Chicken Drumstick
Flashlight Enthusiast
ML50 is bigger, longer and heavier. Has a side switch and not the same thing at all. Plus it is hugely more money. But yes, the driver/LED from the ML50 could or maybe should be in the ML25.
Will I turn into a Maglite fan once again?
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lumen aeternum
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POST 97:
>the 60 something lumen aa minimag spectrum warm arrived. The beam reminds me a 4C incan Maglite in many ways.
... So 15 lumens appears brighter than 63 off in the distance.
>
Confused. You say a 4C Incan has 15 lumens ? Seems awfully low. How old is this model? Can't find such a light on the current Mag website.
>the 60 something lumen aa minimag spectrum warm arrived. The beam reminds me a 4C incan Maglite in many ways.
... So 15 lumens appears brighter than 63 off in the distance.
>
Confused. You say a 4C Incan has 15 lumens ? Seems awfully low. How old is this model? Can't find such a light on the current Mag website.
4C has about 60 lumens. LA, what I meant was the spectrum warm reminds me of a 4C Maglite in total. But……the 4C pierces darkness a lot farther way. Much farther.
I will probably prefer the triple a minimag in warm over the double a. But until I tried one the voices kept pestering me "you know you have to try it, you just have to". lol
I will probably prefer the triple a minimag in warm over the double a. But until I tried one the voices kept pestering me "you know you have to try it, you just have to". lol
Speaking of not a lot of lumens, the 60 something lumen aa minimag spectrum warm arrived. The beam reminds me a 4C incan Maglite in many ways. Bigger spill than the incan version but……
The beam of the little incan version has a tiny spot that can reach farther than the warm LED. I was kind of surprised. Now neither is huge bright output. The spectrum warm definitely outshines the incan for general uses. Yet it makes me appreciate the incan version that much more.
Left is the warm LED version.
The arrow points to a faint spot about 100 feet up, about 100 feet away.
The tiny spot of the incan is brighter.
So 15 lumens appears brighter than 63 off in the distance. Not saying it's brighter. Just saying that is one reason the aa minimag was so popular in the middle 80's to the middle 90's.
Byk, that's why I used to carry a incan AA Mini Mag in the woods back in the day (I used to get Nexstar bulbs from Brinkman which were a little brighter than the standard krypton and xenon Mag bulbs). Some of my buddies used to chide me about the old Mini Mag, that I needed a modern light with a showerhead full of LEDs with lumens (whatever those were – what the heck is a lumen?). Fact is I already had one of those newfangled LEDs – a streamlight pro polymer with (supposedly) 155 lumens of glorious deep purple/allegedly white light! - worked great out to maybe 20 feet but was pretty useless beyond that. So I stuck with my trusty old 12-15 lumen Mini Mag that I could see well out to at least 100 feet or so – great for spotting trail markers and potential hazards from a distance.
Lumen, I've heard that word some where. Oh yeah, isn't that a cross between a lemon and a limeon?
At one point I thought it was blumem with the b silent. I did not know LED beams were not supposed to be blue. My first LED light was an LED Lenser tri-max that boasted 12 LUMENS!!! Woah!! The beam was this ridiculous purple thing that looked like a x-ray of a mickey mouse head when aimed at a wall. It was my bedside table light for years. So for a long time I thought my aa minimag was better then that new fad called LED.
My first LED Maglite was either the 130 something or 160 something 2D light that also had a blue fringe in the beam but that sucker was like an HID. I used to shine it on road signs ahead of me on the interstate to light them up in daytime in order to mess with drowsey morning commuters minds. Next was a aa minimag and expecting the pin hole beam like the 2D it was a disapointment. Not a bad flashight but nowhere near the thrower of that 2D so it's around the house somewhere.
Only place I've seen output numbers for the spectrum warm aa minimag was an amazon seller. Not calling them liar liar pants on fire but I was hoping to find a second source to confirm that it's 63 lumens with low being about 25% of that. 8k+ candella so it's supposed to outshine the incan in the distance challenge but does not. In light polluted areas it'll be the better light to have.
To me the dynamic duo is the ML25 and the spectrum warm aaa minimag. The cool one is good too, but that incan colored beam is so nice. If only Tony had done an ML25 in that. It would likely be nowhere near as dynamic as the cool version called ML25LT. But more like the 3 cell IT probably. A stock 3 cell IT is like an incan aa minimag on after a RedBull Espresso. A 60 something lumen aa incan minimag with an oversized 40mm head.
I'll have to find my stash of Nextar bulbs and replace the bulb in my first ever minimag (circa 93-ish) that for some reason would not fire up yesterday. It still has the original bulb so that may be the issue. I was in a hurry to snap pix last night so I grabbed another one I have on a shelf. A super rare number with an upside down bezel ring stamping.
When I bought it only one was known to exist in the world.
The one known one was mentioned in the rare Maglites thread here. I saw one for sale on eBay and figured it was that one. But the one mentioned here was in the Netherlands or something and the guy I bought it from said he bought it new in Texas (iirc) and was selling it from there. I figure it's #2 known to exist. I'm certain there are more out there, they just aren't documented (that I've seen anyway). See post 214 in the rare maglites thread. #1 owner is in Finland.
At one point I thought it was blumem with the b silent. I did not know LED beams were not supposed to be blue. My first LED light was an LED Lenser tri-max that boasted 12 LUMENS!!! Woah!! The beam was this ridiculous purple thing that looked like a x-ray of a mickey mouse head when aimed at a wall. It was my bedside table light for years. So for a long time I thought my aa minimag was better then that new fad called LED.
My first LED Maglite was either the 130 something or 160 something 2D light that also had a blue fringe in the beam but that sucker was like an HID. I used to shine it on road signs ahead of me on the interstate to light them up in daytime in order to mess with drowsey morning commuters minds. Next was a aa minimag and expecting the pin hole beam like the 2D it was a disapointment. Not a bad flashight but nowhere near the thrower of that 2D so it's around the house somewhere.
Only place I've seen output numbers for the spectrum warm aa minimag was an amazon seller. Not calling them liar liar pants on fire but I was hoping to find a second source to confirm that it's 63 lumens with low being about 25% of that. 8k+ candella so it's supposed to outshine the incan in the distance challenge but does not. In light polluted areas it'll be the better light to have.
To me the dynamic duo is the ML25 and the spectrum warm aaa minimag. The cool one is good too, but that incan colored beam is so nice. If only Tony had done an ML25 in that. It would likely be nowhere near as dynamic as the cool version called ML25LT. But more like the 3 cell IT probably. A stock 3 cell IT is like an incan aa minimag on after a RedBull Espresso. A 60 something lumen aa incan minimag with an oversized 40mm head.
I'll have to find my stash of Nextar bulbs and replace the bulb in my first ever minimag (circa 93-ish) that for some reason would not fire up yesterday. It still has the original bulb so that may be the issue. I was in a hurry to snap pix last night so I grabbed another one I have on a shelf. A super rare number with an upside down bezel ring stamping.
When I bought it only one was known to exist in the world.
The one known one was mentioned in the rare Maglites thread here. I saw one for sale on eBay and figured it was that one. But the one mentioned here was in the Netherlands or something and the guy I bought it from said he bought it new in Texas (iirc) and was selling it from there. I figure it's #2 known to exist. I'm certain there are more out there, they just aren't documented (that I've seen anyway). See post 214 in the rare maglites thread. #1 owner is in Finland.
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Former_Mag_User
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What do you guys think of the lumen ratings that maglite is claiming for their LED lights?
Are they relatively accurate or overblown?
Are they relatively accurate or overblown?
BYK,
That upside down bezel is cool – someone must have been having a bad day when they were setting up the machinery!
As to the spectrum specs, I don't know, I suppose it's possible that Mag never had them officially tested by a ANSI lab. But hey, you could always make up your own lumens numbers like most other flashlight makers seem to do.
And oh yeah, early LEDs were pretty lame. I got a Streamlight TL2 LED when they first came out as everyone seemed to be recommending it with it's new Luxeon 1 super LED - turned out to be way dimmer than the typical Surefire or Streamlight incan 2X CR123A lights that I was used to (at least it wasn't a showerhead LED so there was some improvement in that sense). Since I needed a real tactical light at the time, I gave up on LEDs for a long time for any serious use.
That upside down bezel is cool – someone must have been having a bad day when they were setting up the machinery!
As to the spectrum specs, I don't know, I suppose it's possible that Mag never had them officially tested by a ANSI lab. But hey, you could always make up your own lumens numbers like most other flashlight makers seem to do.
And oh yeah, early LEDs were pretty lame. I got a Streamlight TL2 LED when they first came out as everyone seemed to be recommending it with it's new Luxeon 1 super LED - turned out to be way dimmer than the typical Surefire or Streamlight incan 2X CR123A lights that I was used to (at least it wasn't a showerhead LED so there was some improvement in that sense). Since I needed a real tactical light at the time, I gave up on LEDs for a long time for any serious use.
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they are accurate - maybe too accurate as they don't round anything off. They do have their lights tested by an independent lab for the ANSI F1 specs.
The 110 lumen TL2 was my favorite LED flashlight for a while. It has a pencil beam much like the ML25. And no blue at all. I used to refer to the tint as copy paper white. I also liked the incan version as it throws pretty well too. I bought the shockproof version back when. Way brighter than the incan Strion. Both are so darn pocket carry friendly. Streamlight was my favorite brand during the Maglite blumen days. Not that I despised the Maglite, but more like I just liked Streamlights. Then when they started outsourcing production to over seas my interest waned more and more as less of their products were being made domestically. Durability was also becoming an issue with the foreign made numbers.
Yeah, finding that upside down bezel was cooler than finding a Marquis (pre-Solitaire) light from a guy in England who had bought it in California while vacationing across the big pond. I ended up trading the Marquis for a gold plated minimag, then later traded that for a gold plated Brinkmann Legend 3aaa that was Don Keller's at one point. The Marquis for those who don't know was a 1aaa light Tony built for his girlfriend. During the heyday of Tony winning lawsuits it turned out the Marquis name was owned by somebody else and Tony had copyright infringed without knowing it. The lights were pulled from shelves and it is thought that only about 200 were actually sold prior to that. So it's pretty hard to find one. It was actually different than the Solitaire in some ways.
See post 102 for comparison
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/v...Do-you-still-use-them/page3&highlight=Marquis
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Original incorrect info removed.
Edit: the 63 lumens, 83m, 1712 cd is the aaa spectrum warm. The aa is stated (at Amazon) as 57 lumens, 120m and 3581 cd.
End edit.
Regarding LED aa minimags it appears perhaps the 127 lumen version is the throw champ with 6093 cd. The 332 lumen although nearly 3x the total output goes up to 7399cd.
The 97 lumen version has a respectable 5253 cd.
Now if you want a super thrower incan minimag the 3 cell ML25 is 63 lumens with a 12435 cd. The 2 cell is a bit over 2x the output of the 14 lumen aa at its 30 lumens but candela is nearly 3x the amount of the aa version at 6616 versus 2305 of the smaller head version.
So even though the spectrum warm aa minimag is 4.5 times brighter than the incan version according to the flat piece of paper, one can see farther in the distance on a starry night using the paultry output of that little bi-pin bulb.
What does this mean to the consumer? Probably not much since lumen ratings sell more flashlights than candela ratings.
Edit: the 63 lumens, 83m, 1712 cd is the aaa spectrum warm. The aa is stated (at Amazon) as 57 lumens, 120m and 3581 cd.
End edit.
Regarding LED aa minimags it appears perhaps the 127 lumen version is the throw champ with 6093 cd. The 332 lumen although nearly 3x the total output goes up to 7399cd.
The 97 lumen version has a respectable 5253 cd.
Now if you want a super thrower incan minimag the 3 cell ML25 is 63 lumens with a 12435 cd. The 2 cell is a bit over 2x the output of the 14 lumen aa at its 30 lumens but candela is nearly 3x the amount of the aa version at 6616 versus 2305 of the smaller head version.
So even though the spectrum warm aa minimag is 4.5 times brighter than the incan version according to the flat piece of paper, one can see farther in the distance on a starry night using the paultry output of that little bi-pin bulb.
What does this mean to the consumer? Probably not much since lumen ratings sell more flashlights than candela ratings.
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You had a much newer generation than mine, which was the same as a incan TL2 except that the cobbled it together with a little LED module in place of the incan bulb holder. The LED was the Luxeon 1 – maybe 30 lumens tops on fresh cells and was not regulated, so it got dimmer as the batteries drained. The tint was actually quite good, much better than the typical LEDs of the day. It was just that 30 fairly floody lumens didn't cut it as a tactical light even back then. If SL had sold it as a utility light it would have been OK. Instead Streamlight has updated the TL2 LED over the years to the point that they are a completely different light in terms of performance, which is fine also.
The first LED tactical light that was bright enough that I had was the Inova XO, maybe 60 lumens or so with decent throw.
Getting back to Maglites, I find it interesting looking back that nearly all of the would be Maglite killers that came along over the years that were supposed to be so much better are long gone and mostly forgotten while Mag is still here. Mag may not be the latest and greatest but some of us still like them and find them useful. It's had to beat a very well made quality product, that costs very little, lasts for many years that just works and works well.
hsa
Flashlight Enthusiast
^ Their T- Shirt sums up your sentiments. "We never left". It's good to see discussions on Maglites.
Although I never really stopped being a fan of Maglite, this thread has definitely rekindled my enthusiasm for the brand.
While being enamored by brands like SureFire, Streamlight and others for a few years after discovering that LED lights had become brighter than my incan minimag I had quietly picked up a Solitaire here or a minimag there at my local box stores not really giving much thought about them. But for some reason this thread peeked my interest in some of the past accomplishments that were largely dismissed by the crowd here at CPF. Not saying they are wrong, mind you just that when they yawned so did I.
My daily carry numbers were designed and built by PK simply because they achieve what I prefer in a pocket sized lighting tool. It's kinda like a Leatherman tool if you will. Sometimes a "full sized" tool is better. So when I started learning about the ML125 for example and then bought one I was impressed. It will likely never become my full time take it everywhere flashlight but it is definitely in the "top drawer" of my flashlight tool box if you will. I had an XL200 but gave it away because I just didn't 'get it' but did carry an XL50 for a while (until confiscated by Mrs Fixer). Now (thanks to this thread) I get it so that too is in the perverbial top drawer.
The spectrum warm numbers stay around the house as general use lights along with a couple of SureFire G2x Pro lights. So while the lumen wars rage on and the mass produced Asian numbers continue to keep the masses occupied Maglite has quietly gone about business as usual with minor upgrades at times like the 100 lumen aaa minimag or largely unnoticed engineering marvels like the ML25 or the new crop of MagChargers.
The once undisputed king of the flashlight world is now relegated as one of the characters in Horton Hears a Who. So in a way Tony Maglica and his lab coat wearing team of engineers have become Tony Who. However like hsa said……
They never left. (Thank goodness)
What does the future hold for Maglite? I get a sense things will largely stay traditional regarding basic shapes and functions with a flare for classic Maglite operating systems. I would like to see a spectrum warm ML25 even if it only touts around 75 lumens, as long as it has that famous ML25 beam. I'd also like to see them do an XL50 type number using a single AA platform. In other words, a tail cap switch to activate it. If Fenix can do it with the E12 there's no doubt in my mind Maglite can do it too. I'm sure Tony would prompt it to start on high in traditional Maglite methodology but one can hope it has the ML50 ability to change the interface and have starting on low as one of the choices. Perhaps a tradional Maglite bell head MagTac? That too would float my boat. Or some polyester body lights aimed at the electrician or other need for internsically safe lighting market like an ML50P or that sort of thing. Just thinking out loud.
While being enamored by brands like SureFire, Streamlight and others for a few years after discovering that LED lights had become brighter than my incan minimag I had quietly picked up a Solitaire here or a minimag there at my local box stores not really giving much thought about them. But for some reason this thread peeked my interest in some of the past accomplishments that were largely dismissed by the crowd here at CPF. Not saying they are wrong, mind you just that when they yawned so did I.
My daily carry numbers were designed and built by PK simply because they achieve what I prefer in a pocket sized lighting tool. It's kinda like a Leatherman tool if you will. Sometimes a "full sized" tool is better. So when I started learning about the ML125 for example and then bought one I was impressed. It will likely never become my full time take it everywhere flashlight but it is definitely in the "top drawer" of my flashlight tool box if you will. I had an XL200 but gave it away because I just didn't 'get it' but did carry an XL50 for a while (until confiscated by Mrs Fixer). Now (thanks to this thread) I get it so that too is in the perverbial top drawer.
The spectrum warm numbers stay around the house as general use lights along with a couple of SureFire G2x Pro lights. So while the lumen wars rage on and the mass produced Asian numbers continue to keep the masses occupied Maglite has quietly gone about business as usual with minor upgrades at times like the 100 lumen aaa minimag or largely unnoticed engineering marvels like the ML25 or the new crop of MagChargers.
The once undisputed king of the flashlight world is now relegated as one of the characters in Horton Hears a Who. So in a way Tony Maglica and his lab coat wearing team of engineers have become Tony Who. However like hsa said……
They never left. (Thank goodness)
What does the future hold for Maglite? I get a sense things will largely stay traditional regarding basic shapes and functions with a flare for classic Maglite operating systems. I would like to see a spectrum warm ML25 even if it only touts around 75 lumens, as long as it has that famous ML25 beam. I'd also like to see them do an XL50 type number using a single AA platform. In other words, a tail cap switch to activate it. If Fenix can do it with the E12 there's no doubt in my mind Maglite can do it too. I'm sure Tony would prompt it to start on high in traditional Maglite methodology but one can hope it has the ML50 ability to change the interface and have starting on low as one of the choices. Perhaps a tradional Maglite bell head MagTac? That too would float my boat. Or some polyester body lights aimed at the electrician or other need for internsically safe lighting market like an ML50P or that sort of thing. Just thinking out loud.
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Tony could have closed his factory in California, sold out to a Chinese manufacturer and retired. Instead, at near 90 years of age, he gets up every day before dawn to be the first one on the production floor and for the last decade or more has been spending his money to keep Maglites made in America.
https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130197557
https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130197557
Former_Mag_User
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Former_Mag_User
Enlightened
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I remember back in the day when modding stock incan maglites with multiple LEDs and custom heatsinks was the business.
Perhaps John Maglica will take over some day……
https://youtu.be/Z7BVJQd6dxo
Heeeeeeeeeere!'s Johnny……
I hope so, but it won't be easy until they start making money again. BTW, Looks like they are branching out into backpacks and tactical gear....don't know if that will help?
