Old USB uses different sized connections? & random ramblings..

I've hooked up my old trusty Dell XPS D266 PII to my network and I'm in the process of pulling all my old files off. Mostly Photoshop stuff (good stuff, I need to show off or finish), and old games I still like to play, and fonts, and nifty programs (some of which are no longer on the internet to download!).

Anywho, I tried to see if my USB stuff would work with drivers on this old Win95C box, as I saw it had 2 USB ports on the motherboard. Well the cables/etc won't even fit in the holes!!! I tried turning it around several times, then making sure I had it in the right way, but the holes are just TOO SMALL?!

Did the change from USB1.x to USB2.0 change the size of the connectors?

I could find no info on the net about this...

Random Ramblings: 1). I hate how Dell formated the 8gig HD on this beast to be in 4 FAT16 partitions. Their answer was "so old dos disk compression programs would still run". Who needed that on a new box with Win95C and an 8gig HD (one if the biggest you could get at the time)? I should of formated the whole thing when I got it, as it was always a PITA to run out of space on C, then un-install programs, and re-install them to D, E, F. Ugh. Now it's even more a pain getting my files off. It's like they are spread out over 4 computers. I'm not even sure if the machine came with a windows95 CD, that may be why I never wiped it when I got it.
2). I do however like how fast this machine is, for being so old. Win95C runs very fast on this machine, almost instant response like my new P4 machine with XP. I've got windowsME installed on a way faster machine and it's a lot slower!! Specs, 160mb RAM, PII 266mhz, 8gig IBM HD, CD drive, Sound Blaster Gold PCI, 33.6kbit US robotics hardware modem, 100mbit network card, Pure3D-II voodoo2 3D card, STB Velocity 128 video card, and I think the motherboard runs at 33mhz bus. I ordered the XPS machine pretty bare, and added the 3d card, sound card, 128mb ram stick, and network card. The monitor is a 17" trinitron, with a aperture grill. Very sharp, VERY flat!! Compared to other normal CRT's, this one blows them away. It is limited in the resolution/refresh rate though. It's old, and I'm still using it on my new machine. 1024x768 @ 85hz. (must have 85hz, so no higher resolution is used).

Any whooooooot!

What about the USB thing?

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

The usb-connectors are unchanged since they were intruduced around ten years ago.

Maybe you could post a picture?

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

It looks just the same as a normal usb thing, only it's just too small for the male end to fit. It's not long enough or wide enough!!! I don't have a camera anyways.

Just tried every usb cable/device I own. No go. Search reveals no results!!

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

give us a picture of the connector or socket , we will make this right.

regards.

john.

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

As an aside - one of the reasons for the difference between W95 and W98/ME is that one of the "upgrades" M$ made between 95 and 98 was using the Internet Exploder engine to render the desktop, instead of dedicated code like in 95. This allowed tricks like putting a website as your desktop background, but not anything really (IMHO) useful; the whole point was to get IE market share at Netscape's expense, not provide the fastest desktop experience.

I used the 98lite software from www.litepc.com for a long time to replace 98's IE-dependent shell with 95's dedicated one on some old PCs at work, where every bit of responsiveness was needed to keep them useful.

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

TinderBox (UK) said:

give us a picture of the connector or socket , we will make this right.

regards.

john.

Click to expand...

I'll try to borrow a camera and get a photo of it some time. Making it right, may envolve a pry bar or a dremel!! lol!

BikeBear: yeah, I had the option when I ordered the dell to get 95 with, out without IE 4.0. I chose without, as I didn't want the incorperation. I have heard about the lite (free versions actually), but do they have a free thing for ME? I'd like to wipe the HD and re-format to fat32 in one partition and put back on windows, but I fear I don't have the win95 CD, nor could I find updates to update it and winsock/etc anymore... I do have ME though I could put on it...

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

Are you sure it's not a FireWire connector?

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

I don't think firewire was availible in 97, hehe. And firewire would be wider/fatter. This is slim just like USB, and says USB on it. I saw the motherboard for this machine on ebay, but it didn't have a photo of the back, but did say 2xUSB which is what this is.

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

If you can find out the Make /model of the MB, you should be able to do a google search to make sure it is a USB port.

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

It says "USB" right next to the two ports. They have 4 pins, they are USB, they just don't fit anything !!! Under devicemanager, it shows 2 usb ports on the intel controler. No doubt it's USB guys. It just doesn't fit!?!????

USB has 3 sizes...

The square looking one that usually hooks to a printer, scanner, or modem.
The rectangle one that hooks to the PC.
The small odd rectangle/trapizoid shape that phones and cameras use...

I think thats all of them.


edit:
The above sizes are for cables... PCs have only one size usb port... It's the other devices that have the "other" sizes.

I concur, USB has not changed since at least '96. I have a webcam that came with a PC I bought then and it fits my current PC. Love to see a pic of the port yours has (Esp. next to a USB plug).

Just a thought...

on most PC´s there are 3 individual parts:

- actual USB port soldered to PCB
- metallic i/o-area shielding plate (loosely connected to PCB or case)
- cut-out case openings

Maybe those 3 aren´t properly aligned in a row, preventing you from plugging your USB-cable in?

Seth

Are the ports mounted on a slot cover or something? Maybe they are mis alligned so nothing will plug in?

What are you looking at when you see the 4 pins ? the motherboard or the I/O plate on the back of your computer ?

Take a look at this link :
Motherboard
This board has 4 usb ports, Two under the LAN port, then two more under the Firewire port.

Some motherboard also have a USB header on the Motherboard, but there are 9 pins.

Re: Old USB uses different connections? & random ramblings..

IsaacHayes said:

BikeBear: yeah, I had the option when I ordered the dell to get 95 with, out without IE 4.0. I chose without, as I didn't want the incorperation. I have heard about the lite (free versions actually), but do they have a free thing for ME? I'd like to wipe the HD and re-format to fat32 in one partition and put back on windows, but I fear I don't have the win95 CD, nor could I find updates to update it and winsock/etc anymore... I do have ME though I could put on it...

Click to expand...

ME is a horror, though 98lite apparently works on it as well.

www.DirectDeals.com still has stock of W95 and W98, believe it or not - a copy of each will run you a total of about $85, then you could have 98 (which is rather more robust than 95, yet without the sludge in ME) with the fast 95 shell via 98lite. (You might be able to find better prices elsewhere via www.pricewatch.com, etc, but I think this is at least ballpark.)

If you're up for being a bit adventuresome, though - you might want to consider one of the modern desktop Linux distributions like Ubuntu. If your machine can be booted from the CD-ROM drive, you can even download a "Live CD" version that will let you test-drive the system before you commit to installing it. It's really not a geek-only experience anymore... and it's free.

The reason I bring this up is that the entire 9x line - 95, 98 and ME - has been End of Lifed by Microsoft and who knows how much longer they'll be distributing the patch packs for them.

Guys, I'm using the right cable. "A" male or whatever.

Good point about the I/O sheild not aligned properly, but the cable fits through it, but the on board seems too small. But looks the right size, it's just not perfect... I'll try to get a pic, but it looks like it's fine until you try to plug it in.

BikerBear: I already have enough spare pc's all of a sudden donated to me in parts that I've got working/running. I won't be spending money on a new OS for it. If anything It will jus get a reformat and ME and put in storage probably! I have 4 running machines (counting my own super machine), and could have 1 more if I took out a HD and ram stick out of one. Oh and I could have a 6th if I count my old 486!! I have no idea what to do with all those computers, but I have though of running a server for something. One machine I got to replace the MB, but I could run a doom3 dedicated server maybe on it haha!

I do have knoppix live on CD, it's pretty neat. I may do a linux install on one of the PC's. As far as I know only ME they are still releasing updates for. Do you know if updates can be downloaded manually for 95/98 still? It would be nice if there was and I found the old 95 CD, I could go back to a fresh start..

Perhaps the I/O shield (usually thin stainless steel) which has the grounding 'finger tabs' that contact the motherboard's connectors, got bent during assembly and are bent in a way blocking the USB jacks...reducing the opening.

If you must upgrade, I'd recommend win98se instead of ME. More stable and has the updates none of the fluff.
The system is pretty slow by today's standards, so a lean and mean OS is a must. Didn't MS release some thin-client type versions of windows recently for free download? So, corporations can support older, slower systems?

Also, didn't win95 have a 2Gig limit on its HDD support? Hence the multiple partitions that came with your Dell.
It's been so long.

WNG said:

Didn't MS release some thin-client type versions of windows recently for free download? So, corporations can support older, slower systems?

Click to expand...

Yes, with emphasis on the "thin client" bit. It's not really a desktop OS in the sense that W98, W2K or XP are. To quote from the MS website:

Windows Fundamentals for Legacy PCs is not a general-purpose operating system. It is designed to work with the Microsoft Remote Desktop Connection client or third-party clients such as the Citrix ICA client. In addition, it allows for a limited number of workloads to be executed locally, including security software, management software, terminal emulation software, document viewers, and the .NET Framework.

Click to expand...

Here are the docs for your PC. Nothing indicating that the ports are anything other than standard (which hasn't changed over time, at least from a dimensional perspective). Given that bit of info, I'd have to agree with Seth's idea:

Seth said:

Just a thought...

on most PC´s there are 3 individual parts:

- actual USB port soldered to PCB
- metallic i/o-area shielding plate (loosely connected to PCB or case)
- cut-out case openings

Maybe those 3 aren´t properly aligned in a row, preventing you from plugging your USB-cable in?

Seth

Click to expand...

In some cases, even a slight misalignment between the cutouts in the I/O faceplate and the actual USB port can prevent the insertion of the USB plug into the port (even if the plug fits through the cutout in the faceplate).

John