What to do? Missing Flashlight resurfaces...

What to do? Missing Flashlight resurfaces...

Hello all,

Here I am at a very difficult situation. I admit I am a Flashoholic and I at times carry 3+ Flashlights at one time during my work hours. Somewhere somehow I misplaced my 9AN w/KT3 Turbo Head, both in black. It has been missing for many many months maybe even a year or more. My car was broken into last year at home and a Surefire 10x and a Spyderco Civilian was stolen out of the car about the same time I realized my 9ANT was missing. I don't believe I left the 9ANT in the car so I kind of kept it in the back of my head that it to have been stolen from the car but not 100%.

I have sold several Surefires to co-workers who are armed Security Guards or Code Enforcement Personnel. I am known as the Flashlight freak at work and almost all employees know it. If there is a Flashlight question, go ask me.

I show off to them my Surefire Porcupines, 3" Turbos, Orbs, etc.

Mr. D and Mr. W are both armed Code Enforcement Officers.

Mr. D gets a hold of me and says that Mr. W needs a charger for a Flashlight. I get a hold of Mr. W and he tells me he has the Flashlight at his office. We agree to meet there during his lunch hour. (This was just this past Thursday Nov 16 2006.) I see Mr. W and I ask to see the Flashlight to see what charger it needs and if I can get one. Low and behold he whips out a 9AN w/KT3 in Black. I say I think this is my Flashlight that I have been missing for awhile. He say he bought it from a co-worker from his other job.


Mr. D and Mr. W were there. Mr. D says "don't you have one like that?" I say "yes and I think this is it, it has been missing for awhile." (one witness knowing of me having a 9ANT)
I tell Mr. W "before I touch it, let me show you what I do to the tail cap springs". I show him the added wire I place to remove the added resistance of the coiled spring. See my post… https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/129582

I show him the wire in the tail cap of my 9N I had. Then I opened up the 9ANT and sure enough… the wire is there. I say see, no one else does this. He tells me that the guy he bought it from runs wire at the hospital and he does that too. WHAT A BUNCH OF BULL----! I show him the dual o-rings also. I asked if he bought the Flashlight just like it was and he said "Yes". Another lie! Surefire does not sell the 9AN with the Turbo Head already attached nor with dual o-rings on the tail cap.

I spoke with his Supervisor and I sent him pictures of my Surefire collection with the 9ANT in it. I told him I have the receipt, the box, the KT3 box, the original head etc. He said he will speak with Mr. W.


Friday November 17 2006. Supervisor calls me back and says "Mr. W is sticking to his guns and that he bought it."

I then spoke with Mr. D again regarding why he didn't say anything to Mr. W. He tells me that it never dawned on him that it was the one I was missing. He also tells me that it was sitting on a file cabinet for the longest. I ask Mr. D "Is Mr. W the type of guy that would buy a Surefire?" "NO" was the answer. Mr. D never saw Mr. W with the 9ANT.

Come on guys, we are all men here. When we get a new toy we show it off to everyone. Ha ha look what I got and you can't afford it… especially to co-workers in the same field with the same wants – RIGHT?

I ask his Supervisor and Mr. D to please speak with Mr. W and I would like my Flashlight back and I am willing to offer him a $50.00 reward for finding the Flashlight. Return the Flashlight and get $50.00 with no further questions.

Possible scenarios…

• I could have left the Flashlight on a job site and it was picked up by Mr. W. (If this one - Mr. W should have turned it in to lost and found.)
• I could have left the Flashlight and it was picked up by someone else and then was sold to Mr. W
• Mr. W took it out of my work truck. (If this one - Bad Mr. W.)

I never reported it lost at work for I thought it was stolen from my car or just misplaced at home somewhere or in another car or loaned it to a friend or…?????

I have spoken with a local Sheriff friend and there is no such thing as finder keepers. If it never surfaced again, then yes, finder's keepers if you never report it found. Since the Flashlight has came out of hiding it can now be considered stolen property if it is not returned to the rightful owner. Can any you of you Law Enforcement back this?

I'm not too close to Mr. W but I am close to Mr. D and their Supervisor and I hope both of them will talk some sense into Mr. W.

If not...?

What would you do at this point?

Njoy…

Oh man! What a difficult situation, I guess scenario one he picked it up and kept it, surefire are a revelation to the uninitiated. I would keep pushing your co-workers Mr D for support and your supervisor. Especially as you have voiced you concerns, you can't let it lie now, its your's!

I hope you get this ironed out, I would probably deal with this in the same way, the reward to get it back, but a bad feeling will be left

Ian

I would definitely take every possible step. If he can't provide a name of someone who originally bought it, is willing to back up his story, and can prove that he was in the hospital and an electrician (like he claims) then definitely nail him. I'd definitely follow up with the police and every step. Don't let a thief like this get away!!!!

That is the exact reason I engrave my initials in an inconspicous spot like under the head. It may tear up the light a little, but it's hard for a thief to explain either initials or the ground up spot where the initials used to be.

I say you give the thief a savage beating, and get your light back. (ok, so I'm only half kidding here).

From a law LEO point of view...looks like a weak criminal case and it would be difficult to get an actual conviction because you would have to prove that he recieved stolen property and you don't sound 100% sure if it was stolen or just misplaced. Take him to civil court. With the evidence that you have against him you have a good chance at winning the case.....then he would either have to give you back the flashlight or pay some $$

Hi light_emitting_dude,

I am not stating that is was stolen, merely that it was missing and now it has resurfaced.

Speaking with another LE, he stated that now the Flashlight is out in the open again, it can now be considered stolen property. I am the rightful owner and I just want it back. Since I now am making a claim to said Flashlight, which is when it will, be considered stolen property if I don't get it back because now I see it, know where it is and I should get it back.

I just sent an email to his Supervisor requesting a meeting on Wed Nov 23 2006 with all parties involved. I will update as the saga continues.

Njoy…

light_emitting_dude said:

From a law LEO point of view...looks like a weak criminal case and it would be difficult to get an actual conviction because you would have to prove that he recieved stolen property and you don't sound 100% sure if it was stolen or just misplaced. Take him to civil court. With the evidence that you have against him you have a good chance at winning the case.....then he would either have to give you back the flashlight or pay some $$

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If you kept record of the serial # of the light, this would be a done deal.

Did you ask Mr. W to identify the seller of the light?
If you talk to him again try and alleviate any responsibly of theft from Mr. W, go along with his story. Apologize for accusing him before. Tell him that it's not his fault; he had no way of knowing that the light was stolen. Tell him that at the end of the day it's just a silly light and it could always be replaced. Tell him that you need his help because you think the person who took your light also took some other things from your car. Tell him you don't want the piece of filth crook to get away with this and you need him to help you find that person. Say "Mr. W, I'd really like to find this guy, will you help me?"

If he is unable to provide a name or good information, especially if he pleads "loss of memory" this is a good indicator that he is dishonest. He either took the light himself or he has guilty knowledge (i.e. protecting a close friend who stole the light).

An honest, innocent individual will do what they can to assist you in this situation.

If you are going to try this tactic, PM me for a follow-through scenario to get him to fess up.

Cheers

Good luck

California Penal Code 496 (a): Buy or receive property, knowing it was stolen or obtained by theft or extortion, or conceal, sell, withhold from the owner, or aid in concealing, etc.

Please note "withhold from the owner."

Man - this is such a terrible predicament... I know you don't want to jump to conclusions here and say that it was stolen, but MAN, come on. Nothing but a bunch of POS excuses coming from him.
I'm not saying he's a bad person - it takes a lot to pony up to such humiliation, but still, he has to do the right thing.
I sincerely hope the meeting on "Wed Nov 23 2006" (Wed is the 22nd, Thu is the 23rd... ?) goes well - this is really frustrating to me; I can only imagine what you are feeling.
The UPside of this - you know where your light is! :thumbsup: :shrug:
john

PS - Here's the first thing to do once you get it back...

I would catch the guy away from work and settle it that way, court system is too slow and you probably wouldn't get your light back anyway.

OK initially what brought your attention to this was that the guy needed a charger for the light. What are the chances of him acquiring a charger now WITHOUT your help? If he can't acquire a charger isn't the light useless to him?

I'd definitely approach it from the point of view that you need his help to locate the person who stole other items from your car.

Definitely some good ideas in this thread on how to mark our lights to prevent this sort of problem.

Good luck!
Let us know how it turns out.

File a ProSE civil lawsuit with the specifics you mentioned above regarding the description of the unique custom work you've done, and how you can identify it. In Illinois the limit of loss is 1500.00 for free representation, costs about 50 bucks which you can tack on to the lawsuit. Perhaps there are other marks/features you did not discuss with this guy. Do not mention them, simply allude to them. Hopefully with this he will be paranoid that "you got some other marking/etch or something of the sort and will be enough to make this guy turn it over to you without going to court and him spending money over it. Sue him for a monetary amount or return of the flashlight. Criminally, not much you can do. Did you do a lost or stolen case report back when it went missing? probably not. Dont bother doing it now, Police look at late reports with much suspicion. Good Luck

There is another option, but it'll take some gumption.

If you are absolutely, positively convinced it is your light, and you are confident that you could prove the same in a civil court, you could merely take it back. Assuming that you can access the light in a legal way (like if he leaves it out in his office), simply take it.

If it is yours, you place him in the position of challenging you legally. If in fact he obtained the light by dubious means, he almost certainly will not initiate legal proceedings of his own.

Having said that, the fact that you have begun to involve management makes this option tough to use and fraught with danger (professionally speaking). You may be perceived as the one who committed a wrong, if you take this matter into your own hands. The other consideration is that continued pursuit of the light could cost you more from a human relations/professional standing perspective than just a flashlight (even a nice one).

I would wait and see how management handles the issue. It may make more sense in the long-run to let it go (assuming that management is of no help), than to create an incident in the workplace. Most companies hate these types of employee/employee disputes, regardless of who is involved, because it places then in the position of being judge and jury. Often both the accuser and accused are tainted by the dispute, in the eyes of management.

Just a thought tho'.

Good luck and please keep us posted on this, as I'm sure you're not the only person that has gone through this type of dilemma. I know that I'm curious about the outcome.

Bad situation. I think you have to decide if the light is worth the trouble. I would not just take it back--could make life really tough.

I see one downside to engraving initials--what happens when you sell the light?

A used light is a used light - if someone's initials are engraved on the inside of it, I'd have no problem with that. -john

Be very careful. In the "modern" workplace, your employer might decide that both of you are creating a problem that they do not need or want. Very little tolerance for rocking the boat in any way. This does not seem to be your employers problem and the accused just might claim he is being harassed by his employer and a co-worker.

Take it outside.

You might find yourselves continuing this argument while standing in the unemployment line.

Mark

Sounds good. I hope you can get this resolved at the workplace level. Good luck.

qarawol said:

Hi light_emitting_dude,

I am not stating that is was stolen, merely that it was missing and now it has resurfaced.

Speaking with another LE, he stated that now the Flashlight is out in the open again, it can now be considered stolen property. I am the rightful owner and I just want it back. Since I now am making a claim to said Flashlight, which is when it will, be considered stolen property if I don't get it back because now I see it, know where it is and I should get it back.

I just sent an email to his Supervisor requesting a meeting on Wed Nov 23 2006 with all parties involved. I will update as the saga continues.

Njoy…

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