Jil DD output vs. other lights and any Jil DD owners in socal?

Edit - since there doesn't seem to be much owners that have both TWOH and TWOJ to compare output and runtime, I edited to the subject to see if anyone could provide insight into the output of the Jil DD relative to other lights. Thanks for the help.

I have a couple of questions regarding the Jil DDs:

1. Since the TWOH has a lower VF, it would suck more current from the CR2 (and be a bit brighter). The Jil DDs are known to have 20+hr runtimes, but I believe that was with the TWOJ.
How is the runtime with the TWOH compared to the TWOJ?

2. My only reservation left on purchasing a Jil DD is how bright it is. Conestuff's reviews showed the DD is about 5.5X dimmer than the 1.3W, which doesn't seem that bright. I'd like it to be considerably brighter than my CS-modded KeyMate.
Anyone in socal (ideally San Gabriel Valley, San Fernando Valley, LA, Torrance, and surrounding areas) have a Jil DD I can take a look at in person?

Thanks for your help.

J.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

I think most people using the DD TWOJ are running it on rechargeables, which, I believe, makes it even brighter than the Jil 1.3w. I've got the 1.3w TWOH, and it was a pretty big improvement over the regular 1.3w that I had previously.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

I don't think the vf makes a difference in the brightness per say. It sets the voltage limits and affects runtime. The J vf will be safer on the LED when using a LiON battery. The H vf will have longer runtime. I'm pretty sure I have a couple of H bin Jils that I run with LiON but their all mixed up now and I'm not positive.

The Jil DD is still my fave EDC and the chrome one is the one I EDC the most. MUCH better wear than the HA3.

As far as choosing over the 1.3... I sold my 1.3 because the DD is a lot brighter on LiON battery and that's what I use. Guilt free lumens! And serious output too! I don't normally need a long runtime and if I do I have a smaller Photon Freedom for that.

If your not in need of super bright then go DD with a primary. It's a great small form factor.

So DD for me :twothumbs

just my 2c

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

CroMAGnet said:

I don't think the vf makes a difference in the brightness per say. It sets the voltage limits and affects runtime. The J vf will be safer on the LED when using a LiON battery. The H vf will have longer runtime. I'm pretty sure I have a couple of H bin Jils that I run with LiON but their all mixed up now and I'm not positive.

The Jil DD is still my fave EDC and the chrome one is the one I EDC the most. MUCH better wear than the HA3.

As far as choosing over the 1.3... I sold my 1.3 because the DD is a lot brighter on LiON battery and that's what I use. Guilt free lumens! And serious output too! I don't normally need a long runtime and if I do I have a smaller Photon Freedom for that.

If your not in need of super bright then go DD with a primary. It's a great small form factor.

So DD for me :twothumbs

just my 2c

Click to expand...

Hi CroMAGnet,

Is your JIL CR2 DD modified with goldserve's FLuPIC (to make it a DD-Intelli) or are you direct driving an xxxH and/or xxxJ on an RCR2? I've been wondering what happens when somebody uses a RCR2 in a normal DD. There was an old thread about the JIL that seemed to indicate some people were using RCR2's in a DD without problems, but I know goldserve did not recommend it.

What runtime do you get from an RCR2? From cones' review it looked like the Intelli only got about 15 minutes at maximum brightness, but if you're direct driving it might be even less runtime (and brighter) since I think goldserve's FLuPIC limits the max amps to the LED. Of course with the FLuPIC you can always use a lower brightness level to conserve the battery.

Thanks for any tips you can give us about the JIL.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

vortechs said:

Hi CroMAGnet,

Is your JIL CR2 DD modified with goldserve's FLuPIC (to make it a DD-Intelli) or are you direct driving an xxxH and/or xxxJ on an RCR2? I've been wondering what happens when somebody uses a RCR2 in a normal DD. There was an old thread about the JIL that seemed to indicate some people were using RCR2's in a DD without problems, but I know goldserve did not recommend it.

What runtime do you get from an RCR2? From cones' review it looked like the Intelli only got about 15 minutes at maximum brightness, but if you're direct driving it might be even less runtime (and brighter) since I think goldserve's FLuPIC limits the max amps to the LED. Of course with the FLuPIC you can always use a lower brightness level to conserve the battery.

Thanks for any tips you can give us about the JIL.

Click to expand...

As for the Intelli. The intelli and I just don't get along. Too many modes for me to use it usefully. Kevin is custom making a couple for my Alephs right now that I hope will work out better but they are much different with less variety etc. One is a UX1K which just might best my current dragster TWOK NG1000 LE.

There's something to say about topping off your LiON battery for a few minutes and shining that Jil DD UP in the palm of your hand. It's a great way to demostrate the Jil if it's not dark or even if it is.

As for the vf, I'd say if you can get a J you'd be better off and a K would be even better for the LED. I think my chrome EDC is a TWOJ or YO or whatever. It's white and bright.

Runtime? eh, just edc a firefli. People love to see those. They are good if your Jil runs out of Jil Juice. You can always keep a spare battery or two in a case in your car. Nice thing is the Jil DD runs on both battery types. ModaMag told me he prefers the primary lithium battery in his chrome Jil DD UP because it really is bright enough and the runtime is excellent.

jsrBTW I'm heading down to Santa Monica on Wednesday but heading back home Thursday so if you're around there I'd be happy to show you a few lights.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

Hi Tony - I PM'd you re: the meet up. Hopefully I can make it depending on where you'll be at specifically on Wednesday night. Thanks.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

FYI

I remember what I did to my main Jil DD Chrome EDC. I swapped out the T__J 3W from my original Jil. So that explains the LiON use. Also I dremeled down a reflector to fit. It took about 2 hours in Modamag's garage. It has a tighter beam and throws father than the new UP reflector. But the new UP reflector also has a nice wide hotspot.

The chrome is so sweet though

jsr: We'll try to meet up tomorrow night. I'll bring all the lights you asked to see. I just happen to have all of them in one small case.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

Unfortunately, CroMAGnet and I couldn't meet up, so I'm still looking for a socal Jil DD owner to show me their Jil DD. I'm concerned the output isn't enough on a primary. There must be some Jil DD owners in socal??

If not, can someone give a preceived brightness relative to lights like the TM-310H, TM-311H, Q3, etc. (these are the lights I've seen in person cuz I have them).
Thanks,

J.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

I have one of the TWOH DD ones, but I'm a bit south of you.

Larry

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

Hi Larry,

Costa Mesa's not too far and I'm occasionally around OC. Maybe we can meet up sometime. I'll PM you with contact info. Thanks very much for your help!

J.

jsr said:

Edit - since there doesn't seem to be much owners that have both TWOH and TWOJ to compare output and runtime, I edited to the subject to see if anyone could provide insight into the output of the Jil DD relative to other lights. Thanks for the help.

I have a couple of questions regarding the Jil DDs:

1. Since the TWOH has a lower VF, it would suck more current from the CR2 (and be a bit brighter). The Jil DDs are known to have 20+hr runtimes, but I believe that was with the TWOJ.
How is the runtime with the TWOH compared to the TWOJ?

2. My only reservation left on purchasing a Jil DD is how bright it is. Conestuff's reviews showed the DD is about 5.5X dimmer than the 1.3W, which doesn't seem that bright. I'd like it to be considerably brighter than my CS-modded KeyMate.
Anyone in socal (ideally San Gabriel Valley, San Fernando Valley, LA, Torrance, and surrounding areas) have a Jil DD I can take a look at in person?

Thanks for your help.

J.

Click to expand...

Hi jsr,

I just got 2 JIL's in the mail today. One is a DD Intelli version that comes with a FLuPIC and a TWOH (at least, I think all of the Intelli's were TWOH). The other is a mod created by CPF member goldserve by taking a JIL 1.3W version and removing the micropuck converter and adding one of his FLuPIC's (we're pretty sure the LED is a TWOJ based on what was available when the mod was done). This was one of the prototypes for the Intelli version (which uses the slightly smaller DD form factor). Since they are both effectively DD in burst mode with a primary CR2, I should be able to compare brightness for you, but it will just be my opinion since I don't have any test gear.

Once I've had a chance to try them side by side on CR2 primaries and RCR2 rechargeables I'll let you know my impression of how bright they are. However, if you are really interested in brightness you should get a JIL with a FLuPIC (the Intelli, or one of goldserve's drop in mods for the DD), since that allows you to use RCR's for much greater brightness on burst mode while still offereing increased runtimes on the lower settings. I'll need to find a source of inexpensive CR2 primaries before I attempt anything like try to compare runtimes.

Thanks vortechs! I look forward to your brightness comparisons on primary CR2s vs. RCR2s. I'm concerned about brightness, but don't need it to be super bright. I estimate my KeyMate with Nichia CS makes about 7-something lumens, so I'd like the DD to be at least twice that, around 15lm minimum. I like the long runtime on the primaries and want at least 15lm output to justify the cost to replace my KM-CS. I'd like the Intelli, but can't justify the cost right now. Thanks.
J.

Re: Jil DD TWOH vs. TWOJ and any Jil DD owners in socal?

CroMAGnet said:

FYI

I remember what I did to my main Jil DD Chrome EDC. I swapped out the T__J 3W from my original Jil. So that explains the LiON use. Also I dremeled down a reflector to fit. It took about 2 hours in Modamag's garage. It has a tighter beam and throws father than the new UP reflector. But the new UP reflector also has a nice wide hotspot.

The chrome is so sweet though

jsr: We'll try to meet up tomorrow night. I'll bring all the lights you asked to see. I just happen to have all of them in one small case.

Click to expand...

I have a Jil DD Up on RCR2 and it smoked the Raw NS by a mile. The Jil DD UP has a more pleasant beam as well.

Cromagnet-

If you get a chance to post a pic of your chromed Jil I would like to see it. The only one I have seen is on the advert. I am on the fence about getting the chrome. Kinda wish they had a solid SS. Does the chrome chip if dropped? I drop all my lights and am tired of the HA always chipping. Wish there were some high quality SS lights made.

I don't think the Jil DD (Up) has any problem using RCR2's and with one in it you are looking at SMALL and BRIGHT. Save your gas - You won't be disappointed. There should be some beam shot comparisons around here somewhere. Without chasing down any of my other lights I just ran it in semi-darkened room against an Arc 4+ and it's got more spill but overall it looked like more lumens than the Arc 4+. I could be wrong but if it's even in the ball park that should tell you it is BRIGHT.

matrixshaman said:

I don't think the Jil DD (Up) has any problem using RCR2's and with one in it you are looking at SMALL and BRIGHT.

Click to expand...

I believe the people who have been running a JIL DD with RCR2's have been using the version with the TW0J emitter (or a FLuPIC, which limits the current to the LED). I think the original JIL's all used TW0J emitters. From what I've read in the thead where Warren was first doing a feeler about a TW0H version , an RCR2 would not be a good thing for direct driving a TW0H. Take a look at the first post in this thread here.

vortechs said:

I believe the people who have been running a JIL DD with RCR2's have been using the version with the TW0J emitter (or a FLuPIC, which limits the current to the LED). I think the original JIL's all used TW0J emitters. From what I've read in the thead where Warren was first doing a feeler about a TW0H version , an RCR2 would not be a good thing for direct driving a TW0H. Take a look at the first post in this thread here.

Click to expand...

I think that TW0K is recommended for DD, unless you have a FluPIC.

I personally wonder/question if any of the "don't use TxxH with LiIon" have any real backing. Considering the nominal VF of a TxxH is only ~0.15V lower than a TxxJ, I don't see that making much of a difference. Simply taking off the RCR2 from the Nano charger right when the light turns green will give you about 0.15V lower voltage on the cell then if you fully charged it to 4.2V. I can see the diff between a H-bin vs. a K-bin or L-bin as the difference increases there, but 0.15V doesn't seem like much.

vortechs said:

Hi jsr,

I just got 2 JIL's in the mail today. One is a DD Intelli version that comes with a FLuPIC and a TWOH (at least, I think all of the Intelli's were TWOH). The other is a mod created by CPF member goldserve by taking a JIL 1.3W version and removing the micropuck converter and adding one of his FLuPIC's (we're pretty sure the LED is a TWOJ based on what was available when the mod was done). This was one of the prototypes for the Intelli version (which uses the slightly smaller DD form factor). Since they are both effectively DD in burst mode with a primary CR2, I should be able to compare brightness for you, but it will just be my opinion since I don't have any test gear.

Once I've had a chance to try them side by side on CR2 primaries and RCR2 rechargeables I'll let you know my impression of how bright they are. However, if you are really interested in brightness you should get a JIL with a FLuPIC (the Intelli, or one of goldserve's drop in mods for the DD), since that allows you to use RCR's for much greater brightness on burst mode while still offereing increased runtimes on the lower settings. I'll need to find a source of inexpensive CR2 primaries before I attempt anything like try to compare runtimes.

Click to expand...

I've noticed that I can't easily compare the brightness of my TW0H Intelli and TW0J (we think) FLuPIC mod. The beams are a bit different, probably due to different reflectors. I believe the original TW0J JIL's used a different reflector than the later TW0H versions. The Intelli has a wider hotspot and a bit more spill while the FLuPIC mod has a tighter hotspot and a bit better throw. I think the Intelli may be a bit brighter overall, but it's hard to tell. I suspect any difference in brightness is due to the variations within the T-bin rather than the different Vf.

My RCR2's just arrived in the mail today and I have a JIL-Cab (2xAA body). I haven't bothered to get any CR2 primaries yet, but since the JIL-Cab with two fresh alkaline AA's (3.0V) should be close to the voltage of a CR2 primary (3.0V), I can compare the 3.0V of 2xAA to the 4.2V of a fresh LiIon RCR2.

The JIL CR2 is usefully bright with 3.0V input and doesn't seem to heat up much. It is much brighter than any single 5mm LED light I own, including the 1xAAA 'chinese eBay clone' and the new "100% brighter" Photon Freedom microlight. It is much brighter than the Princeton Tec Attitude (a somewhat dim but long running 3 x 5mm LED light) and is somewhat brighter than a Princeton Tec Impact XL (an early Luxeon I side emitter). It isn't as bright as the "3 Watt" 2xAA lights from AXShop or the "7w Super Bright Waterproof USA, power 3.6v x 2 charge battery" lights from AXShop. I'd be happy to use the JIL at 3.0V for anything within 20 feet, but it doesn't light up my backyard.

With a fresh RCR2 at 4.2V, the JIL CR2 with FLuPIC in full brightness mode is extremely bright. It is brighter than the "3 Watt" 2xAA lights from AXShop. It is brighter than I'd want to use for close up work, but it lights up my backyard nicely with its wide hotspot. However it does get warm rather quickly. I believe the current is limited by the FLuPIC even in the full brightness mode with a 4.2Vfresh LiIon, but goldserve could clarify this.

Compared side by side, the 3.0V is not as bright as the 4.2V fresh LiIon, but the fresh LiIon doesn't really seem to be 5-10 times brighter (see cones graphs at http://www.cones-stuff.co.uk/). Perceptually, it seems to be two or three times brighter. To my inexperienced eye, it is like comparing a Luxeon I to a Luxeon III. This may not be a fair comparison for the JIL CR2 DD's performance on a 3.0V CR2 primary, since the JIL-Bus with 2xAA's isn't a CR2 primary.

Hope this helps answer your original question. I would expect the JIL CR2 DD with a 3.0V CR2 primary to be significantly brighter than a KeyMate with a Nichia 5mm LED. I would expect the JIL DD to compare with Luxeon I lights and be perfectly sufficient for indoor or close up work.

thanks for the observations... if my intelli would get out of customs i could be giving my report ... its been their for 3 days according to the tracking # i have from Warren

For what it's worth, I recently compared my DD TW0K and same light/reflector with FluPIC TW0H sandwich. TW0K had more noticeable emmitter lines in beam, but was whiter and very slightly brighter. Same RCR2 battery was used. I was placing tape over the lens for a smoother flood [hate emitter lines], sacrificing considerable brightness, however that appears unnecessary with the TW0H.