STILL NEED HELP!!! HELP

seeker407

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May 27, 2006
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Utah
Okay orignally i wanted a Surefire 6p with a KL5 (5 watt LED) upgrade. I wanted to go LED cause it claimed an hour of 100 lumen light ( http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main.../1168/sesent/00 ), and then 3 hours of "usefull" light. However, when I was researching I found that a lot of companies advertised only 65 lumens for an hour then 3 hours of "useful" light for the exact same product... WHATS THE DEAL? I sent them an e-mail, but nothing so far...

Then I found a company called Wolf Eyes. They offer the 9TX Raider, which is really neat and has a non LED bulb but provides a claimed 200 lumens of power from the main lamp, and 5 lumens from the rear bulb (it has two lights in one, check it out http://www.tactical-flashlights-sto...9TX-Raider.html )... But I really want the LED for the main light (not incandescent) cause I might drop it or something and i dont want a bulb to burn out cause of that...

SOOOOOO my questions:
has ANYONE used the KL5 upgrade for Surefire 6p?
if so, is it really 100 lumens for a whole hour?
Has anyone used the Wolf Eyes 9TX raider?
If so, does it really give off 200 lumens?
If so, how easy does the bulb burn out (how many times could i bash someones head in before the bulb doesn't work?)

And also I heard that surefire 6p isnt water proof? whats up with that? tacticle flashlights that aren't water proof?!?!?! is this true?!?!?

I know i wrote a lot so ill stop here... thanks in advance
 

offroadcmpr

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Feb 3, 2005
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CA
I belive that surefire said that all of their lights are waterproof to 33 feet. The KL5 on a 6p is more or less a larger version of the L4 if I remember right. I belive that the L4 does get around an hour of battery life, so I'm assuming the KL5 is the same.

Surefire recently updated their specs on their LED lights giving the KL5 a 100 lumen output instead of a 65 lumen output. The websites that have the 65 lumen output have not updated their site in a while. There was a thread a while back that explained it, but the search function crapped out on me.

Size15's is the surefire expert around here and may be able to give more info on the surefires. Paul in Maryland seems to know a lot about the wolf eyes.
 

seeker407

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May 27, 2006
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Utah
Thanks a lot sir, I will try to find this Size15 and Pault in Marland. do you know anything about wolf eyes?
 

CroMAGnet

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Sep 4, 2004
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Los Gatos, CA
Welcome to CPF seeker!! Hope you stay a while.

Welcome.gif


I don't have any Surefire lights yet but I have my first one on order. The new Kroma Mil-spec :)

You might want to adjust the title of your post if you want more feedback. With the amount of postings lately it's hard to keep up. :)

Try something with Surefire in the title etc.

:wave:
 

seeker407

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May 27, 2006
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Utah
lol the funniest thing is that I actually tried that, but no one really responded... (see the "Surefire - KL5 help!" thread) anyways well thanks for the welcome... still trying to find out if anyone has used wolf eyes, or the KL5 upgrade on a 6p...
 

InfidelCastro

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offroadcmpr said:
Surefire recently updated their specs on their LED lights giving the KL5 a 100 lumen output instead of a 65 lumen output. The websites that have the 65 lumen output have not updated their site in a while. There was a thread a while back that explained it, but the search function crapped out on me.

Size15's is the surefire expert around here and may be able to give more info on the surefires. Paul in Maryland seems to know a lot about the wolf eyes.



Did they actually get brighter, or have they started fibbing like everyone else?
 

Size15's

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Aug 29, 2000
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Kettering, England
SureFire designs many of its products (including the 6P) to be capable of being rated waterproof - SureFire do this by testing individual products which are then given the suffix "N" (for Navy) (for example 6PN). When you purchase a SureFire with an "N" you know it has been tested and SureFire are satisfied that it will be waterproof to 33 metres (100ft). Disassembly will invalidate this "N Certification" and care should be taken when changing the batteries that the o-rings and threads are clean, undamaged and correctly lubricated.

If you are worried about whether a 6P or 6P+KL5 will be waterproof when you get them wet or drop them in a swimming pool etc then you need not be worried unless you have not cared to the o-rings etc.

My take on lumen ratings: 65 vs 100.
Any product rating is indicative - typical of production rather than an absolute. In most cases it is maximum rather than a minimum. SureFire have a reputation for understating the lumen outputs of its products compared to the ratings given by other manufacturers.
Specific individual products will likely vary from the product rating. We know that there is quite a lot of variation when it comes to the output of an LED compared to the next.
Unless you have a means of measuring the lumen output the rating is an indication of the amount of light produced. Either it will be enough, or not.
What it is 'rated' at makes no difference to whether or not it is right for the task.
So my point of view is: Don't get hung up on ratings. Do not attempt to compare the ratings of different flashlight manufacturers. Do not attempt to compare the ratings of incandescent, LED and HID light sources.

The same goes for runtimes. There are so many variables. A runtime rating is an indication rather than an absolute. From what I can tell the KL5 output is regulated for a good hour when powered by two-SF123A batteries.

SureFire revised the lumen output of some of its models (including the KL5 / L5). When they first tested some of their products they appeared to have used an integrating sphere set up for incandscent light rather than LED light which meant the rating was lower than it should have been.
There has been no change in production, just a more accurate means of measuring the output.

From my perspective the L5 (or any suitable two-SF123A SureFire with the KL5 bezel attached) will have a regulated output rated at 100 lumens for at least one-hour from two-SF123A batteries. The flashlight will be waterproof for my uses which may include at some point taking it in a swimming pool or the sea.

But what is the point in knowing all that when it may not be suitable for what I want/need it for? The best place to start is to indentify the need and situation and work from there to shortlist a number of flashlights that may be suitable. Important considerations include: How will you carry the flashlight? What will you be illuminating, under what conditions, and why? How long will you be needing light without having access to replacement batteries or a charger etc? Is size/weight/ergonomics an important factor? Is the price or the running cost an important factor?

Perhaps if you can answer some of these questions we can help select flashlights that you can concentrate on for your search for user information etc?

Best regards,
Al
 

seeker407

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May 27, 2006
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Hey! thanks for the indepth response... I guess this is my problem. I have a lot of "store brand" flash lights (they dont even have a lumen rating) and they are bright enough to do simple jobs. But I want a light that I can just use anywhere i go. That could be skydiving into combat zone (im going into the military) or going underwater. It could be going with days without resupply.

I also have read a lot about the LED technology. and about how they are really impact resistant, and dont need to be replaced ever. And plus, they are extremly efficent. But then i read about the incand. bulbs and, i see some who have a rating of 200 lumens... but i know that right when i need the light the most, the incad. bulb will burn out. SO i guess if i had to describe the flash light i want, it would be something like this:

1. impact resistant/life hours
2. brightness
3. battery effiencey
4. weight
5. looks

so does this make sense? if yall have any ideas, hit me up... I really just want a really bright white light. and I dont want to have to worry about the bulb going out. SO i guess what im trying to say, where can i find a bright LED light? or where can i find a bulb that wont "burn out" and is still bright? thanks

-Taylor
 
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