G2 out done by Brinkmann Maxfire WHAT?

I work security at a College at night and love to go to the gym to test out my lights. Too many lights outside and the gym is pretty much pitch black plus its pretty good sized. I've had my G2 for about three years now and have allways loved that light. It has the P60 bulb and UCL lense with fresh surefire 123 batteries in it. I recently bought a Brinkmann Maxfire just because it looked alot like the G2 and I wanted to see how it performed. I figured the Maxfire would do pretty well but would be blown away by the G2. I was wrong. The Maxfire had a brighter beam, brighter, wider spill beam, better throw and lit up the Coe College sign at the other end of the gym not a lot but a little bit more than the G2. Oh, I recently bought a replacement P60 bulb for the G2. Could I have got a faulty bulb? Or is the Maxfire really brighter than the G2? I figured the UCL would also help the performance on the G2 to make it a little bit brighter. I'm confused. Oh, I also checked out my new Streamlight pro poly lux and wow, that thing was allmost as bright as the G2 and Maxfire, in throw, but not spill beam. I was pretty impressed for a 1 watt LED. Any thoughts on why the Maxfire would be brighter than the G2? I even tried another set of batteries in the G2. Thanks

I doubt that the UCL will make a visible difference but I've not compared it side-by-side.

Perhaps you should put as many sets of batteries through the Maxfire as you do the G2 to see whether the bulb is designed to last as long or whether they are pushing it hard...

The Maxfire puts out something like 114-120 lumens. I don't remember exactly, but it was in that range. The P60 bulb puts out 65 lumens. To match the Maxfire you need to get the P61 bulb that puts out 120 lumens. Ironically, the P61 bulb cost more than the entire Maxfire flashlight.

"Ironically, the P61 bulb cost more than the entire Maxfire flashlight."-HonorKnight

Yeah, isn't that crazy. I have the P61 bulb but don't use it anymore because I also have my Surefire M3 on my duty belt. 114-120 lumens for the Maxfire, wow, I guess I was under the impression that it was around 50 or 60. I just checked out Flashlightreviews website and the brinkmann has a 4000 for throw and 6400 for overall output and G2 has 3534 for throw and 5200 for overall output. Crazy, and for $15 less than the G2. And I thought the G2 was supposed to be so special (since it is a surefire). I'll have to see the runtime on the Maxfire.

Aaron1100us,

You mentioned that you went to FLR and checked out the numbers already. Did you also have a look at the time to reach 50% output ? It takes 44 minutes for the maxfire to reach 50% while it takes the G2 54 minutes to reach 50%. Using this data, it would seem the bulb that comes with the maxfire draws more amps than the P60 lamp, meaning it is a more powerful bulb...which explains the high output of the maxfire, at the disadvantage of even shorter runtime than the P60 LA. Also, if the maxfire got 64.00 on Doug's lightbox, i really doubt that the light is over 100 output lumens. Considering the P60 LA rated at 65 output lumens measured 52.00 in the lightbox.

Hopefully that helps as to why the maxfire is brighter. Oh, and SF chooses to use a very "peeled" or "stippled" coating on their reflectors to smooth out the beams so as there are no artifacts. A less "bumpy" coating on a reflector will allow a light to throw further. I've not seen the maxfire reflector so can't comment on that one though.

Note: The 114-120 or so lumens of the Maxfire only refers to the center spot. The P61 lamp puts out more light over all.

HonorKnight said:

Note: The 114-120 or so lumens of the Maxfire only refers to the center spot.

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that's the most idiotic statement I have ever heard on CPF.

Delvance said:

Aaron1100us,

Also, if the maxfire got 64.00 on Doug's lightbox, i really doubt that the light is over 100 output lumens. Considering the P60 LA rated at 65 output lumens measured 52.00 in the lightbox.

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The P61 got a 70.00 in Doug's light box. Assuming the scale is linear and accurate:
P60: 52 = 65 Lumens
Max: 64 = X
P61: 70 = 120 Lumens

With a little math that puts the Maxfire at about 107 lumens. Of course, there is a bit of a fudge factor with Doug's readings(lux and lumens NOT being equal), so the exact amount could be a little more or a little less than that. Probably less.

Edited three typos. That gets to me for some reason. Added "Probably Less"

270winchester said:

that's the most idiotic statement I have ever heard on CPF.

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Sorry, I meant to refer to the Lux reading only measuring the center of the light and the equivilant lumen conversion.

270winchester, go easy on the newbs!

Lumens is a measurement of total output - it can not by definition be a point measurement. A figure in lumens takes into account all the output of a source - in all direction and includes biases towards certain parts of the visible spectrum.

edit: lux can not be accurately converted into lumens. yes it is possible to estimate but no real "conversion factor" exists.

Interesting, thanks for all the replies. Wow, around 107 lumens, never would have guessed. I must say that I'm quite pleased with the performance of the Maxfire. Awsome throw and very good spillbeam. Can't beat it for the price. Seems to be pretty durable too. I think I'm going to get a UCL and holster for it and place it right next to the G2 on my duty belt. There's nothing wrong with having 6 lights on my duty belt is there

270winchester said:

that's the most idiotic statement I have ever heard on CPF.

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Also, If I or someone makes a mistake, or speaks out of confusion or ignorance, wouldn't a nice gentle correction be nice? Words like "idiotic" or "stupid" can be very offensive.

1. Watch the personal attacks; they WILL NOT be tolerated...

2. Surefire doesn't always equal the best or brightest. A light is only as good as its power source, and with two lithium cells, you can only get so much light. The Maxfire pushes the bulb harder than a P60, and the Maxfire is more focused, which gives more throw. No bulb can push 100+ lumens and still have a one hour burn time.

I like the Maxfire much better than the 1st generation MaxfireLX. The only drawback to the Maxfire is the lack of bulbs; they are not readily available.

--dan

HonorKnight said:

Also, If I or someone makes a mistake, or speaks out of confusion or ignorance, wouldn't a nice gentle correction be nice? Words like "idiotic" or "stupid" can be very offensive.

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i hope you won't let that outburst get to you too much. that's by and large not the general demeanor of this forum, and i feel ashamed whenever these outbursts happen. i found this thread quite informative, and at any rate, we are all still noobs at one thing or another--if not flashlights, then something else. give what you can, take what you need. for tomorrow is another day.

dano said:

I like the Maxfire much better than the 1st generation MaxfireLX. The only drawback to the Maxfire is the lack of bulbs; they are not readily available.

--dan

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I actually like LED lights so you don't have to replace the bulbs. But considering the $17 price on the Maxfire at Target, when the light bulb goes and you can't find a new one, you might as well just buy a whole new light. You get a new bulb and new batteries.

And lets get this thread back on topic - if anyone has anything further to say regarding 270winchester's comment you are welcome to contact myself or other CPF Staff by PM or email.

Thanks

Al

P.S.
On topic: It appears then that the runtime is shorter to increase the output. Seems reasonable. It would also be appropriate to mention that SureFire's lumen ratings are not peak/maximum ratings, and are based on the light coming out of the flashlight whilst being powered by the flashlight.
Therefore I would use Doug's reads only when comparing one brand with another since Doug has used the same method to collect his data each time.

Size15's said:

It would also be appropriate to mention that SureFire's lumen ratings are not peak/maximum ratings, and are based on the light coming out of the flashlight whilst being powered by the flashlight.
Therefore I would use Doug's reads only when comparing one brand with another since Doug has used the same method to collect his data each time.

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Very true. Surefire's ratings have always been on the conservative side while most other brands use the highest number they can fudge.

Though I haven't tried one, the Maxfire looks like a pretty nice light, and a good bargain to boot.

I chose the G2 for a few reasons:

1. I wanted my first Surefire! It really is nice--feels like high quality.

2. Surefire bulbs are expensive, but they are known to be durable and have good life. The beam is darn nice as well.

3. Runtime is fairly balanced. It doesn't trade ultimate brightness for dismal runtime, or vice-versa.
In fact, I wish I could use the low output assembly from the E2, since I generally could do fine with fewer lumens.

What an addiction!

Bob

I seriously doubt the Maxfire is 107 lumens. If you go back a couple years in the archives, all this stuff has been hashed out, BUT, doing a search for it is tough.

The difference between 107 and 120 is about 11%, and remembering that it takes almost twice as much light to see a noticeable difference, the difference between the standard lamp and the P61 would barely be noticeable.

But the truth is, there is a significant difference betweent the two.

There is also a difference between the P60 and the Maxfire, but with my versions, at least, the difference is much less.

My best estimate would be that the Maxfire puts 80-90 lumens out the front.

If you assume (I know, thats a big problem), that the lamps are roughly equal in efficiency, then the 54 minute to half brightness, 44 minute to half brightness, and the roughly 16 minute to half brightness of the P61 gives you a clue.

Once again, assuming linear characteristics, (they aren't actually linear) then the Maxfire is running more than twice as long as the P61 to half brightness, while only putting out 11% less light. That's a HUGE improvement in efficiency.

Much more likely that it is in the 80 lumen range.

Bill