Are we counting cree's before there hatched?

There is a ton of Cree XR-E threads, and I have not been as busy cruising this board in the last 2-3 weeks, nor do I know much about Cree, (I'm still learning about bin codes, tint's etc, on lux's )

But considering how much tint's matter to poeple around here, and the fact things like reflectors and circuit's are still geared toward Lux's
should we chill a little till they been through a few light's by the light builder's here before expecting them in fenix's, surefire etc right now?

Again I know little, and on a board this big maybe I missed a few threads were there is info they passed all the exams, but we sure tend to
get somewhat demanding (to the point of 4 yr in toy section) as I am sure other's have seen.(look around in custom lights and B/S/T sometime)

are there a ton of these ready to go in agreeable spec's for say a fenix to switch over tomorrow?
Not being a smart a$$ just was shocked to see the LED forum seems to have a "cree" thread ever other one. VDG

excerpt from Cree press release 11/06/2006:

Cree, Inc. (Nasdaq: CREE), a leader in LED solid-state lighting components, announced today a global distribution agreement with Arrow Electronics, Inc. (NYSE: ARW) to sell and support Cree XLamp® products worldwide. The agreement gives Arrow's over 130,000 customers ready access to Cree's latest commercially available technology and a growing family of XLamp products. It also gives Cree's customers access to one of the world's largest and most efficient distributor supply chains. Together, Cree and Arrow intend to accelerate the adoption of solid-state lighting globally by providing superior high-power packaged LED products and services to designers and manufacturers of lighting products.

Among the Cree products available through Arrow will be the recently released XLamp 7090 XR-E Series LED, the first 160-lumen white power LED and first power LED that is as efficient as fluorescent sources.

It seems as though we are on the turn of the tide ATM. Big news for some time to come I think as they roll out into various lights.

One observation i have made is that Newbie which is probably the most knowledgeable and sceptical ( when it comes to manufacturers calims ) person in CPF has confirmed the claims made by Cree during his tests and seems to really like the XR-E ( based on his numerous positive posts and threads )
This alone ( to me ) means that the XR-E has to be really really good. and from my limited experience it is.

Amonra said:

One observation i have made is that Newbie which is probably the most knowledgeable and sceptical ( when it comes to manufacturers calims ) person in CPF has confirmed the claims made by Cree during his tests and seems to really like the XR-E ( based on his numerous positive posts and threads )
This alone ( to me ) means that the XR-E has to be really really good. and from my limited experience it is.

Click to expand...

Maby you are right, Newbie seems to have a very good knowledge about LEDs, but since this is an open forum you don't know if he/she is working for Cree or not... keep that in mind...

that is possible but if he was working for Cree i guess he would be selling them rather than buying them

To my knowledge, NewBie does not work for Cree. He works for another well-known company outside of the flashlight industry.

Opto-King said:

Maby you are right, Newbie seems to have a very good knowledge about LEDs, but since this is an open forum you don't know if he/she is working for Cree or not... keep that in mind...

Click to expand...

Since Seoul Semiconductor uses the CREE die for producing power white, green, blue, cyan, uv LEDs, you should be pretty excited yourself, as it means improvents are comming.


No, I do not work for, represent, or sell CREE, nor own CREE stock. I buy and use LEDs like everyone else.

I design Avionics for a living..


I just like great LEDs, and if you remember, I was pretty pumped up over the LumiLEDs K2 when they announced it in Feb 2005, especially due to all their promises, and well, ehm, maybe some day...

I get really pumped when something shows up that actually delivers upon it's promises.

***PUMPED!!!!***

NewBie said:

I just like great LEDs, and if you remember, I was pretty pumped up over the LumiLEDs K2 when they announced it in Feb 2005, especially due to all their promises, and well, ehm, maybe some day...

I get really pumped when something shows up that actually delivers upon it's promises.

***PUMPED!!!!***

Click to expand...

NewBie is a picky, anal, pain in the butt that demands actual results over hype. Granted, he really wished that the K2 was even close to the vapors that Lumileds what blowing around. We all wished the K2 was going to be very bright and efficient and I designed a Mag mod around the original specs. Then the K2 went down in flames on the efficiency front, LEDs went a step backwards when NewBie started to release actual performance results.

My dreams of 400+ lumens of light with four K2's running at 700mA each went down the tubes. Then I started looking at Cree and jumped on the XR-E as fast as I could. Then NewBie dropped the bomb that even the lowest bin (P1) actually put out 80 lumens at 350mA and very low voltages. 80 lumens at 350mA and 3.0 volts? Do the math and it is 1.05 watts and that is a P1 bin! We are not talking about the absolute best, hand-picked LED that Cree could find but a P1 bin.

I have 5 P3 bins laying around and I have started modding. I should have my first XR-E mod done tomorrow and finish testing on Friday. The light meter is ready and let the fun begin. Also have 7 Q2 bin XR-E on stars on order with 4 of them to go in a Mag 2D mod. I have been furiously working on designs and figuring out how to get many lights to take those LEDs. McR19, IMS 20mm modded reflectors and taking a look at my L1P I have laying around. Maybe a 2AA MinimagLED mod to send to my brother for Christmas.

The Crees have hatched and they are not a slight improvement, they are a staggering jump in output but coupled with improved efficiency, better thermal properties, tighter bin codes, availability and lower cost.

Looking at NewBie's charts and converting it to a LuxeonI chart...the P1 bin XR-E is a Luxeon code of T--G or a LuxeonIII rating of V--H. I am sure if Lumileds released these for auction three months ago the modders here would of payed over $100 each. Two of them together driven at LuxeonV levels would be called a Y--T for 270 lumens at 6.52V (4.56 watts)

Now we have to think what a P3 or Q2 Cree bin will do! In LuxeonIII speak, a W--H bin? Now look at the throw a XR-E can do and the STRONG side spill... very LuxeonV like which works very well for flashlights. This is not a white paper, an announcement by a company, a theory to stimulate news... this is CPF real-world testing!

The only tide that is changing faster than the Luxeon VS Cree is defense secretaries...

...and Newbie's observations have been confirmed by numerous other respected members of CPF, including McGizmo, PSM, etc. It's not just one, isolated member's praise - it's a whole community's praise!

The Crees really are quite impressive. Not only is my A19 Cree XRE brighter than any other single-cell light I own, but it also has an incredible beam pattern that marries great throw to a phenomenal spillbeam. That's something that just isn't found in my other lights. As I've said in other posts, it's like having the throw of a LuxIII and the spill of a LuxV all in one light. The best of both worlds!

- FITP

I think companies will try to clear out old stock before releasing the Cree stuff...unless some one else does it first (and at some point that will happen of course)...then they might as well scramble and discount the old LS stuff.

I doubt if Surefire will sell many LS U2`s once Cree U2`s come out...unless they really drop the price, way down...just an example.

You guys are taking this thread off course. It's not a bad course but it is off course. :nana:

The Luxeon's are well understood by the LED flashlight industry and there are numerous luxeon based lights in production as well as in plans for production. The XR-E is not a drop in replacement for the Luxeon and designs and tooling are required for implimenting its use. It has merit as an alternate to the Luxeon and there is no doubt in my mind that manufactures will ignore it at their own risk. However the general market for flashlights is very diverse and there are large segments of the market that will never have any brand recognition at a component level. A manufacturer will supply and perform to the demand of the market they serve.

IMHO the XR-E represents a quantum leap in performance over existing Luxeons and this increase can and will be seen at the counter or on the peg board when reasonable samples of XR-E based lights are there competing with present Luxeon based lights. Should Lumileds rise to the new benchmark in a reasonable time frame, the market may not be disrupted that much. However the vapor of the K2 when compared to the delivery of the XR-E as claimed would seem to put enough doubt in decision makers minds to proceed with an open door to Cree as a component source.

It costs time and money for a manufacturer to significantly alter their line with a new and improved version and they will only do so if necessary. I think the XR-E will force a change in products at some level and in certain areas within the market. Only time and additional changes in technology will tell or show the extent of the XR-E's impact on the market.

I'm quite happy with the Luxeons, they too will improve over time,
When somebody makes a commercially available Cree light I will give it a go

Well, this is like the good old days, where modders could ply their trade without competition, from the big dogs.

But this window won't last long, and modders looking to capitalize will have to act fast.

Personally, I'm already sick of all the yapping.

Let this sink in folks. No matter how fantastic the Cree eventually turns out to be, most of you will consider it obsolete within a couple of years

Raven said:

Well, this is like the good old days, where modders could ply their trade without competition, from the big dogs.

But this window won't last long, and modders looking to capitalize will have to act fast.

Personally, I'm already sick of all the yapping.

Let this sink in folks. No matter how fantastic the Cree eventually turns out to be, most of you will consider it obsolete within a couple of years

Click to expand...

Cree made a leap, and that is a big deal. Only so much light can be chased out of silicon and it gets progressively more difficult to make leaps like Cree has.

where can i buy a cree LED or is this still in production? i have been away for a while

there's a group buy right here : https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/139705 it also includes the optics

Everyone was impressed with how brught the XE-E is.

But I have some reservations. Because...

Newbie did some tint testing of 2 samples ofthe Cree XR-E
6402 and 7207 degrees colour temperature
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1670873&postcount=77
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1672437&postcount=84

I believe daylight is 5500 degrees.
Warm white room lighting is 3500 degrees

The Crees is likely to be a cool (blue) white.

Bought some LED household bulbs a couple of years ago. After a short time (like 15 minutes) my eyes hurt. Found out later they were rated at 9000 degrees. The Cree at 7207 degrees is halfway there.

OTOH I've gotten used to various 5mm/7mm/rigel based torches. So I'll probably get used to the Cree CR-E tint. I like Luxeon xWOx tint.

EDIT
New post by Newbie
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1681968&postcount=93
Looks like I will have to make sure my XR-E torches come with a WD bin and not overdriven.

Ok, I see this is a big leap, I hope to get a XR-E equipped light soon, I just don't make light's. So I guess I wonder when and which non-custom maker will put out a light with it first with it?
How hard is it to mount a cree in say a KL-1 with existing hardware and circuit's? Is it a minor adjustment, or major? I guess that was as much the point of this thread,,, to see if I had missed something since I was under
the impression they were a good deal different then lux's to retro-fit. VDG

Non the less, i can't wait for a 60 lm AAA keychain light!!

If Luxeon does not answer SOON, they `re gone.
Their last good model was the Lux III some year ago.

The already available P3 or P4 bins give equal light to the Lux III, but at half the current.

No chance to ignore that!