Video Game for Bad Student

MicroE

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Teenagers listen up!

Should I buy a Playstation or other game console to help my son in school?

Here's the deal:
Homework has become a real problem in our house and I would like your advice in helping to fix the situation. I have a 10 year old son that hates to do his homework, hates school, doesn't pay attentiion in class, and his grades are suffering. It's driving my wife and I crazy.

Up until now, we have not had cable TV or any video game console systems in the house. My son tells me that this makes him an outcast at school and the other kids pick on him because of it.

My idea is to buy a game system and then give him tickets worth 30-minutes of game time each time that he performs well on homework or gets a good grade in school.

Do you think that this is worth a try?
BTW, if you think that this is a good idea, which system should I buy?
 

zespectre

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Ummmm, performance first and THEN reward?
I had similar problems in school but it was mostly because I was BORED! (except for math where I really struggled and eventually got the extra help I needed).
 

Makarov

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This isn't actually that stupid, a couple of years ago I had a kid at work(I work in a school) that had a similar system set up by a psychologist. He vould get a star in a small book each time he preformed a certain task, when he had filled a page he got to buy a new videogame.

Getting a gaming-console for your son could help him fit in as well, but I vould check with some other parents if he's claim of being the only one without a console... (Who haven't used that strategy against their parents :whistle: )

I guess that X-box 360 is the hottest thing around right now, but again, check around with other parents before buying.
If all the other kids got PS2(Playstation) it would be better to buy the same, this way he could loan games from his friends. There will be a new Playstation out later this year IIRC.
 

carrot

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A Playstation out of the blue is a bad idea. It makes it seem like you are rewarding poor performance. Tell him if he gets a good grade (whatever you decide a "good grade" is) on his next ___ tests, you'll get him a PS2. Or an Xbox. Or whatever. Let him choose... just not a portable. *Then* regulate his usage.

I shouldn't talk. I've noticed an increased lack in productivity the faster my internet gets.
Dial-up: Excellent grades, straight-A student.
DSL: Good grades, not straight-A anymore.
Cable: Okay grades, B student.

BTW, try Dance Dance Revolution. You can get a bundle pack with the game and a pad for $60 -- (I recommend Extreme for PS2 and Ultramix 2 for Xbox)... excellent fun.
 

alaskawolf

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id suggest the PS2 for its much better choices of games, its has a big libary of games to chose from.

unlike the xbox's its backwards compatible and you dont need to buy the optional remote to play dvds.

you can pick up the game cube for a decent price these days.

when it comes down to it, its the games not the system thats most important
 

carrot

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alaskawolf said:
id suggest the PS2 for its much better choices of games, its has a big libary of games to chose from.

unlike the xbox's its backwards compatible and you dont need to buy the optional remote to play dvds.

you can pick up the game cube for a decent price these days.

when it comes down to it, its the games not the system thats most important
PS2 fanboy. The Xbox is not backwards compatible because it's Microsoft's ONLY system. IMO if you like PC games but don't want to keep spending money on a high-end PC you're better off going with Xbox because MS is making it trivial to port PC games to Xbox (Fable, Morrowind, Half-Life 2, Doom 3, Far Cry Instincts), and if you want a greater overall selection and some wonderful niche games (DDR, Katamari Damacy, Viewtiful Joe), PS2. Gamecube is getting edged out by its competition, but there's still a great selection of Nintendo-only games for it... Pikmin, Super Smash Bros., Metroid, Zelda.

I'll let my original opinion stand. Let the kid decide.
 

alaskawolf

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oh please dont give me that ps2 fanboy crap :p


my friend owns his own video game store that i used to work at and i still help out at the store every now and then.i know the market and how things go, many people want whats new and that makes it hot but in the long run people generaly go with what is tried and true. we sale and rent far more Playstation games than Xbox games. the majority of customers are happier with PS2s than Xbox's and most of our customers already own multiple Consoles

when i said backwards campatibitlity i said Xbox's which ment between the Xbox and the Xbox 360.
just get the kid a GBA or A DS.
 

Omega Man

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Micro E said:
My idea is to buy a game system and then give him tickets worth 30-minutes of game time each time that he performs well on homework or gets a good grade in school.
It's called a Token System, I learned about them at my job working with MR clients. A person completes a task, is given a tangable object, their token. They trade the token(s) in for reward(s), like snack, tv time, internet, etc.
Congratulations on trying to compromise with him, instead of just punishing him for "slacking off and being lazy".
 

Blinocac200sx

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When I was in grade school, I was iniatintive and got bad grades, but when they did the gifted tested, I always got high marks. The reason, I was bored in normal school, and when I got the opportunity to be challenged, I rose to it and did well. Just a thought. But regaurding your question, I started doing my homework much more earnestly when I was in middle school and the folks got a computer and doing hoemwork was a qualifier for use.
 

James S

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Game console has no redeeming value beyond the reward of playing games. Buy a newer fancier computer that is capable of playing some good games AND doing all the other wonderful edumacational things you can do with a computer on the internet :)
 

geepondy

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I sorta disagree with James S, at least considering the game aspect of PC's. If you wish to continually play the latest pc games with all the eye candy, you will spend a fortune in constantly upgrading the hardware. Both PC and game console games are expensive but you seem to get a bit more longevity for the price with a game console.

Ask your son what he would like for a game console. Maybe his closer friends might be in a particular console camp be it Xbox or PS2.
 

Trashman

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Somehow, I don't think buying a 10-year old a video game system is going to help him get better grades. LOL My grades were horrible during the lower grades, but got a lot better in junior high and high school. During the lower grades, I was the kid that would talk out in class and try to say funny things to make people laugh. I always used to get "N"s or "U" for the citizenship grade (needs to improve, or unacceptable). I remember in 5th grade I got a bunch of d's and maybe even some "F"s, although, incredibly, that was also the year I was accepted into G.A.T.E.. I'd say that it was in junior high school that I started to settle down and do a little better in school, maybe as late as 8th grade, even. Although, I never did learn to do homework--homework was always something I did at school, usually right before class, in a different class, or during lunch.

10 years old is still young, I wouldn't worry.
 

JasonC8301

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I would say discipline. A little 'physical' motivation is in-line not some crappy time out now the norm. When a kid couldn't get his favorite game at the electronics store the other day, he went balling and screaming. I would of just not said a word and walked away (of course not out the store.) Scare the kid a little.

I guess I was an exception I just never got into game consoles nor cable/satellite TV (just recently got dish network lol). PC games on the other hand....

Send him to military/boarding school j/k.

After I visited a jail (Rikers Island) I definately buckled down and got my grades to be above average because I did not want to go to jail (most criminals don't even graduate high school, there are always exceptions though.)
 

James S

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having 2 kids myself and having taken care of cousins and friends and bunches and groups of kids, the only thing I can say with any authority is that they are all different :) Some kids just dont respond at all to one kind of discipline and some do. For some you need to alternate the carrot and the stick. I'm not at all against offering the carrot. Just buying the kid an occasional carrot like this will not spoil them necessarily. A spoilt kid is one who gets away with throwing the fit and still gets what he wants, or knows that his parents will not follow through on any punishment.

I've taught my daughter that negotiation for what she wants, if carried out in a careful quiet tone sometimes yields results. But fussing or throwing a fit never does. We're completely consistent about this. If she can manage to talk to me in a grown up fashion then I sometimes let myself be talked into doing or getting what she wants. But the first fuss or whine and the answer is no regardless. She's really pretty good at controlling herself that way now :) That has nothing to do with the current discussion, but I just can't see how corporal punishment can make a kid pay better attention in class where the anticipation of an hour playing a game might give him something to look forward to if he can slug through math class.

I was pretty good as a younger kid, my grades didn't start to drop until high school...

I'm just not a big fan of game consoles. A real computer can be used to do lots of things beyond just playing games, some of which are really fun. I can't wait till my kids are old enough to start programming some lego mindstorms and other such things.
 

MicroE

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Thanks for the replies.

Discipline really isn't the issue. We're not afraid of spanking, or using the fear of spanking (with many punishments, the fear is more powerful than the actual act). But he's getting bigger and this isn't the proper way to continue his upbringing.
He is very well-behaved. My wife and I simply would not stand for any yelling and screaming performances in public.

He is just not motivated regarding school.

I didn't mean to start a flame-war between the Xbox, PS2, and Nintendo camps. I expect that he would play mostly games rated "E" and maybe a couple rated "T". He has expressed fear of games rated "M" and used to get nightmares after seeing some of the violent games in the arcade (during birthday parties for his friends).

Token system. Good name.
 

Makarov

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OmegaMan said it better than me, and I have experienced that it works as well.
The fear of losing a token(ie not recieving one because the task is not completed) is often enough motivation.
But you have to get your kid to completely agree on this system before starting out, or else it's of little value.

And what James S says about upbringing is taken straight out of the Book :goodjob:
Just before Christmas I was at a seminar where we watched a videopresentation from a well-recognized child-psycologist. He talked about the fact that somethimes it's ok for the adult to give in for the childs arguments, as long as they are "good"

About the consoles, I'm a PS2 man myself, but I have a neighbour who got a modded X-box that is a impressive home-entertainmentsystem.
Chose the console that most of your son's friends got.
 

AJ_Dual

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Scholastically speaking, I was your son.

Behaviorally, outside of schoolwork, I was a good kid. (Or, at least intelligent and low-profile enough to not get caught.) That was actually part of the problem. Since I wasn't acting out "physically", my daily procrastination and refusal to do homework got overlooked. I'd get quarterly "Come to Jesus" meetings with my parents and teachers around report card time, but then I'd get ignored for another quarter. Maybe I'd get some monitoring now and again, assignment notes from teachers, or progress reports, but nothing would last.

I would exploit the inattention in the short term so I could screw around and procrastinate, but sub-consciously, in the long run, I'm positive that if made me despondent that nobody gave a damn. I'm sure you're a good parent, but whatever you're doing, you need to dig into your son's issues at a level that you might initialy think is a bit nuts, if you want to see results. As a boy, despite his issues, he's already been socialized enough to at least try and not show "weakness" to his peers or his family. He's not going to open up to you on his own, you need to dig in there and find out what's wrong.

Socially:

In the pecking order, I was somewhat of an outcast. I always had one or two good friends, but was never popular with anyone else. I guess you could say I was always on the lowest rung of the "normal" kids. Right beneath me was the border across which lay the true "freaks". It was a small school, and luckily for me it wasn't outright bullying or mistreatment. I was mostly tolerated by the other kids I was just teased and shunned for anything outside of school functions. I was mostly OK with it as I was strong willed enough, and didn't care too much about what people I didn't like thought of me. I really don't know what to tell you about your son's social issues, but I am unwilling to believe that your son is ostracized simply because you don't have cable TV or a PlayStation2. Even with all the fads and technology and pop-culture we now have, even since the 70's & 80's when we did most of our growing up, I can't believe that all kids today are that shallow. If they truly are teasing him over TV and video games (or the lack there of…) it's just a convenient vehicle for some other problem or weakness they percieve in him.

As adults we have a hard time watching the interactions of children, and fail to remember how deadly serious they felt at the time when we were that age. If you can, try and watch your son interacting with other kids, and try to see it through ten year-old eyes. (assuming you were "normal"/popular as a child) Is he acting like a kid you'd have picked on? Is he letting them get to him too easily?

Scholastics:

I was probably very advanced, but I was never offered any gifted programs. I was in public school until the 3rd grade, at which time my parents moved me to a small Catholic school. In first grade I read about 6th grade level, and by 4th grade I was reading full length adult novels for fun. (I remember my 5th grade teacher complaining that I was reading George Orwell's Animal Farm. I don't know what the big deal was as it was at least my second reading… LOL)

I continuously procrastinated or failed to do homework, and I got by as a "C" or a "D" student by doing well on tests, or occasionally doing some "social engineering" on my teachers by being bright in class, or turning in the occasional phenominal assignment. I was probably advanced in most everything but math. If he's got any attributes that would make you think he's gifted, such as reading above grade level, or a technical interest or skill that's beyond his years, see about getting him tested for your school's gifted program. You also need to involve his teacher. Get an assignment list every day, and demand that you be notified when any deadline is missed, not just big ones, or only after he's failed to do homework for a week or more.

ADD.

Get him tested. Find a doctor/clinic/program that's trustworthy and won't over-diagnose him, or medicate on a whim. I've been diagnosed as an adult with non hyperactive ADD. (Unfortunately, all the drugs made me sick…) And when there's no hyperactivity or acting out, ADD often goes undiagnosed. I do think that ADD is over-treated and over-diagnosed, however, I also believe that the upswing in ADD isn't entirely a fad either.

My personal theory is that the generations born in the 70's onward were the first to have heavy TV exposure. (Even if you don't have cable, 3-4 channels of broadcast are enough, IMO) The nature of TV programming, even in "good" or educational TV, such as editing, non-causality, non-linear, time-compression, and rapid cuts, might be doing something to kids brain formation. The jumpy editited nature of all television is just so at odds with real life, it's silly to completey discount that it could be doing something to the connections and pathways in the brain.

Parents:

Part of my issues were that while my parents were concerned, none of them had any idea how closely they needed to be watching me to ensure I was doing my schoolwork. They never really understood I had a "problem", and other than making me catch up, they wouldn't watch me on a regular basis. I wanted to scream at them. Why didn't they understand I would just slack off the minute they walked away? If your son is constantly failing to study and is behind in his homework, YOU need to sit there with him every night, it that's what it takes. If he's got a learning or emotional problem, you might have to do this for years until you can be sure his "study muscle" has formed properly. Since he's only ten, you've got four more years before he enters high school where his scholastic performance will start to affect his future.

As to the video game system, you can go ahead and get him one, but he needs to reach some set goals BEFORE he's even given the system, and keep meeting those goals to be able to use it. Your idea for "tickets" is a good one, but you can't just follow the system for a few months until things are looking better, then leave him to his own devices, you need to be consistent with this for YEARS, even if he's now doing better.
 

cobb

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From an academic psychologic view, the reward has to be 5 times greater than the punishment for it to work. One reason releasing prisoners into the world again dosnt work too well. If not carefully used, you could end up being used by your kid for game time by other tasks, chors, interactions with family, etc, etc, etc. I dont think 30 minutes is much time. I can easily kill an hour trying to figure out a game like nascar or ms train simulator.

I performed poorly in school because i hated it. Nothing short of dropping out to get my ged would of made any difference with me. Part was disability related, part was being treated like someone with a highly communicable disease. Only during senior year did anyone want anything to do with me and that was for the senior photos. What movitaved me was to get excused to go to the library to half assly finish an assignment in peace away from the spit balls, whispering and further anatics when folks walked by my desk, brushing cooties off of themselves as they walk by.

What would I of changed after the fact? I would of paid less attention and make the best of my life at that time, applied for ged at age 18 take it, then do the college thing. I would of likely ended up in some contracting type of work. Thats assuming my disability didnt get too much in the way.
 

MicroE

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Thanks, Team CPF. I have decided to go with a PS2 and have my son sign a written contract which stipulates the times and conditions of use.
 
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