My Lambda Hydra XP4 -- First Tests

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Enrolling the dogs in Seeing Eye School - $17,000

One pair of Stevie Wonder glasses - $360

Blinded by your very own Lambda Hydra XP4 - priceless


Well, I got it in the mail yesterday and in between packing and addressing and mailing tailcap switches and running around catching up on the wife's honey-do's plus getting set to attend my daughter's end-of-school program, I managed to actually get some testing done.

I ran it through my MeterMan® LM631 light meter and did both direct beam measurement and reflected light from the ceiling. And each test was duplicated against ElektroLumens' DirectDrive 2D/3C Blaster mod, which is incredibly bright in its own right.

The Hydra is on the right:

HydraBlast-1.jpg


There is actually not much green in the beams themselves, neither the Hydra nor the Blaster. It's just how my camera picked up the light coloring -- could be the green fabric of the La-Z-Boy I have the lights resting on!

At extremely close range (we're talking a ½-inch here) there is a seemingly slightly larger spot from the single LS Blaster as opposed to four smaller ones from the Hydra, but upon closer inspection you will notice the LS in the Blaster is set down further into the bottom of the reflector, while the Hydra's four LS leds are right against the front lens. Thus the Hydra's leds are only that ½-inch away but the ElektroLumens' single LS is actually another ¾-inch further back:

HydraBlast-CU.jpg


But never mind the beamshots, what everyone really wants to know is, "How bright is it?"

To the naked eye, shining it around through the trees in the dark valley behind my house, it seems about twice as bright as the Blaster, perhaps even slightly less. But it is clearly brighter.

But how bright? Come with me now as we sally forth to the light meter...

Comparison Method 1: shine each light directly onto the sensor disk from a measured twelve inches away. No angle of deviation, no nothing. Straight dead-on, we want to burn out the eye of the meter if we can. The "Peak Hold" setting is used, meaning the absolute brightest reading is held onto, even if the flashlight moves around so that a dimmer portion of the beam hits the sensor. The reading only changes if a brighter part of the beam bumps the reading upward.

The ElektroLumens Blaster registered a Peak Lux reading of - 3,680

The Lambda Hydra XP4 registered a Peak Lux reading of - 7,270

So the Hydra is about twice as bright, despite having four times as many leds.

But this is up close, with the beam hitting the sensor squarely. What if those four LS beams are giving the Hydra an advantage? What about those scientific labs where they have an Integrating Sphere which captures and measures ALL the light emitted by a certain device? Certainly that is a more accurate comparison, and few would doubt such a premise.

But I do not have access to such a sphere.

I do, however, have access to an...Integrating Ceiling!

That's right folks, in MR Bulk's™ warped and twisted mind, I figured that light cast from a fixed distance upon a flat white surface, and pointed at the same spot on that surface, and the reflection from which is then measured by a light meter also at a fixed distance, would gain fair, comparable, and repeatable measurements in order to put up a couple of lights against each other.

Comparison Method 2: and so it was into my pitch black testing (and sometimes laundry) room, slide the door shut, turn on the MeterMan light meter, set it to the "lux" reading calculated out to one-tenth lux for greater accuracy since we would be measuring much dimmer reflected light, place the sensor face up on the washing machine (we are a highly respected scientific facility here at the MR Bulk™ Institute of Flashlightology), and, utilizing our high-tech Integrating Ceiling, I hold up and turn on each light one at a time next to my ear, with each lens perfectly level with the top of my head, and each light aimed at the exact same spot on the flat white ceiling.

Results:

Blaster - 6.3 peak lux

Hydra - 11.7 peak lux

So it is still about double the output.

I like this custom-made $200+ light. Not only is it one of just a very few in existence, and not only does it represent, at least at this brief splitsecond moment in LED flashlight history, the absolute brightest handheld LED flashlight in the world...it also is gonna make one helluva good whackin' tool -- as I may have the opportunity to find out as early as tonight, when I return to work...

Thanks Kevin, you Da Man.
 

Zephyr

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Mr Bulk,


How much did it really cost you to get the Hydra XP4? So that just in case it will be made available for us, I can save up for it already. I want one so bad too! Thanks so much!

ZEPH
smile.gif
 
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Zephyr:
Mr Bulk,


How much did it really cost you to get the Hydra XP4? So that just in case it will be made available for us, I can save up for it already. I want one so bad too! Thanks so much!

ZEPH
smile.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Hay Zeph,

See the completed test above. The price is mentioned in there.
 

Alan

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Mr. Bulk, how does it compare with incandescent, say an E2. Would it be possible that it might be able to beat an e2 in close range like 20'?

Alan
 

rlhess

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Hey, Mr. Bulk,

It would be useful for you to shine the light at the lux meter from a distance of one meter OR to the footcandle meter from a distance of 3 feet.

Pick the highest reading. If footcandle, multiply by 9. If lux, just supply it. Magically, that will give you Center Beam Candlepower (in candela) and you'll be able to compare the light to the measurements that I just posted.

Also, you might want to measure at 5 degrees off axis--same distance, same math.

I don't think you're getting the full effect of the beam at 1 foot. I think your calculated candela will be higher at 1m.

By the way, adjusting for the distance (multiplying by 0.092903) we get
Blaster 342 cd
Hydra 675 cd

These are indeed impressive, but I think the measurements at one meter will be even more impressive!

Wow 675 cd (and a WIDE BEAM) from an LED flashlight! (The illuminator measures out at 200 cd in my tests).

Thanks!

Richard

(trying to bring some order to the measurement of flashlights)
 

txwest

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Mr Bulk,
I got the Lamdba focusable LS Mag today. BTW, I would like to say something about our Postal Department here, but instead, when I'm through with this post, I'll start a new thread in Cafe. Any way, the Lambda mag is a nice LS light if you want a tight beam. You're very limited to changeing the focus because of the Mag Blackhole. Now Wayne's Direct Drive kicks Mag Blackhole Butt!!! When I got Wayne's DD, it had a LOT of WOW factor. I had to send it back for adjustments, but am really looking forward to getting it back.

I'm sure it doesn't compare to the XP4, but hey...1 LS vrs. 4 LS's...Who'ld have thunk it!! Plus, you have the problem of very limited production on the XP4. I was seriously considering a Double Blaster, but now think I'll wait & see how the 5W LS works out. Anyway, I think Lambda's lights are great, but for now, IMHO, Wayne...You De Man!!!
 
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Richard,

Just did the one meter thing (39.37 inches?), both lights loaded with fresh alkalines, and peak lux for Blaster was 507 vs. 984 for Hydra...
 
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Wow, I just measured several other lights at one meter, and quickly realized that there's nothing like a tight beamed incandescent to put things into perspective (all readings are peak lux from straight on):

SF G2 - 5100

SL PolyStinger (at tightest focus) - 5500

SL UltraStinger ( " " " ) - OVERLOADED the meter, last visible reading was 1999 at the x10 setting (it is rated at 75,000 cp after all).

Obviously for an LED to eventually compete in long throw events, someone really needs to get hold of one of them "side emitter" 5-watt Luxeons and chuck it into a focusing head. But give me an LED every time for up close or wide beam purposes. Not only do they offer more accurate color rendering, they also provide more usable overall light in the most commonly used applications.
 

lambda

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by txwest:
Mr Bulk,
I got the Lamdba focusable LS Mag today. BTW, I would like to say something about our Postal Department here, but instead, when I'm through with this post, I'll start a new thread in Cafe. Any way, the Lambda mag is a nice LS light if you want a tight beam. You're very limited to changeing the focus because of the Mag Blackhole. Now Wayne's Direct Drive kicks Mag Blackhole Butt!!! When I got Wayne's DD, it had a LOT of WOW factor. I had to send it back for adjustments, but am really looking forward to getting it back.

I'm sure it doesn't compare to the XP4, but hey...1 LS vrs. 4 LS's...Who'ld have thunk it!! Plus, you have the problem of very limited production on the XP4. I was seriously considering a Double Blaster, but now think I'll wait & see how the 5W LS works out. Anyway, I think Lambda's lights are great, but for now, IMHO, Wayne...You De Man!!!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Txwest,

The Mag you've got will measure several times brighter on a light meter than even the Hydra. Light meters measure "how bright is it?", not "how much light is being produced at that bightness". Think about a 40W flourescent tube and an LED flash light. You can get a higher reading from any LED flashlight, but which "lights up" the room more? While the flourescent tube may not be as "bright", it is producing a lot more light. So, as far as light meter readings go, you've got the brightest flashlight!

Yes, using the reflector to focus the Luxeon doesn't make it not be a MagLite unfortunately. But the good news is if you don't like the little bright Mag spot, it's real easy to just epoxy a Luxeon lens on it, and will be a whole new light!
 

rlhess

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Mr. Bulk,

Wow...there is a big difference between 1 foot (converted) and 1 meter. For something as complex as the Hydra, I think 1 meter (yes 39.37 in) is a good choice. For the Ultrastinger, try FC (rather than Lux) and go to 10 feet. Multiply the reading by 100 to get candelas.

You actually got candelas when you did lux at 1 meter so this compares very favorably in output to the E2e which is about 1300 candela--and a broad beam. All from a 60 lumen lamp.

I suspect that the Hydra will provide MORE illumination than the E2e (more lumen output, i.e. over a wider range) AND with the 3D, based on Lambda's 3C run times, I suspect you'll get 3 hours of continuous burn and more (I don't know how much more) on intermittant usage.

I'm not sure I want to crunch the math, but we could approximate the lumen output by measuring every five degrees until the output goes to 5% of peak.

I THINK I've finally gotten my head around the basic math--hadn't thought much about it for ten years.

Cheers,

Richard
 

TripleDouble

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I recall lumidrives having a 6 degree optic, so maybe two of those could help balance the beam for farther throw. Unfortunately, their web site currently only mentions 10 and 45 degrees as standardly available. Maybe we need to tackle lens technology, and have one luxeon sitting behind a lens. Lamda, do you think theres any space for a lens in front for an optic, or does the optic already cram right up against the mag lens?
 
D

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Tx,

Glad to hear you got that thing. Hopefully it fulfills the purpose for which you intended.

rlhess,

I think I know what you mean -- if there were a way to capture every photon of light from the Hydra, and do the same for the E2, Blaster, etc., we'd get the real comparison picture. Where's the nearest integrating sphere to Hawaii?

I plan to get a constant-on run time test done on the 3D Hydra pretty soon, probably when I get done with my work week (Monday night), and then I'll report results here. But I think I'm already in over my head when talk starts going into angle of deviation, etc. Would shining a light at the sensor from an angle produce some kind of measurable and more meaningful reading?

TripDub,

It's probably only in the way Lambda contructed this particular Hydra (then again, maybe that's the only way four Luxeons would fit), but the front lens is actually touching the fronts of the four Luxeons. If I were to unscrew the bezel, I'd first have to apply pressure to the lens before turning the bezel, so that the lens wouldn't turn with it and possibly scratch the Luxeons as well as the MagLite lens itself.
 

rlhess

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Hi, Mr. Bulk,

The measurements at five degree increments, figuring the area of each ring, figuring the lumens in each ring and summing is an approximation.

It is an interesting exercise...but I think it might take a couple of hours to do the spreadsheet into which you plug the numbers....

Bottom line...how does this compare to other known lights. It is the brightest LED flashlight and if CRI is important, that is a great help over incandescent.

Of course for $1300 one can get a pulsed xenon arc...
 

txwest

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lambda:
Yes, using the reflector to focus the Luxeon doesn't make it not be a MagLite unfortunately. But the good news is if you don't like the little bright Mag spot, it's real easy to just epoxy a Luxeon lens on it, and will be a whole new light!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I tried it again after my eyes were dark adapted & have a different opinion. I think your light & Wayne's DirDrive will compliment each other. I do wish yours was a DD, as I like to run them on rechargeables. TX
 

hotfoot

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Can you say, \"Durian\"?
This may help explain why the Hydra is "only" twice as bright as the Blaster, despite having 4x the LEDS.

Actually, this is quite consistent with some basic theories about lighting. Namely, you need to have 4times the power before you get twice the amount of light (at least, in terms of perceived scene brightness)

So there, the meter readings actually do bear testament to this theory. Can someone clarify this if I'm wrong?
 

The_LED_Museum

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hotfoot:
This may help explain why the Hydra is "only" twice as bright as the Blaster, despite having 4x the LEDS.

So there, the meter readings actually do bear testament to this theory. Can someone clarify this if I'm wrong?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just got my Hydra (Thanks Kevin!!!), and after my eyeballs stopped swelling up, I metered it and Elektrolumens's ElektroBlaster after loading each with brand spanking new batteries. The meter is set for foot-candles X1000 so it won't "OL" on these bright things.

From 2 feet (Move decimal over 3 spaces and multiply resulting reading by 4x to obtain these figures):
Lambda's Hydra: 972 cd
ElektroBlaster: 456 cd


From 1 foot (Move decimal over 3 spaces and read directly off meter face):
Lambda's Hydra: 644 cd
ElektroBlaster: 320 cd


The difference between the 2' and 1' readings, I believe, is because the light does NOT drop off by the inverse square because it's in the form of a fairly tightly collimated beam. A theoretically perfect point source WOULD fall off by the inverse square, and the 2' and 1' measurements (after doing the appropriate math) would then be identical to one another.

For the purposes of these short-range illuminance tests, I'd use the 1' reading; as that is standard with illuminance measurements in FC, and print that as gospel.

But notice that like everybody else's measurements, the 4-LED Hydra is "only" approximately twice as bright as the 1-LED ElektroBlaster, and it's that way with both the 2' and 1' readings.

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the primary reason this is so is that the "C" cells are delivering their absolute maximum current in the Hydra, and simply cannot deliver a single microjoule more. That simply means the four individual LEDs in the Hydra are not being driven as hard as the single LED in the Blaster. If they were, the Hydra should be approximately 4x as bright as the Blaster, all things considered.

Now let's try something completely different: My Hydra was supplied with both the setup for 3 "C" cells (specially-sized spring, PVC toilet pipe, and washer) *and* the setup for 2 "D" cells (standard Mag spring). So let's see what happens when I load it with the D's... (tinker, tinker, tinker...)

Ok, with 2 brand new "D" cells, I'm reading 563cd from 1'. That's almost as bright as 3 "C"s, and I suspect a much greater run-time is the main benefit of this setup. I wonder if the Hydra would get smoked if I tried to rig it to run on 3 "D" cells. Please Lambda, say something before I let out all the magic smoke and ruin your wonderful creation! :)

Now to the subjective part. The Hydra just SMOKES the Elektroblaster when you simply shine the two on a wall and compare them. This is surprisingly a lot like how the meter saw things. And since flashights were meant to be used by the human eye, what better comparative analysis tool can you find than a good old fashioned set of Mark VII eyeballs?

When directing the spot at something, the Hydra clearly outpowers the Blaster. It has a slightly narrower and bluer "hot spot".
A better test for overall luminous output is ye olde "Bathroom Ceiling Test". That is, stand up in a small, dark room and alternately shine each light at the same spot on the ceiling and observe some pile of crap on the floor. The Hydra again wins this one, and it really does appear approximately twice as bright, and its light has a slightly violetish tint when compared to the Blaster.

It's safe to say that the Hydra is the all-time BRIGHTEST LED flashlight I've ever seen. I'm going to go out and shoot some pigeons with it. I'm tired of them crapping all over our entryway (and on us as we leave & reenter our building). The Hydra just might be bright enough to spook them away temporarily. :)
 

rlhess

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Hi, Craig,

I think that the 2-foot measurements are better, but in fact, I'm starting to think that the 10-foot measurements are even better for larger lights.

What happens at close distances is that the beam is not fully formed or something like that. It's discussed in the IES handbook if I recall correctly. If you do 2-feet to 10-feet you do get proper inverse square law matching on the smaller lights.

I did not quite get it with the SL6 at 2 feet (divide by 4). I got a higher reading at 10 feet (divide by 100).

I think if you do tests at 1 2 3 5 10 and 20 and multiply by 1 4 9 25 100 and 400 you'll find that the longer distances provide HIGHER numbers.

I'd be curious how much something like the LC100 changes and at what distance it starts to even out into inverse square law.

Cheers,

Richard
 

BugLightGeek

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by txwest:
Now Wayne's Direct Drive kicks Mag Blackhole Butt!!! When I got Wayne's DD, it had a LOT of WOW factor. I had to send it back for adjustments, but am really looking forward to getting it back.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just purchased one of Wayne's DD 3D Blasters and was curious what types of adjustments you had to have done one it???
 
D

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Hi Craig,

Youre Hydra is a little more than twice as bright as your Blaster, but mine (with 3D cells, mind you) is slightly LESS than twice as bright as MY Blaster. And Kev said my 3D setup is supposed to be anywhere from 5%-15% brighter than your 3C Hydra setup. Wonder whassup with that? Could it be my ElCheapo LightMan light meter is just not as accurate as the Pro Metric? But I did all the same things -- close up (1 foot) testing, 1 meter testing, and the Integrating Ceiling (like your bathroom ceiling) test as well. Except I did it all using the "lux" unit setting, but still, proportionally it should be the same, right? Hmmm...

Your best guess? Anybody?
 
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