Why doesn't SF discontinue incandescent models?
- Thread starter dmz
- Start date
Help Support Candle Power Flashlight Forum
Delvance
Enlightened
Too many reasons...
Planterz
Flashlight Enthusiast
Because current LED technology cannot match the output of incandescents. Even the brightest, baddest LEDs with TIR optics can't out throw a simple 6P. And no matter how many Lux III or Vs you stick in a 3D magmod, you're not going to compete with a M3T or bigger.
chuck4570
Enlightened
LED's are not the doall of the lighting world!!!!
Chuck
Chuck
Protaeus
Enlightened
definately not! I'd say that the vast majority of Surefire sales would be based on their incandescent lights. Not to mention the fact that even their weaker 60 lumen incandescents (6P, G2, C2, E2E/D) are all brighter than most of the LEDs on offer.
No LED can match the output of the higher end millenium series. I am yet to see an LED torch light up my backyard like daylight.
LEDs have their advantages, but they certainly do not have the raw power and throw of the incandsecent.
No LED can match the output of the higher end millenium series. I am yet to see an LED torch light up my backyard like daylight.
LEDs have their advantages, but they certainly do not have the raw power and throw of the incandsecent.
Planterz
Flashlight Enthusiast
Not yet, anyway.:naughty:chuck4570 said:
rikvee
Enlightened
great thread title, works like a fox among the chickens, even in the Led forum! 
tattoou2
Enlightened
Although I love my LED lights, I'll take an Incan any ol' day when I need LIGHT.
Fusion_m8
Flashlight Enthusiast
Really? Have you seen the Elektro Lumens ELX-6??? 432 lumens...
http://elektrolumens.com/ELX-6/ELX-6.html
:rock:
http://elektrolumens.com/ELX-6/ELX-6.html
:rock:
Planterz said:
Grox
Flashlight Enthusiast
The elx-6 has 6 leds rather than 1 bulb. An M6 is smaller than a 3d mag and will easily crank out 500+ lumens. 2d mag mods can get you over 3000 lumens.
Incandescents (in general! please note these are tendencies rather than absolutes):
- have better colour rendition
- render depth better
- throw further (very big generalisation, this is a function of reflector and filament configuration)
- are relatively cheap at least bulb wise
- can be much brighter than LEDs
Incandescents (in general! please note these are tendencies rather than absolutes):
- have better colour rendition
- render depth better
- throw further (very big generalisation, this is a function of reflector and filament configuration)
- are relatively cheap at least bulb wise
- can be much brighter than LEDs
Last edited:
KevinL
Flashlight Enthusiast
Yeah but then you get monster incandescents breaking the 1000 lumen barrier in the 30-watt power class and 3K lumen barrier in the 100W power class.. 
It would be incorrect to say the high end of LEDs cannot match the low end of incandescents (the 6P *IS* wimpy, to those of us used to multi-hundred-lumen lights). But to say high end LEDs can compete with high end incandescents.. we still hope to get there some day, but it won't be today, or even next week, I figure.
Throw-wise I have seen some LED lights throw like they're never going to stop. I put a McLux PR-T head with DB917 driver and Lux3 TW0L on 2-cell power pack up against a Surefire P90 and P91 - advantage to the incan in terms of raw lumens - and at 300 yards, the PR-T can still be seen reflecting off the target with a faint white glow while even the P91 completely washes out by then.
And we haven't even gotten into the LionHead/ChameleHead for their respective lights.. LEDs do have Turboheads, you just have to buy the ones which support 'em
So..... tea or coffee?
... like the two drinks, LEDs and incandescents complement each other in this world.. it's not an either-or decision.
It would be incorrect to say the high end of LEDs cannot match the low end of incandescents (the 6P *IS* wimpy, to those of us used to multi-hundred-lumen lights). But to say high end LEDs can compete with high end incandescents.. we still hope to get there some day, but it won't be today, or even next week, I figure.
Throw-wise I have seen some LED lights throw like they're never going to stop. I put a McLux PR-T head with DB917 driver and Lux3 TW0L on 2-cell power pack up against a Surefire P90 and P91 - advantage to the incan in terms of raw lumens - and at 300 yards, the PR-T can still be seen reflecting off the target with a faint white glow while even the P91 completely washes out by then.
And we haven't even gotten into the LionHead/ChameleHead for their respective lights.. LEDs do have Turboheads, you just have to buy the ones which support 'em
So..... tea or coffee?
... like the two drinks, LEDs and incandescents complement each other in this world.. it's not an either-or decision.
cheapo
Flashlight Enthusiast
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2005
- Messages
- 3,326
find an LED light as bright as an SF M6........ i didnt think so. I never buy incands any more, LEDs are much more effecient, but if i needed something extremely bright, then i might buy an incand. Some say that incands are brighter than leds, and that is true, but when it comes to small lights like 1x123 and 2xcr123, leds are just as bright- fore example, HDS puts out 60 lumens, and there are no 1xcr123 incands that put out that much light, and the Surefire L2 stays right up there at the top in terms of the brightest 2xcr123 lights. But when it comes to larger lights, the incads will win because of the fact that current technology limits the brightness of LEDS.
-David
-David
Like most others said in this thread, LEDs are not yet developed to match the stunning brightness of an incandescent for tactical uses. It also has its disadvantages in certain environments and wont provide that large burst of light that an incandescent can more easily offer. An advantage to name for an incandescent would be its ability to cut through fog. When your in a foggy situation, I would choose a SureFire 6P over an L6.
NeoteriX
Newly Enlightened
Why Subaru no hatchback?
(sorry)
(sorry)Tech a Billy
Newly Enlightened
Protaeus said:
And I hate that.
dmz said:
Surefire does not develop LED's, they are a consumer of LED's. They are in no position to move the technology forward. Same thing with incandescents. Surefire uses available technology and creates products around it. LED's are still way behind in terms of raw output, and color rendering is poor due to the monochromatic nature of LED's. Incandescents are still "king". I do think LED lighting is disruptive technology and at some point in time, they will displace incandescents in many applications. I just don't see that in the near future. Until LED's overcome its shortcomings, incandescents will be always be around.
Last edited:
FirstDsent
Enlightened
This reminds me of the current trend in young gearheads. Punks with thier 4 cylinder Hondas and such spending oodles of money souping them up and saying stuff like "you can make a 4 cylinder car as fast as a V-8 car". However if you spend the same amount on a V-8, you'll smoke the 4-banger. Similarly, the baseline LED technology is lower output than common xenon products. Soup up an LED and you can outperform stock xenons. Soup up an incan and you'll still smoke the LED. 1000+ lumen hotwire mods are probably cheaper and more compact than 400 lumen LED mods...for now.
"The dominion of the incandescent lamp is growing dim. The day of the LED is coming". -ME
Bernie
"The dominion of the incandescent lamp is growing dim. The day of the LED is coming". -ME
Bernie
leukos
Flashlight Enthusiast
dmz said:
Why don't you ask them?
FirstDsent
Enlightened
Excellent point! 3Volt LEDs are vastly superior to 3V incans. LED's have nearly brought the power of the 6P to a true pocket light. Cheapo and I love our Amilites. My Golston 7W will out throw many 6V incans.
Benrie
