caution(retracted) for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

..........Note to CPF'rs from member " TooManyGizmos "

..... Concerning.....Bushnell 3-Watt L.E.D. Light with " Find Me , Glowing "B" tail cap ".

........ I have news about the functions of my light . (IMHO )

This (is)(EDIT: was-NOW Retracted ) a PERSONAL Cautionary WARNING from me - NOT from the Bushnell Co.

At first .... The glowing " B " Tail cap " Find Me " feature seems real neat .

But there May be a ( possible ) FLAW in the design .

If it's your intention to buy this light and leave it on your night-stand , always glowing so you can find it , FORGET IT !

If left permanently in the glowing tailcap mode - it may run down a couple of new batteries in just a few days - being useless when you need it ! and may be HAZARDOUS !

I had FULLY charged ( to 4.19v ) Tenergy 3.0v rechargeables in mine on the night-stand - didn't use it at all for a couple days. ( I promise you - no one in the household had used it - and NO ..... it was NOT left ON and burning till dead .) (its just me & the flashaholic wife here)

Next thing I know , I noticed the tail-cap was NOT glowing any more. Dead .... and wouldn't turn on . So I took the batteries out and tested them - one of them had been run down till the protection circuit kicked in . It measured 0.00v on the DMM. The other one tested 2.76v. (not good)

This constant drain might be HAZARDOUS when using Primary CR123A batteries - due to the latest episodes we have been told about of 2-cell lights EXPLODING AND VENTING W/ FLAME . This " glow " feature might drain the cells un-evenly and lead to reverse charging of one .
EVERYONE NEEDS TO BE AWARE OF THIS AND EXERCISE CAUTION !

EDIT : paragraph removed - my opinion only , unproven.

You should turn this light OFF by clicking the tail switch - or you may have DEAD batteries . Using JUST the head for turning it ON & OFF as a normal practice , shouldn't be done with this light .

EDIT : removed paragraph , comparison to PAL iights

I'm very sorry to have to report this , but that is the way mine is working . I WANT EVERYONE TO KNOW THIS BEFORE YOU BUY THIS LIGHT . edit:removed last sentence-(unproven)

Tell ya more ......... if and when I discover more ..... TooManyGizmos .

EDIT : AS OF 7/18/2006 , I have retracted my Cautionary warning on this light -as I have been UN-SUCCESFUL in recreating the first two total failures , using the very same batteries(6) in my testing . I do , however , see continual minimal draining of the batteries if the *find me* feature is left ON .

.

Re: caution RETRACTED for Bushnell 3W LED"Find Me "B" tail cap"

....

.... I am presently trying to re-create this failure to validate my claim . Using a completely different set of Re-chargeable 3.0v Tenergy cells .

EDIT : AS OF 7/18/2006 , I have retracted my Cautionary warning on this light -as I have been UN-SUCCESFUL in recreating the first two total failures , using the very same batteries(6) in my testing . I do , however , see continual minimal draining of the batteries if the *find me* feature is left ON .



Someone else needs to also pay attention and look for this rapid battery drain - and please report to us .

Has anyone else noticed any operational difficulties ?

Check your lights - and TEST the voltage reading on your batteries - this could be very bad on Primary CR123A cells !

I'll report results as soon as I can ..... Anyone else ??

TMG

.

Re: WARNING for Bushnell 3W LED"Find Me "B" tail cap"

I've found that the circuits in protected cells constantly use power too, so you may have 2 sources trickling power away.

Can you hook up a multimeter and find how many mA the drain is?

Re: WARNING for Bushnell 3W LED"Find Me "B" tail cap"

chevrofreak said:

I've found that the circuits in protected cells constantly use power too, so you may have 2 sources trickling power away.

Click to expand...

What? With protection circuits, do they still have a lower self discharge rage than NiMH cells? By much?

TooManyGizmos, thanks for the information.

Re: WARNING for Bushnell 3W LED"Find Me "B" tail cap"

don't rechargeables loose their charge over time? as has been advised in another post on this forum to swap rechargeables left in flashlight even if unused every 2 weeks or so. i doubt u will recreate this problem with primaries.

Re: WARNING for Bushnell 3W LED"Find Me "B" tail cap"

eebowler said:

What? With protection circuits, do they still have a lower self discharge rage than NiMH cells? By much?

TooManyGizmos, thanks for the information.

Click to expand...

I have a particular RCR123 that self-discharges much faster than its brother, so the only cause I can think of is the circuit. On protected cells both the positive and negative ends are connected to a circuit board, so there must be some current being used at all times.

Re: WARNING for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"



..... Chevrofreak :

Rechargeables may indeed loose a very slight amount of charge over a period months ( nothing like NiMh tho ) but mine maintain charge very well.

I get very concerned when they loose their charge over a matter of DAYS .... And one goes to 0.00v .


My first reaction was to suspect the constant glowing tail-cap as a battery drainer .

... Something caused 2 sets of 3.0v rechargeables to go dead in my light . Can't even rule- out defective batt's at this point so I'm checking for that too .

I am still doing further testing to find out what . No facts to report yet .

When mine went dead - along with having the "find me" cap glowing - I also had the rotating head of the light set in between detent positions. It was half way between strobe and off-detent , not burning .

Not sure yet - maybe leaving the head in-between detent positions could cause a drain on the batteries more than the glowing cap , even tho the light is not burning ?

I'm testing Re-chargeables AND Primaries - With the rotating head set to various positions of " OFF " , while the light is seeing NO activity of turn-on or use other than leaving the "find me" feature constantly *Glowing* .

I don't know what caused it YET - I just wanted members to know it happened ....... Twice .

So ALSO be cautious of the half-detent positions until we make sure it's not a problem causing drain on the batteries .

I do like the light - I just want to understand it better , & being cautious of a new product .

Later ................. TMG .

Re: WARNING for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

I've had my tail cap green light on for 24 hours so far with Titanium lithiums. I did use the light for some beam comparisons before I left the tail light on so the batteries weren't totally fresh. Probably about 5-10 minutes of run time on high. I just pulled the batts out and checked the voltage and both show 2.93 volts on my multimeter. Fresh batts show 3.09.

Sorry I didn't start with totally fresh batts so I'm not sure how much if any drain, but it doesn't appear to be too dramatic in 24 hours.

Re: CAUTION for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

Green "find me" light on for 48 hours now. Voltage still 2.93 on both batteries.

Re: CAUTION for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

I have two of them and they have been on since Friday 7/14/06 at 10:00 PM. Just like the Eveready bunny. No problems here.

Re: CAUTION for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

Chevrofreak,

As far as protection electronics, typical protection circuits will draw in the neighborhood of 5 to 10 millionths of an amp. That is 0.000008 Amps. Some of them draw a little more when they are in an overvoltage protection state, at 0.000025 Amps.

This would amount to the electronics depleting a 2400mAH cell in 13,020 days, or 35.6 years.

I have a few R123 cells, and I have removed the electronics on one of them that depletes itself pretty quickly, and it is the cell that is causing the issue.

An example of one of the older protection chips from the 2000 timeframe (some of the newer ones consume considerably less current):

http://focus.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/ucc3952-1.pdf

Re: caution RETRACTED for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

:shrug:
.:tinfoil:

,,,, EDIT : AS OF 7/18/2006 , I have retracted my Cautionary warning on this light -as I have been UN-SUCCESFUL in recreating the first two total failures , using the very same batteries(6) in my testing . I do , however , see continual minimal draining of the batteries if the *find me* feature is left ON .

I will post my continual battery drain test results , later .

Re: caution RETRACTED for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

No harm done, TMG! Personally, I thank you for getting the warning out there even if it didn't prove out. We have seen enough times on CPF about dangers of some multi-cell primary failures. I would always rather be safe. Doubt if I want to use the "find me" feature on a continuous basis anyway.
:goodjob:

Re: caution RETRACTED for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"

..
..... Results of battery drain tests on *Long* Bushnell 3-W Model ( 2-cell )

..... With only the *glowing tail-cap* in constant use ........ ( main LED not used at all )

I did 4 test runs , using 8 seperate batteries .

These are the results I got on my Bushnell 3-W

Average open voltage reading on each cell / for time period in use
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Starting voltage ............ 4.14v

after 5 hours in use ...... 4.06v

after 24 hours in use ..... 3.97v

after 48 hours in use ..... 3.88v

after 72 hours in use ..... 3.76v

after 96 hours (4 days)... 3.65v


( BEWARE if using throw-away , Primary Lithium CR123a's / or UN-protected RE-chargeables )
.
....... TooManyGizmos

Re: caution(retracted) for Bushnell 3W LED with"Find Me "B" tail cap"




.... Bye-the-way ,

The *SHORT* Bushnell 1-Watt ( 1 cell ) , does NOT have a " OFF " detent on the rotating head . only continual cycles of HI- S.O.S.- STROBE . So you can NOT use the rotating head to shut the light OFF - only the clickie will turn it off .

Also - it does NOT have a glowing "B" tail-cap like the *Long* model .(so no battery-drain issues with it) ... Very long plunger travel to turn ON . Not as easy to turn on with thumb - as the *Long* model is.

It is a scaled-down version in size . It is NOT just a shortened version of the *Long* model . Everything about it is smaller .

It IS quite bright - very white tint - brighter than a *stock* Fenix L1P 1-Watt .

The *Beam spot* on both of these lights CAN BE IMPROVED ....... by modifying the focal point of the reflector .

From the factory- they are a BROAD, un-focused beams- to look more like a LuxV, than a LuxIII or Lux I .

Both models can be modded (easily) to a tighter , even brightness spot .

.... They are both actually very nice lights
.