can contract, this reflection of the retina showing as red in the middle of the eye. This happens because the iris in our eye only contracts when the flash of light hits it, but it is too late as the picture is already being taken.
The red-eye reduction function basically sends an inital flash of light at the subject, causing the iris to contract, so that when the main flash goes off for the picture, the iris is already in a contracted state.

The better red-eye reduction systems give a series of brief flashes(or are on continuously) up until the instant the flash goes off, so that the iris doesn't have a chance to recover before it. Others give one lower powered flash before the main flash, however this 2-flash method doesn't always seem to work, as sometimes the subjects eye has time to recover between flashes.

Don't know if that is very clear, but its how I understand it to work.

Graham

 

[Graham]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Alexis:
It reduces the red reflex by making your pupil smaller, so the angle at which you would get the red reflex is reduced. So it is red eye reduction, not red eye elimination.

I think the Canon digicams use an led for this.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's true, depending on the camera and how its red-eye reduction works, you may still get some red-eye effect..

Graham

 

[snake]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

red eye reduction..

it cause by reflection of the retina, like you point a light to cat or dog at night for their puple could open very big.

beside multi flash, the position of the flash also make the difference! solution is try to avoid the flash on the same axis with the lens.. so you may found flash with handle attach on the side of the cam.

but for most flash intregated .. it can't change..so make your iris smaller is the other option..
for the final solution is use a pin point perment ink pen to fill it up..

and you should have no problem to found the color match you eye

 

[Elmie]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

Well as a matter of fact, the Canon digital elph uses a white led for both low light focusing and redeye reduction. For redeye reduction the led stays on till the picture is taken.

 

[JollyRoger]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

OK, so I guess some cameras are starting to use this...I had an old Elph (the APS kind) that used a regular bulb for the red eye reduction.

I was always tempted to replace it with a brighter led to improve the red-eye reduction capabilities...

My current camera uses the built-in flash (flashes twice) to reduce red-eye...so I can't do this mod anymore!
Oh well....

Maybe that's what an ARC is for....while you're taking the picture, shine the ARC to reduce the pupils...and take the picture! Maybe I should tape the ARC to my camera! Hey, I know...Peter or someone else can make an ARC camera mount! OK, now I'm getting ridiculous....

(BTW, my question was not, "What does red-eye reduction do?" but thanks for the comments anyways...)

 

[Darell]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

Funny you should mention the Arc in photography. When I take digital shots in the house at night, my camera has a heck of a time focusing. Holding the Arc in my free hand to illuminate the subject allows the camera to focus perfectly, and the LED light combined with the flash makes for some REALLY nice shots. I've never had better low-lights shots before.

 

[brightnorm]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Graham:

...The better red-eye reduction systems give a series of brief flashes...
Graham<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I gave away my Olympus I-75 APS camera for that very reason. The series of flashes startled and disoriented my subject as well as the people around him/her. It also slowed down the whole picture-taking process so that instant candid shots were almost impossible.

OTOH the short (2.5 sec) recycle time was very welcome.

Brightnorm

 

[The_LED_Museum]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by brightnorm:
I gave away my Olympus I-75 APS camera for that very reason. The series of flashes startled and disoriented my subject as well as the people around him/her. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

My new Nikon also fires a series of pulses into the strobe before the main flash. But that can easily be disabled with a couple of quick presses of a button, so there's no pre-flashes & no wait before the main flash fires.

When the camera is turned on, pressing one button a single time kills the red-eye reduction by setting the flash to fill mode. Or, pressing it three times instead of once keeps auto mode engaged while still killing the red-eye reduction. Either way, it's easy to cancel all the pre-flash garbage and allow the camera to shoot the instant you press the shutter release.

The only thing I hate about this camera is that if you are in auto mode and changed settings like exposure or red-eye, it "forgets" most of these any time you switch shooting modes or pop it into play mode to delete pictures. Going back to auto resets the %*($%*# thing to default settings (including turning the flash & red-eye back on); though for most users, the direct dial shooting modes kind of make this a muute point. But it's just enough to **** off someone like me because I use it mostly for closeups and usually alter the default settings in this mode.

 

[Andrew]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Elmie:
Well as a matter of fact, the Canon digital elph uses a white led for both low light focusing and redeye reduction. For redeye reduction the led stays on till the picture is taken.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The Canon Digital Elph (powershot 100/110) also uses a white LED for backlighting of the LCD screen. The camera is a nice piece of work.

 

[PhilAlex]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

Personally, I'm lusting after the Minolta Dimage X. $400

Small, and a 3X optical zoom to boot!

That, or Minox's ultimate small digital camera.

 

[Harrkev]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PhilAlex:

That, or Minox's ultimate small digital camera.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Minox makes a digital camera???

I was at the PMA (Photo Marketer's Association) show a month ago. I actualy grabbed a Minox brochure from the Leica booth, and held a CLX (very nice). They even had the Minox copy of a Leica. There was no mention of a Minox digital.

If they make one, then I want it. Where did you hear of this????

 

[ElektroLumens]

Re: Why aren\'t led\'s usedin cameras for red-eye reduction?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JollyRoger:

Maybe that's what an ARC is for....while you're taking the picture, shine the ARC to reduce the pupils...and take the picture! Maybe I should tape the ARC to my camera! Hey, I know...Peter or someone else can make an ARC camera mount! OK, now I'm getting ridiculous....

(BTW, my question was not, "What does red-eye reduction do?" but thanks for the comments anyways...)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hello Roger,


Not a rediculous idea.

It might be a good idea to have a bare Luxeon emitter mounted on the camera. If the subject can stand looking at the camera with the Luxeon, that is? Maybe it would eliminate red eye?

Wayne www.elektrolumens.com