The LED Museum Needs a Computer - APPEAL

The LED Museum Needs a Computer
(see @ this link for background) http://www.candlepowerforums.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=22&t=000278&p=2

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The LED Museum:
I don't think I need a whole new computer, but I do think I'd be better off with a different mainboard &CPU.

I'm currently using a Socket-7 "SiS 530" PC100 motherboard with SiS chipset and an AMD K6-2 500MHz processor. 128MB of PC100 RAM. Has two IDE ports, onboard USB (but nobody makes the connector), onboard video & sound, and daughterboard 56K modem & NIC. The NIC is not installed, as doing so automatically disables the modem. The board has 1 ISA and 2 PCI slots, of which the ISA slot hosts a bus mouse and a PCI slot hosts a USB card that can't be used in Win95 anyway.

So the board (or boardset) I'd need would have to have 2 IDE ports, 1 or 2 USB ports, at least 1 ISA and 1 PCI slot, and either have onboard or come with video, sound, and modem boards.

The keyboard uses the "big" DIN plug, but I think I have a gender bender for those small ones around here somewhere. (checking... nope, the male end of the adapter is the large 5-pin DIN, the female end is a small 6-pin thing, looks like PS/2.) I think I'd need one that goes the other way around if the new MB comes with the small keyboard socket.

Anything else... hmmm, not that I can think of. So it all comes down to finding a Win98 / P&P friendly mainboard (either with RAM, or able to use the PC100 junk off this board) and the basics (video/sound/modem). Minimum 400-500MHz CPU.

Any thoughts?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, that's it.
Will the "World of Lights" spring into action like a well-oiled machine, or just creak a few times then fall to bits ?

lightlover

Actually, I don't need a whole computer, just some of the guts that go inside.
Thus, I'd still use the case, power supply, and mass storage devices I already have and that are known to be in good working order.

I detailed my requirements on the other thread. 2 IDE connectors, USB, sound, video, and modem. And at least 1 free ISA slot for the rat. (I know what a mouse looks like, and this big thing I'm using is definitely a rat!)

Craig,

Sorry to hear abt all the probs. Before you ditch the old thing, maybe one last try with this info (if you haven't already tried, that is)?

1) Win98 is a must for USB. No quibbles here.

2) Noticed some quirks in your internet settings:

- you are using CHAP(challenge handshake authentication protocol). most of the ISPs I know use PAP(password authentication protocol).

- when you achieved a connection after the password, you pinged FQDNs(fully qualified domain names) like www.yahoo.com. This will ONLY work if you or your provider has set up DNS on your machine for you. If not, Windows will not be able to figure out what IP Address(looks something like 203.123.13.14) www.yahoo.com (or any other FQDN) points to. The internet works on IP addresses, humans work with names - DNS bridges that gap. Assuming DNS has not been set up, you'd still need to check whether your internet link is truly working, so try pinging an IP address instead of an FQDN. Try it with my server, for instance: 203.123.13.14. If you get a reply, your net link is up! Then, you just need to setup DNS. To do so, doubleclick on the network icon on the Control Panel, then locate and doubleclick on the TCP/IP->Dial-up Adapter line in the scrollbox and goto the DNS Configuration tab. If its all blanked out, do this:

- Click on Enable DNS
- Fill in the host and domain boxes (anything will do here)
- Punch in 165.21.83.88 and click Add
- Click OK to dismiss the TCPIP window
- Click OK to dismiss the Networking window
- Allow your PC to reboot
- Connect to your ISP and try the ping test using FQDNS.

If your replies come back when you ping www.yahoo.com, for instance, you're OK!

Sorry this info is late, but you can try it while waiting for new parts...

Craig,

I'll also have to add this - if DNS isn't set up properly on your NEW system, you'll have the same problems.

You might wanna find out from your ISP the following info to keep handy:

- Primary DNS server IP address

- Secondary DNS server IP address

- Proxy server name(if any - few ISPs use these)

- Authentication protocol: (either CHAP or PAP)

- POP server name or IP address (sometimes its the same as the SMTP server)

- SMTP server name or IP address (sometimes its the same as the POP server)

In every PC I've setup, the info above has always come in handy when setting dial-up networking manually. (I don't use those dinky CD-ROMS provided by ISPs cause they frequently screw up your browser and add stupid links you're not likely to use.)

Good luck!

Oops, sorry - one more thing.

Is your modem a Winmodem? This is a generic term for part-software/part-hardware modems, that typically come as a slot-in card that goes into your PC (as opposed to sitting outside). How do you tell if its a Winmodem or a regular modem-on-a-card? For one, its very smaller than full-hardware modem cards, sometimes with the footprint of a cigarette lighter or a pack of cards. The packing will also tell you proudly that its a Win modem. Check for "only works with Microsoft Windows 9x" type lines on the packing too - sure sign.

Real modems are slightly more expensive, but they don't hog your CPU and other resources modulating and demodulating your internet sessions. And they'll work with *any* OS, not just Windows. Winmodems also tend to flake out if your OS is unhealthy as they are dependent on it. Manufacturers like them cause they're cheap to produce (fewer components - processing is offloaded to your CPU) and buyers think they're a great deal.

I'd stay away from these things if I were you.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hotfoot:
Craig,

Sorry to hear abt all the probs. Before you ditch the old thing, maybe one last try with this info (if you haven't already tried, that is)?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

1) Win98 is a must for USB. No quibbles here.

I've pretty much resigned to that already, and quit trying to fuss with Win95.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hotfoot:
2) Noticed some quirks in your internet settings:

- you are using CHAP(challenge handshake authentication protocol). most of the ISPs I know use PAP(password authentication protocol).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I noticed that too, but there was no options for changing or removing it. No amount of left or right clicking did anything in the application that shows it in use, and it appeared nowhere else on the system.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hotfoot:
- when you achieved a connection after the password, you pinged FQDNs(fully qualified domain names) like www.yahoo.com. This will ONLY work if you or your provider has set up DNS on your machine for you.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

We already went in and manually added the primary and secondary DNS address for my ISP, and enabled their usage (vs. the auto setting). There was no chanhge.

The only thing that's got me bugged is the bit you said about the CHAP. That doesn't appear in my Win95 setup, but does in Win98, and I have no clue as how to change or eliminate it.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hotfoot:

You might wanna find out from your ISP the following info to keep handy:

- Primary DNS server IP address

- Secondary DNS server IP address (etc. etc.)

Good luck!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've got all of these, except my ISP doesn't specifiy CHAP or PAP. It's probably PAP.
I've also got my somewhat cryptic At&t "user name" and scrambled net PW handy. I remember having to actually need all this stuff when I ran Win 3.1 and had to set up the ******* Trumpet win(d)sock. That was almost as aggravating as my current Win98 woes.

Here's an update. I've been offered the following PC components:

ATI Rage Video
10/100 NIC
Soundblaster 64
Modem, unknown brand
32 speed CD-ROM
Celeron 333 CPU
Maybe a couple of sticks of 64MB PC100 RAM.

This may help narrow down the search for an appropriate mainboard. I don't know how the Celeron 333MHz compares with an AMD K6-2 500MHz but I can live with the slower speed if it means being able to run Win 98 correctly.

No hurry on this. I can live with the existing installation for as long as my supply of floppys hold out.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The LED Museum:
Here's an update. I've been offered the following PC components:

ATI Rage Video
10/100 NIC
Soundblaster 64
Modem, unknown brand
32 speed CD-ROM
Celeron 333 CPU
Maybe a couple of sticks of 64MB PC100 RAM.

This may help narrow down the search for an appropriate mainboard. I don't know how the Celeron 333MHz compares with an AMD K6-2 500MHz but I can live with the slower speed if it means being able to run Win 98 correctly.

No hurry on this. I can live with the existing installation for as long as my supply of floppys hold out.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Processor is "weak" and probably slot one. Can you still buy slot one motherboards? Your current processor is probably just as strong in that regard. Video is OK for internetting and non game use, the soundcard will produce sound, although I believe it is still two channel sound. Other stuff is OK but if you have to buy a motherboard, I'd hold out for a better processor. $50 AMD Duran processors will blow that out of the water and will be accepted by a modern motherboard.

On a side note, I had a SIS pentium chipset a few years ago and had lots of hardware compatibility problems. You probably have but if not, it's worth trying to find any speciality win98 SIS drivers from their home page. I assume they have a home page, they're still in business and producing new chipsets. Also if you get a computer and need a PS2 mouse and keyboard, I can supply you with that if need be. Unless you really love your mouse, you don't want to have an ISA mouse driver card and most new motherboards don't include ISA slots anymore as it is.

If you really like a lowdown on good motherboards, graphics cards and the like, try checking out the (IMHO) most authoritative hardware site on the net: http://www.tomshardware.com

This site reviews hardware like Craig reviews flashlights - 'nuff said

While looking for the (still MIA) receipt for my broken camera, I did come across the manual for my SiS motherboard. Here are the specs and other important sounding stuff.


Socket-7 CPU support: Intel P55C, Cyrix/IBM 6x86L, 6x86MX/MII, AMD K6/K6-2/K6-III, IDT C6 and WinChipo 2/2A CPUs. BIOS has "automatic" CPU plug & play to select the correct parameters for whatever CPU you stick in the hole.

Baby-AT form factor.

System bus: 60/66/75/83/95/100MHz

Cache: 512K external level 2 cache onboard

Memory slots: 3 DIMM slots for 3.3 volt 168-pin SDRAM, max: 768MB, 66 and 100MHz memory bus

Expansion: 2 32-bit PCI, 1 8/16 bit ISA

Onboard IDE: Primary & secondary PCI IDE channels, PIO support, support for bus mastering and ultraDMA 33/66 modes.

Graphics: Onboard 64-bit 3D AGP graphics accelerator, AGP ver. 1 66/133MHz, 8MB frame buffer stolen from main memory

Sound: Meets PC98 audio spec. 16-bit PB/REC codec, yada yada yada... Wolfenstein-3D does not recognise it as a sound card (thus playing no music), but most other apps will, including MAME which I occasionally use on this syxtem.

Onboard I/O: Floppy, 1MB/sec
1 serial port w/16550 compatible UART
1 Parallel, supports ECP and EPP
2 USB ports (optional extension bracket) and 1 PS/2 port (optional extention bracket)
1 Infrared port (optional extension bracket)

Built-in 10/100 LAN (uses extension bracket I believe containing only the plug and a few discrete parts like resistors & caps)

56K faxmodem/DAA module (daughterboard), requires Win95/98/NT

Flash ROM: For all that plug & play horse puckey.


The "optional" accessories - this is the part nobody seems to make or sell - includes the ATX Form Card (probably means "extension bracket that goes on the back of your PC") with 2 USB ports, IR port, and PS/2 mouse port. Also listed as optional is a UDMA/66 IDE cable.

If you disable the onboard sound board, the modem will no longer function even if it is jumper-enabled, thus mandating you use a PCI or external modem if you also want to use a seperate sound board. There goes your two PCI slots - poof!
Not much room for expansion in this sytem, is there?

The rest of the manual looks pretty standard - f**k with jumpers, screw it in your computer, and attach some wires & the brackets to the knockouts in the back of your case.

Nothing here explains (not to me, anyway) why Win 98 successfully logs into my ISP, yet refuses to let me use the internet once connected. Maybe somebody who really knows their motherboards can spot something in here that's sporting a red flag.

I'm 99.9999% positive that the internet problem has nothing to do with the motherboard. If it were a Motherboard hardware problem, you probably wouldn't be able to connect to the internet at all. It might be the wierd modem daughterboard but even that is unlikely.

The problem just about HAS to be the way that Win98 / TCP set itself up when you loaded Win98. Format the drive and try loading win98 again again is my suggestion.

Oh, and if you can disable your LAN functions with a jumper or in BIOS, do so before re-loading 98.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Silviron:
The problem just about HAS to be the way that Win98 / TCP set itself up when you loaded Win98. Format the drive and try loading win98 again again is my suggestion.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sounds like the best solution to this is the one that will leave me the most thoroughly screwed. I lost almost all installation CDs and discs to my most important programs in last year's earthquake, so reformatting the HD is the last thing I want to do. Not every application takes being copied to another place very well, but I'll see what I can do.

I guess I might as well dive in and do this as soon as I find that wayward receipt. :-/
So I might not be back for awhile.

does your isp give you a gateway setting? what does winipcfg say? I wonder if your lan card could be causing the problems for your modem configuration.

Craig, I didn't realize you weren't reformatting and starting fresh when loading win98. That would have been my recommendation as well and I would give better then even odds it would solve your problem. If you use a new mb/cpu combo, most likely you will have to reformat anyhow to get hardware configuration to work.

Craig-

It's probably too late - but if you saved your trashed disks & CD's, most manufacturers will replace them free (except shipping & handling charge) if you send the broken ones in.

Assuming your manufacturer / software company is still in business, that is.

Or if you registered your software, they might take pity on you if you explain what happened, and replace them without the trashed disks.

Or post a list of what software you need. I'll bet we can come up of most of it here, except maybe any really esoteric stuff for your specialized equipment.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Silviron:
Craig-

It's probably too late - but if you saved your trashed disks & CD's, most manufacturers will replace them free (except shipping & handling charge) if you send the broken ones in.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's about a year too late for that. When my parents were here for a few hours helping me throw out earthquake-damaged stuff, one of the items they took it upon themselves to relieve me of was the box of broken computer CDs and shattered expansion cards that I had set aside for exactly that reason. I should have shoved it under the end table with the box of broken insulators.

Nothing really specialised or exotic is being used on this machine, just things like my HTML editor (this is little more than a gussied-up Qedit), Photoshop 4 (this is the only one I could truly not do without, and the one that will protest the most if relocated), and a few things I've already successfully moved and no longer need to worry about. Everything else I can snag off the net (freeware stuff) as time permits.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by geepondy:
Craig, I didn't realize you weren't reformatting and starting fresh when loading win98. That would have been my recommendation as well and I would give better then even odds it would solve your problem<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What about just playing musical hard drives?
That is, switch out my 2GB primary master wiht my 13GB secondary master? The new drive has not yet even been "SYS"'d to, so it's basically clean as a whistle.
I'd have to make a boot disk that includes enabling the CD-ROM driver, but that shouldn't be too hard. And the BIOS won't have any problems with swapping the drives.

Will this work in leiu of actually formatting my current C: drive - turning my C: drive into my E: drive instead?

And if something does go really sour, I could restore my current Win95 setup simply by swapping the two drives back to their original positions.

Ok... it's around 12:40am on I think the 27th or 28th.

Windows 98 went in - nice and slow. No sound, 16-color 640x400 picture, no mouse, no modem, no nothing. But no installation errors either.

So I start searching for the long-lost CD-ROM that came with my mainboard so I can reinstall the hardware drivers. After 4 hours of turning the house completely into trash (that will take 3-6 weeks to clean up from), it finally surfaced. All the drivers went in, and as you can see, I'm back.

But everything else is ROYALLY F*CKED.
IE is f*cked. All logins & cookies are gone, and it reverted back to version 4.0.
Netscape is f*cked. The DLLs are shot, so I cannot alter my preferences or check any of my alternate e-mail addresses, nor can I provide it with my mailhost so I can answer e-mails.
Photoshop is f*cked. It's still on the HD, but all the DLLs are hosed and I don't have the install CD.
Gomer is f*cked.
All of my web files are gone. They exist on AT&T's server (somehow, Win98 wiped them all off my local system), but I cannot retrieve them.
FTP (perhaps the most important of all!) is f*cked, as are all the settings used to connect to each individual server.
My keyboard repeat delay was altered by setup and cannot be changed back.
Even the lowly but ever-useful (to me) Qedit is gone.

So I'm online in Windows 98 now, but I can't get a lick of work done, or even do something as simple as upload a picture or answer an e-mail.

BILL GATES, I DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU, F--- YOU AND THE HORSE THAT RODE YOU IN!!

Guess I should wait before having that toast. Looks like I already broke the glass.

I'm now attempting what is normally considered a severe "no-no" to try to restore several of these programs. But I'll have to drop offline for awhile to finish.
So let's see how many more glasses I can break before this night is over.

(Edit)... that didn't work... now I'm facing around 20 hours worth of download (stupid dumb slow dialup, arrrggghhh!!!!) in order to reinstall my browsers. :X

Damn this is sure pissing me off.

And here's the update.

Netscape & IE are irreversibly f**ked, and both will have to be snagged off the net and then reinstalled.
This is exactly what I was afraid of when I was told I should install Win98 on an unmolested, fresh HD. My ISP doesn't maintain a connection long enough to complete such a large download at my speed, so this is going to be a pain in the toilet muscle to get fixed.

Gomer HTML editor has a trashed DLL.

Photoshop and FTP were successfully rescued and required no reinstallation - just new shortcuts.

The camera installed successfully. It's slower than the P2MMX 350MHz system over there (pointing at other table), but it does work, and no more floppies for photo transfers. Still need them for the ProMetric, though I can live with that.

Guess I'd better put on another pot of coffee.